Would life be worth living if there was no God?

[CHRISTINE77]

I’m sorry but that’s just plain wrong.

Replacing sinning with ‘wronging’ I’ve wronged people in my life, and made up for it.
I am far from perfect, nor do I think perfection exists.
I’ve done plenty wrong in my life, mostly through ignorance which Ive rectified where I could.
I’ve asked to be forgiven plenty times.
I try and better myself every single day.

I can not speak for atheists, or atheism, but I suspect I would be right in saying a lot of people feel like me.

You’re appraisal of what you think atheists are like needs to be seriously reviewed.

Sarah x

But you think there is nothing higher than humanity.

Only God can truly forgive sins. That’s why the example of the child molester bothered you so much. You think he could never be forgiven of that sin. Once a person truly repents, and is forgiven of a grave sin, they no longer want to sin against God again. It’s the knowledge and grace of God that makes them whole again and able to go on. Otherwise they would be mired in their sins.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

An atheist doesn’t believe he/she is a sinner. They think they are perfect, and that they have never done anything wrong in their lives and that there is nothing to feel sorry for, ask forgiveness for, or to try to be better!

That’s not quite true. There are some acts that under some religions constitute a “sin” or something that is said to be prohibited by the rules handed down by a deity (ex: starting a fire between sunset on Friday and sunset on Saturday, Eating meat that wasn’t killed in a specific way). That type of “sin” is generally not meaningful to a person that is not receiving prohibitions or commandments from a deity. If you are trying to communicate with a person of no religion and use the word “sin” it’s possible the person to which you speak is considering “sin” to mean a prohibited act from a deity and might not equate it to having wronged some one.

However that doesn’t translate into a person not feeling guilty or that he/she has wrong some one or that the person has no feeling of need to ask for forgiveness. These feelings and needs are part of the human experience (or possibly part of the experience of being a social animal, as a semblence of these same needs can be found in other social animals) and are not confined to those of a specific religious disposition nor are they excluded from the experience of those that don’t follow a religion.

The only word I can think of that would match the description that you’ve provided is “sociopath.”

But you think there is nothing higher than humanity.

That’s a bit of an ambiguous question. I know that there are those that teach that humans are the “highest” (most prized) creation of the deity of their religion. But I am pretty sure you can understand that interpretation wouldn’t be meaningful to those that don’t follow a deity. So perhaps you mean something else ( ? ).

 

[CHRISTINE77]

However that doesn’t translate into a person not feeling guilty or that he/she has wrong some one or that the person has no feeling of need to ask for forgiveness.

If the one you have wronged has died, how can you ask his forgiveness? Also, people often won’t forgive other people. If you are not forgiven by that person, you carry that guilt around all your life. God can forgive, and set you free.

That’s a bit of an ambiguous question. I know that there are those that teach that humans are the “highest” (most prized) creation of the deity of their religion. But I am pretty sure you can understand that interpretation wouldn’t be meaningful to those that don’t follow a deity. So perhaps you mean something else ( ? ).

I don’t understand your question. You tell me what YOU mean by “something else”.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

If the one you have wronged has died, how can you ask his forgiveness?

To the best of my knowledge once a person has died he/she can nolonger communicate with me. Nor can I communicate with him/her.

Also, people often won’t forgive other people. If you are not forgiven by that person, you carry that guilt around all your life.

While short lived anger or guilt can have healthy consequences such feelings held over a longer term are not healthy to either individual. For this situation the most one can do is try. This means more than just asking for forgiveness and calling it a day. Forgiveness might need to be requested many times over a span of time. The need for forgiveness may need to be communicated with several gestures such as sending a gift or taking ownership of a burden that the offended person has. It also means trying to repair to the best of ones ability the damage that was done by the offense.

If you believe it is necessary to ask a deity for forgiveness by all means do so. But I hope that would not be seen as a substitute for seeking forgiveness from the offended person and seeking to repair damages.

I don’t understand your question. You tell me what YOU mean by “something else”.

When I use the phrase “something else” it is being used to represent what you intend to express by the word “higher” in the phrase “But you think there is nothing higher than humanity?]” I don’t know what your intended meaning is, so I was requesting clarification.

 

[catholictiger]

it would be worth it to try to improve the people around me bring justice to the world, and so on and so forth. My life would change drastically but I wouldn’t consider life worthless if I found out there is no God.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

To the best of my knowledge once a person has died he/she can nolonger communicate with me. Nor can I communicate with him/her.

While short lived anger or guilt can have healthy consequences such feelings held over a longer term are not healthy to either individual. For this situation the most one can do is try. This means more than just asking for forgiveness and calling it a day. Forgiveness might need to be requested many times over a span of time. The need for forgiveness may need to be communicated with several gestures such as sending a gift or taking ownership of a burden that the offended person has. It also means trying to repair to the best of ones ability the damage that was done by the offense.

If you believe it is necessary to ask a deity for forgiveness by all means do so. But I hope that would not be seen as a substitute for seeking forgiveness from the offended person and seeking to repair damages.

When I use the phrase “something else” it is being used to represent what you intend to express by the word “higher” in the phrase “But you think there is nothing higher than humanity?]” I don’t know what your intended meaning is, so I was requesting clarification.

Do you think there is something higher than humanity, and if so, what?

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Do you think there is something higher than humanity, and if so, what?

As mentioned before “higher” in this context is not something that has meaning to me. If you could present a meaning then I may be able to give an answer.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

As mentioned before “higher” in this context is not something that has meaning to me. If you could present a meaning then I may be able to give an answer.

Okay Mr. Spock, so you think man is the measure of all things?

To me there is God’s law and man’s law, and sometimes they entertwine and sometimes they don’t.

Take the story of the adultress. She would have been stoned to death by men’s laws, but Jesus told the crowd:" who among you is without sin, cast the first stone", and then to her: “Where are they that condemn you? Neither do I condemn you, go and sin no more.”

People get put in prison for many sins, and some for just civil crimes or crimes against the State. Some people are condemned wrongly by the courts.

However, some sins are not illegal in the human court system, yet they are immoral in God’s eyes. It’s a higher system.

 

[BobCatholic]

Is life worth living when God hates or curses someone?

No.

Same if there was no God. Life would not be worth living.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Okay Mr. Spock, so you think man is the measure of all things?

I’m afraid that the quote by Protagoras doesn’t clear things up any for me.

…]Take the story of the adultress. She would have been stoned to death by men’s laws, …]

I thought that was Yahweh’s law.

Leviticus 20:10 “And the man that committeth adultery with another man’s wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death”.

However, some sins are not illegal in the human court system, yet they are immoral in God’s eyes.

So I’ve heard.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

I thought that was Yahweh’s law.

Leviticus 20:10 “And the man that committeth adultery with another man’s wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death”..

I’m a Christian, not a Jew. Jesus took away the old laws.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

I’m a Christian, not a Jew. Jesus took away the old laws.

I’m not questioning your stated religion, but highlighting that the above mentioned law which was labeled as “man’s law” can also be labeled as “Yahweh’s law” since the law is said to have come from the judeo-christian god.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

I’m not questioning your stated religion, but highlighting that the above mentioned law which was labeled as “man’s law” can also be labeled as “Yahweh’s law” since the law is said to have come from the judeo-christian god.

Actually, I spoke too soon in my last post. Adultery is a grave sin, but it can be forgiven by God. However, it is not a crime in today’s society. You can’t go to jail for it. But you can gravely hurt others by committing it, as well as yourself.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Actually, I spoke too soon in my last post. Adultery is a grave sin, but it can be forgiven by God. However, it is not a crime in today’s society. You can’t go to jail for it. But you can gravely hurt others by committing it, as well as yourself.

If a married individual has sexual intercourse with a person other then the lawful spouse it could constitude a civil offense (like a breach of contract). Whether or not it does is up to the individuals involved in the marriage. There are some cases where it has not. One such scenario was when a couple wanted to have a child but the intended father was found to be sterile. The couple decided to have a child by the husband’s brother and it is far cheaper to conceive a child through sex than pay the 12,000+ USD for an artificial conception.

 

[PumpkinSeed]

An atheist doesn’t believe he/she is a sinner. They think they are perfect, and that they have never done anything wrong in their lives and that there is nothing to feel sorry for, ask forgiveness for, or to try to be better!

Atheists still understand right from wrong. They just don’t think there is a God to judge them for it. And while they believe they won’t have to follow God’s law, they still have to follow government law.

Atheists don’t seem them selves as cocky people who are perfect. Ive never once seen an atheist say they are perfect. They know right from wrong just as you and I do. They just don’t believe in a God.

I don’t know why you seem to think Atheists are incapable of basic thought.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Atheists still understand right from wrong. They just don’t think there is a God to judge them for it. And while they believe they won’t have to follow God’s law, they still have to follow government law.

Atheists don’t seem them selves as cocky people who are perfect. Ive never once seen an atheist say they are perfect. They know right from wrong just as you and I do. They just don’t believe in a God.

I don’t know why you seem to think Atheists are incapable of basic thought.

I want to take a moment to say that I appreciate your understanding disposition.

 

[BobCatholic]

Atheists still understand right from wrong. They just don’t think there is a God to judge them for it. And while they believe they won’t have to follow God’s law, they still have to follow government law.

Atheists don’t seem them selves as cocky people who are perfect. Ive never once seen an atheist say they are perfect. They know right from wrong just as you and I do. They just don’t believe in a God.

I don’t know why you seem to think Atheists are incapable of basic thought.

I think you did not address his first sentence, which is true.

Atheists do not believe they are sinners. In order to be a sinner, you must sin. In order to sin, you have to offend God by doing evil. Since they believe there is no God, there is nobody to offend by evil, and therefore no sin and therefore they are not sinners.

 

[atheistgirl]

I think you did not address his first sentence, which is true.

It’s only true if you are dealing with a narrow theological perspective.

In order to sin, you have to offend God by doing evil.

No, not exclusively.

Other definitions include:

*any serious offence, as against a religious or moral principle

any offence against a principle or standard*

As Atheists have moral principles, and recognize principles and standards, it’s perfectly possible for Atheists to be sinners. Just not in a theological sense.

Sarah x

 

[PumpkinSeed]

I think you did not address his first sentence, which is true.

Atheists do not believe they are sinners. In order to be a sinner, you must sin. In order to sin, you have to offend God by doing evil. Since they believe there is no God, there is nobody to offend by evil, and therefore no sin and therefore they are not sinners.

Atheists don’t think there is a God tracking their 'right and wrong’s, but atheists know right from wrong and are still capable of doing each. They know morally whats right and wrong.

You don’t need a God to tell you right from wrong. Its taught to you by parents, family, school, society, ect. Mostly parents.

 

[BobCatholic]

Atheists don’t think there is a God tracking their 'right and wrong’s, but atheists know right from wrong and are still capable of doing each. They know morally whats right and wrong.

You don’t need a God to tell you right from wrong. Its taught to you by parents, family, school, society, ect. Mostly parents.

I only commented on the term “sin” and “sinner” - you will notice I made no comments about “right and wrong” concerning atheists.