Women leading Communion Services--Does it give the wrong impression?

[turtle18]

Do you think pastoral administrators and female religious who “celebrate” Communion services are acceptable? I went to daily Mass last week, the priest had been called away so the female pastoral administrator came out and gave a Communion Service. She read the Gospel and gave the Homily, which wasn’t bad. But it was a little discomforting to see a woman up on the Altar doing many of the functions of a priest. On one hand, I’m grateful she was there so I could receive the Eucharist, but on the other hand it seemed a step away from having female deacons & priests. By the way I am am female.

 

[Leopard]

A layperson of either sex can not give a homily. He or she may read a homily perviously prepared by a priest or deacon, or he or she may offer a personal reflection on the Scriptures, but this is not the same as giving a homily.

 

[Coming_Home_1]

I know what you mean.That happened at our parish not too long ago, and I was very uncomfortable! I had my children with me and I felt that it was not a good example for them. They did not understand why there was a woman behind the altar doing things that they usually see the priest do. I did not like it at all, but a friend told me that it is accepted by the church. (still confused!)

 

[Paladin_V]

I was fortunate enough to be able to spend three weeks in Caizan, Panama on a mission trip with a group of fellow students from Catholic University. In most places in Panama, particularly the rural areas, priests are far an few between and are assigned to large groups of towns. The people of Caizan generally have mass once every three to four weeks and in the interim have a communion service lead by a person in the community who has been trained in catechesis and other things. This generally includes a reflection. The community leader is in this case a women and in many areas they are likewise women. This is a typical arrangement in most of central and south america (I forget the name of this particular arrangement).

The situation is different, granted, and not ideal, but what is correct is not relative; it is simply impossible for a priest and often even a man to have Mass or lead a communion service (as there are few priests and the men must work and cannot spare time to attend training).

I’m not advocating the women become priests (which is impossible) or saying that a lay person, man or women, can take the place of a priest, but in a communion service, which is often a necesity, particularly in other parts of the world, either a man or a women is equally adept.

 

[puzzleannie]

. She read the Gospel and gave the Homily, which wasn’t bad. But it was a little discomforting to see a woman up on the Altar .

no she did not give a homily, which is by definition the talk given by the priest or deacon after the Gospel during Mass. she gave a talk or reflection, not a homily, which is entirely permissible if she uses approved sources

if you don’t like seeing more lay people active in liturgical roles, work and pray for vocations. When lay Catholics start building strong Catholic famililies, beginning by honoring their marriage vows for life and being open to the new life God plans for them, we will start seeing more priests. As long as Catholics divorce and contracept, we will see shrinking families and damaged families who are not good soil for growing vocations.

 

[PhilotheaZ]

I wish there were enough priests so that Communion services led by the laity (male or female) were not necessary. But right now that is not the case. Pray for vocations!

While it is permitted (and sometimes necessary) for women (and lay men) to lead such a service, I agree it can lead to confusion. Here’s an example. We have a regularly scheduled Mass at a local nursing home once a week on a weekday. If the priest is called away and cannot be there, I (a woman, but I suppose the confusion could be the same with a lay man) am asked to lead a Communion service. Sometimes when I arrive some of the elderly residents ask whether I am a priest or whether I am going to “say Mass.” I have tried to explain, but it doesn’t always “stick.” Besides the confusion that sometimes accompanies old age, their confusion is increased by the fact that a female Protestant minister has often led worship services there on different days of the week.

Unfortunately, a lot of “intercommunion” (I’m not sure if that is the right word) goes on as well; some Protestants present themselves for Communion at Catholic Masses and Communion services, and some Catholics receive communion at the Protestant services. They just don’t seem to understand the difference. This happens in every nursing I have visited locally. I have brought it up to my pastor (and previous pastor), but nothing seems to be done about it.

My point is, confusion about the Eucharist and the role of the clergy is rampant. I don’t see an easy solution.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Do you think pastoral administrators and female religious who “celebrate” Communion services are acceptable? I went to daily Mass last week, the priest had been called away so the female pastoral administrator came out and gave a Communion Service. She read the Gospel and gave the Homily, which wasn’t bad. But it was a little discomforting to see a woman up on the Altar doing many of the functions of a priest. On one hand, I’m grateful she was there so I could receive the Eucharist, but on the other hand it seemed a step away from having female deacons & priests. By the way I am am female.

How we view this is important. If a Mass of obligation (Holy Day or Sunday) is suddenly unable to be celebrated because a priest has been called away, or could not arrive, is ill. A Communion Service should be conducted for the faithful already assembled. In my opinion a Communion Service should not be conducted for a daily Mass.It matters not who conducts it as long as it is conducted properly, with the right order of ministers. (available Deacon, Religious male, Instituted Male, Religious female, EMHC)
No layperson can give a homily, even at a Communion service.

 

[scylla]

Yes it gives the wrong impression and often does lead people into confusion. This should be done only in extreme circumstances, and should never be done if a priest can be made available. Even if someone has to go get the priest.
To do it out of convenience or preference is a denial of the faith and the importance of Christ\His priesthood\ministers.

Unfortunately there is a worldwide attack on the priesthood especially by those who aspire for priesthood for anybody who wants it. This leads to a discouragement of vocations a denial of the importance of the priest and an elevation of people above Christ.

Though it might be necessary, if we were authentically promoting the importance and dignity of the priesthood it wouldn’t be necessary.

God Bless
Scylla

 

[NewUlm1976_2000]

Do you think pastoral administrators and female religious who “celebrate” Communion services are acceptable? I went to daily Mass last week, the priest had been called away so the female pastoral administrator came out and gave a Communion Service. She read the Gospel and gave the Homily, which wasn’t bad. But it was a little discomforting to see a woman up on the Altar doing many of the functions of a priest. On one hand, I’m grateful she was there so I could receive the Eucharist, but on the other hand it seemed a step away from having female deacons & priests. By the way I am am female.

I think they are more than acceptable. Women are more than qualified to run communion services. Speaking on the readings is also not a bad thing. Most have the relevant spiritual/theological degrees and training to explain the readings to others.

 

[benedictgal]

In a pinch, I was asked to hold a communion service, as the priests were all on retreat during a particular weekday. It was not the most comfortable position to be in, espcially when the other EHMC who had done it the day before really made some big mistakes. There was no template to follow and some things were a bit nebulous (the Sunday Celebrations in the Absence of the Priest book didn’t help much in some respects).

Bro Rich is right regarding the daily Mass issue. However, I said yes because I wanted to turn this into a teaching moment to the other EHMC’s who were present. First of all, the EMHC leading the service should never sit in the presidential chair. Second, there are greetings and prayers that are strictly reserved for the clergy (Dominus vobiscum, etc). I did make use of the entrance anitphon and the communion antiphon and the proper prayers of the day (and no PC General Intercessions).

I got a template from a very reputable diocesan website (I want to say it was from the Diocese of Lansing, but, I don’t remember). It was very specitic was to what the laity can and cannot do.

When it came time to read the Gospel, I didn’t greet the people (Dominus vobiscum), I went straight into the reading. After I finished, I whipped out my Benedictus (Pope Benedict’s reflections for the year) and read what he wrote that corresponded to the particular day’s Gospel.

After the service ended, a friend of mine who is also an EMHC told me that what I did was different than what “sister” had taught, especially since she told them to sit at the presidential chair. I told her that as laity, we are very limited as to what we can and cannot do. Sister may have meant well, but, everyone was getting the wrong kind of instruction (including the Dominus Vobiscum).

Since then, I have made a template (based on the one from that I got from a diocesan website) and put the rubrics in red and the words in bold black print. This has actually been helpful.

Please do not think that this happens on a regular basis. It’s only once or twice a year (although the summer priest retreat does last for about a week). All other times, we do procure assistance from other priests.

 

[Paten]

How we view this is important. If a Mass of obligation (Holy Day or Sunday) is suddenly unable to be celebrated because a priest has been called away, or could not arrive, is ill. A Communion Service should be conducted for the faithful already assembled. In my opinion a Communion Service should not be conducted for a daily Mass.It matters not who conducts it as long as it is conducted properly, with the right order of ministers. (available Deacon, Religious male, Instituted Male, Religious female, EMHC)
No layperson can give a homily, even at a Communion service.

I don’t believe the Church says anywhere that non-ordained or non-instituted religious males (or females) have any preference in the liturgy over non-religious persons as they too would be EMsHC. Further, there is no preference between non-ordained/instituted male and female religious in the liturgy.

Finally, there is no direction from the Church that suggests a communion service may not take the place of (for example) a daily Mass under a multitude of situations.

 

[THurifer2]

I know what you mean.That happened at our parish not too long ago, and I was very uncomfortable! I had my children with me and I felt that it was not a good example for them. They did not understand why there was a woman behind the altar doing things that they usually see the priest do. I did not like it at all, but a friend told me that it is accepted by the church. (still confused!)

If this happened to my children and I we would leave immediately and go to the nearest availble Mass. I don’t want my children exposed to such things. I am traditionalist and I am rubbing off on my kids so things look good.

 

[THurifer2]

I have an acolyte friend who said if this ever happens to him he will “pull rank” …He is not one to back down. It would be interesting to witness…this man is very tightly wound.

 

[cmudd]

This may have been addressed already, but am I correct in understanding that a communion service is only to be performed on Sundays and/or holy days of obligation where a priest is not available to say a full mass?

I was once asked to perform one on a Saturday at a summer camp where the priest was late in getting to the site. I refused and explained why. It was a regular Saturday, the priest would be there the next day (Sunday) and we had no obligation to attend mass.

Let me know what you think.

On a side note: It seems to me that it would be confusing for youngsters to see a woman leading a communion service. It sounds like something that should be avoided.

 

[THurifer2]

This may have been addressed already, but am I correct in understanding that a communion service is only to be performed on Sundays and/or holy days of obligation where a priest is not available to say a full mass?

I was once asked to perform one on a Saturday at a summer camp where the priest was late in getting to the site. I refused and explained why. It was a regular Saturday, the priest would be there the next day (Sunday) and we had no obligation to attend mass.

Let me know what you think.

On a side note: It seems to me that it would be confusing for youngsters to see a woman leading a communion service. It sounds like something that should be avoided.

SOmeone will chime in…but I certainly heard recently that Communion services are no longer to be “routine” or even commonplace. I hope and pray that B16 will nix laypersons for “presiding” over communion services. We need to get back to the basics.

 

[benedictgal]

This may have been addressed already, but am I correct in understanding that a communion service is only to be performed on Sundays and/or holy days of obligation where a priest is not available to say a full mass?

I was once asked to perform one on a Saturday at a summer camp where the priest was late in getting to the site. I refused and explained why. It was a regular Saturday, the priest would be there the next day (Sunday) and we had no obligation to attend mass.

Let me know what you think.

On a side note: It seems to me that it would be confusing for youngsters to see a woman leading a communion service. It sounds like something that should be avoided.

Unfortunately, communion services do happen in my diocese when a parish can’t get a priest to celebrate daily Mass. It also happens when the priests all leave for an out-of-town retreat and the parishes have communion services because there aren’t enough religious order priests to satisfy the parish mass schedules.

Now, just because I did one doesn’t necessarily mean that I am in complete favor of these things. Believe me, I’ll try to get to another parish if I know ahead of time that there will be a communion service. But, in the case I cited where I had to do one, it was because the priests were all out of town during the annual retreat for diocesan clergy. And, many of our deacons do hold down regular jobs so they can’t always be available.

Would that we could celebrate the Liturgy of the Hours in lieu of a communion service. But, there is only one parish that I know of that has the books and it is staffed by religious order priests.

 

[Paten]

When I conduct a communion service there are things I take great pains to avoid which have no mention in the ritual including:

Sitting in the priest’s chair

Giving any sort of “reflection”

Use of the orans posture

Standing directly behind the altar unless absolutely necessary

Any use of humor or showmanship.

I begin each cs with a note about the time and location of the nearest Mass. I also follow the official ritual verbatim. A prayer for vocations is always part of the intentions. A CS need not be a negative experience, quite the contrary actually! Sadly pride often gets in the way, from both those conducting the CS and those who feel the need to add their own “conditions” to CSs.

 

[Paten]

This may have been addressed already, but am I correct in understanding that a communion service is only to be performed on Sundays and/or holy days of obligation where a priest is not available to say a full mass?

I was once asked to perform one on a Saturday at a summer camp where the priest was late in getting to the site. I refused and explained why. It was a regular Saturday, the priest would be there the next day (Sunday) and we had no obligation to attend mass.

Let me know what you think.

On a side note: It seems to me that it would be confusing for youngsters to see a woman leading a communion service. It sounds like something that should be avoided.

There is no directive from the Church that limits CSs to only Sundays or other holy days of obligation. Sadly that does open the use of CSs to certain abuses.

 

[jmcrae]

Do you think pastoral administrators and female religious who “celebrate” Communion services are acceptable? I went to daily Mass last week, the priest had been called away so the female pastoral administrator came out and gave a Communion Service. She read the Gospel and gave the Homily, which wasn’t bad. But it was a little discomforting to see a woman up on the Altar doing many of the functions of a priest. On one hand, I’m grateful she was there so I could receive the Eucharist, but on the other hand it seemed a step away from having female deacons & priests. By the way I am am female.

There is absolutely no danger that women will suddenly get ordained by accident, simply because they do what lay people can do. The Church doesn’t work like that. This is not the secular world, where all you have to do is prove yourself, and they pull out the CEO’s chair for you.

Women are lay people. It would be wrong to forbid women to exercise their gifts as lay people out of fear that they might become something more than they are. Remember what happened to the man who buried his own gifts; imagine what would have happened to him if he had buried his sister’s gifts. God allows women to share their gifts in the Church, and we have no call to forbid them.

These things having been said, I find communion services a little off-putting, no matter who is running them, and regardless of whether the lay person in charge were male or female, I’d still try to find a Mass to attend, instead. But it makes no difference who is running it, and an employee of the parish is probably easier to get hold of, and more likely to have read through the rules for such gatherings.

 

[Digitonomy]

What jmcrae said.

With the exception of people rather young or old and slightly senile, I don’t think it gives the wrong impression at all. It should give the impression that something is not quite right, which is correct. A man in the same position is probably more likely to give the wrong impression, as some may assume he is a priest or deacon, notwithstanding his non-clerical garb.

I have never actually attended such a service, but if called upon to lead one, I assume I would make a short remark at the introduction, that Father X couldn’t be here, and that since this is a communion service and I’m a layman, there are some things that will be different from an actual mass. That should dispel most of the wrong impressions.