Would Jesus Recognize Catholic Worship?

  • Thread starter Thread starter JimG
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
There are records of what early Church worship was like, but I’d say that it is sparce. When we see the different traditions (18 or more) within the Roman Catholic Church, we see that there was diversity amid unity, and there was consensus of belief.

We Catholics trust the lessons of Sacred Tradition (what is handed down) as reliable.

Protestants have traditions, which they don’t own up to, generally, as they attack Catholic traditions as traditions of “men.” Furthermore, Catholic experts like Dr. Scott Hahn and Fr. Mitch Pacwa attest to the verses that Protestants ignore, with respect to worship.

It is so glaringly hard to accept that most Protestant denominations reject the plain precedent of the Gospels regarding the liturgy begun at Jesus’ last Passover meal with his disciples. Somehow I think that if the precedents of that meal were merely symbolic, instead of what Jesus said they were, that would have come through from the Aramaic to the Greek of the New Testament.

Furthermore, the Catholic theology of the worship in the Mass is much more cohesive and exhaustive than Protestant versions which were derived from the preferences of the monarchs in the various countries to which the ‘reformation’ spread. Protestants don’t like to admit that influence on their faith and worship. The example most familiar to me is the forced conversion of Catholics to the Church of England under Henry VIII. The Reformation politicized Christianity to the extent that the politics overwhelmed the Christianity and Europe is predominantly non-practicing of Christian faith.

Jesus would recognize the worship of the Church He founded and promised to protect for all ages.
 
I thought you were trolling there for a minute! 😁 Fr. Longenecker, a married Anglican convert, is a great priest.
 
Jesus is God. Of course, He will recognize Catholic worship.
 
lilypadrees said:
Jesus is God. Of course, He will recognize Catholic worship.
Click to expand...
Exactly.

Of more interest to me is whether or not the Church Fathers would recognize modern Catholic worship. I suspect that some of them would run screaming out of the building.

D
 
In fact–Jesus is present (!!!) at Catholic Mass. So yes, I’d say He recognizes it. 🙂
 
The Fathers, bless them, were not infallible. For as many who might be tempted to ‘run screaming’ there would be many more who would be slapping themselves upside the head, “Yes, yes, THIS is what we were striving for”. . .
 
stpurl said:
The Fathers, bless them, were not infallible. For as many who might be tempted to ‘run screaming’ there would be many more who would be slapping themselves upside the head, “Yes, yes, THIS is what we were striving for”. . .
Click to expand...
Having read through 19 volumes of the Fathers, I rather doubt it. And while the Fathers, as individuals, are not infallible, what can you say when they’re all pretty much in agreement?

D
 
Not to correct the good Father, but the correct verb should be “does”, not “would.” Jesus is not dead, and he is present at Mass, as others point out. His point about Jewish worship is well taken.
 
Last edited:
God inspired the Book of Revelations.

So God would definitely recognize every element of the Holy Mass.
 
Perhaps the more interesting questions is the reverse; would someone who is a strong adherent to the EF recognize the earliest Church Mass?
 
Why not? The earliest Masses, so far as we have evidence, and there isn’t much, were celebrated with readings, psalms, chant, the offering of the Eucharist. . .
And the people at Mass were usually persecuted by authorities, often had little opportunity to worship, were misunderstood. . .
 
JimG said:
It sounds like you may have some particular parishes in mind.
Click to expand...
No, it’s just that Catholicity in general (including worship) is quite different in the 21st century from what it was in the 1st thru 4th centuries (I’m currently in Chrysostom, and I’ll be reading him for another year).

D
 
Dave, read this…a description from St Justin Martyr written about the year 155 to a pagan emperor who had asked him about what Christians do on the “day of the sun”.
"On the day we call the day of the sun, all who dwell in the city or country gather in the same place.
The memoirs of the apostles and the writings of the prophets are read, as much as time permits.

When the reader has finished, he who presides over those gathered admonishes and challenges them to imitate these beautiful things.

Then we all rise together and offer prayers* for ourselves . . .and for all others, wherever they may be, so that we may be found righteous by our life and actions, and faithful to the commandments, so as to obtain eternal salvation.

When the prayers are concluded we exchange the kiss.

Then someone brings bread and a cup of water and wine mixed together to him who presides over the brethren.

He takes them and offers praise and glory to the Father of the universe, through the name of the Son and of the Holy Spirit and for a considerable time he gives thanks (in Greek: eucharistian) that we have been judged worthy of these gifts.

When he has concluded the prayers and thanksgivings, all present give voice to an acclamation by saying: ‘Amen.’

When he who presides has given thanks and the people have responded, those whom we call deacons give to those present the “eucharisted” bread, wine and water and take them to those who are absent."
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
When people criticize liturgical worship they assume that Jesus was a simple, wandering preacher–a rustic carpenter from Nazareth. Jesus is the equivalent of Pastor Bob from the Backwoods Bible Church who has studied for two years at Buckboard Bible College and then set up his church. He’s a homely country man with a sincere message and a good heart. He goes in for no frills religion–prayers from the heart not out of a book. He wanders the countryside as an itinerant preacher–sort of like an old time revivalist. If he is not this, then he is a Franciscan sort of person–wandering about in tattered robes preaching to the birds and living a life of holy poverty far removed from all the pomp and ceremony of the overblown and worldly Catholic religion.
Click to expand...
That was perfectly said, in my opinion.
 
This entire thread is hypothetical - thus merely academic, subject to opinion and the potentially the cause of dissension and tumult. Yes, tumult! In any event, the proper question is: Would Jesus recognize “sola scriptura”, “Once saved always saved”, salvation by “faith alone”, “altar calls”, “Worship services”, salvation via inviting Jesus into your heart, Trinity-denying Oneness Pentecostalism, JWs, LDS, the rejection of Baptism and four of the other Sacraments that He instituted?

Yes, He certainly would recognize them - for what they are.

False teachings.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top