Would you accept a son playing with dolls?

[ToeInTheWater]

Raise your sons to be kind and considerate, and when they grow up they will be willing to help change diapers and do their part around the house.

But apparently they don’t need to actually know how to do that, until their wives teach them how?

Do you also think that when fathers take care of their children they are “baby-sitting” them?

I do hope none of your sons wind up as single parents.

ETA: And I don’t mean that as a personal insult, I just mean that the idea that men don’t really need to know how to take care of kids, because the womenfolk will always do it for them is not always a realistic one.

 

[BoomBoomMancini]

The reason it used to be reversed was a holdover from humor theory. Men were red, so boys were light red. Women were blue, so girls were light blue.

Blue is still a color associated with Mary.

Ah, interesting. Didn’t know that.

 

[UbiCaritas]

You are correct, I was thinking of just the question in the thread title. You response was relevant to the last two sentences in the OP

It seems its a small step from considering the behavior " of the ways we develop empathy for people " or as others posters have said “I think its sweet”. A small enough step that it sounds like encouragement to me.

And I never said get hysterical about anything.

Raise your sons to be kind and considerate, and when they grow up they will be willing to help change diapers and do their part around the house.
For heaven’s sake, take your boys out to play ball, teach them how to do wood working, teach them to change the oil in the car, go hunting and fishing with them. And while your at it, make them clean the kitchen and keep their room clean. There is no need to continue a gender neutral society. Would I be concerned if my son was playing with dolls? Yes, I would. What would I do? I don’t know, none of my sons ever did, they were to busy being boys.

But I will let all of ya’ll have the last say, I am a old-fashioned male chauvinist, I get it.

Well, put it this way. One of the most traditionalist priests I ever met–the guy didn’t think there was hardly ever a reason to use NFP, thought all wives and moms should always stay home, etc–even said during a sermon once that men should know how to cook, clean, and take care of kids because even in the very traditional marriage design he suggested, there will be some point at which half the family, mom included, has the flu, and someone, read Dad, will need to change diapers and make something other than PBJs for a week, and not feel that it’s somehow something that “only” his wife, who currently has a 103-degree fever and can barely walk to the bathroom, can do.

I would love for my daughter to marry someone who can do woodworking and home and auto repairs and whatnot, just as I would love for my son to marry a woman who’s a very good homemaker. That doesn’t mean they will, though, and someone can be a very good spouse without necessarily knowing how to do skills that are often assigned to a given gender. DH is anything but mechanically minded. His brain just doesn’t work that way. I, however, am. So I do things like repair the toilets and replace the pump on the washing machine. Would it be better for us to drop hundreds of dollars every time something like that breaks rather than have me fix it? Neither DH nor I think so.

Once the kids are old enough, I’ll be having them partner with me on alternating weeks as my helper, and they’ll be expected to both know how to knock out a month’s worth of healthy, budget-friendly freezer meals in an afternoon and to pressure-wash the driveway. Maybe they won’t use those skills a lot as adults, but worst case scenario, they’ll have 'em. I think it’s far more unusual for someone to say “oh dear, I do wish I didn’t know how to do basic plumbing repairs!” than the opposite.

 

[heidi_storage]

I believe in accepting innate differences between the sexes, and not trying to make boys do “girl” things and girls do “boy” things. That said, I think it’s beneficial to boys to play with dolls, at least when they’re very young. Having a “pretend human” can help develop the boy’s speech, imagination, and empathy (though we mustn’t be distressed if the boy treats his doll in a way that would get CPS called on him if he were an actual parent). Boys with older sisters often play with dolls, and go on to develop in a perfectly normal, masculine way.

Has anyone ever read a story by Saki, “The Toys of Peace”? A mother and uncle get some “pacifist” figurines and buildings for two little boys to play with; the boys, of course, immediately convert them to soldiers and forts. A very funny story. Saki had a rather jaundiced view of children, but I think also had some penetrating insights into the psychology of children. See “The Lumber Room,” “The Storyteller,” “The Penance,” and “Sredni Vashtar.”

 

[macstar]

endeavors to get more girls to consider STEM fields are justified

planning on becoming a nurse.

Regarding STEM: great advances were made by Ada Lovelace (computers) and double Nobel prize winner Marie Curie. Imagine if they hadn’t followed their God-given talents and abilities! Remember the parable of the talents. Everyone- not just men- will have to give an account of how they used the gifts God gave them.

The majority of nurses prior to the Civil War were men. Today, 50% of medical school students are women.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

Yea, but I think action figures and dinosaurs are not what the OP had in mind. It becomes a rather mute question if that is the case.
As for boys playing with “girl dolls”, for lack of a better term. I would have a definite problem with it. Bad idea.

The church does not forbid lots of thinks that are not in the least bit wise under most circumstances. That is irrelevant to the original post. I consider it next to idiocy to allow/encourage a son to do female role playing,. Our society has truly con stark raving mad. The church does not forbid smoking, so I am going to let my kid do that?

My youngest son will be scarred for life because when he was 3 he was my daughter’s bridesmaid when she was playing bride. Blue dress and all. I should make sure he goes hunting.

 

[tafan]

Well, put it this way. One of the most traditionalist priests I ever met–the guy didn’t think there was hardly ever a reason to use NFP, thought all wives and moms should always stay home, etc–even said during a sermon once that men should know how to cook, clean, and take care of kids because even in the very traditional marriage design he suggested, there will be some point at which half the family, mom included, has the flu, and someone, read Dad, will need to change diapers and make something other than PBJs for a week, and not feel that it’s somehow something that “only” his wife, who currently has a 103-degree fever and can barely walk to the bathroom, can do.

Ok, I know I said I was out of here, but I can’t help myself.
Which is completely unrelated to boys playing with dolls. I spent the first 20 years of my marriage cooking on weekends, always did my share of changing diapers, etc. Ended up having to take care of the kids and the house all by myself for an extended period of time. the priest is obviously correct. Guess what, men figure it out. And there is nothing wrong with teaching you son how to cook. My boys certainly take a lot of interest in my cooking. Boys in college have to learn how to do laundry. And none of us ever had to play with dolls or do any type of female role-playing.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

??
Lots of boys have dolls…hence, the “Ken” doll or “GI Joe” etc.
And lots of girls love to play with trains and cars. Being a wife or mother has nothing to do with liking to play with trains or cars. Females drive when they grow up, too, so an interest in cars is not gender-specific. I loved playing with trains and cars, etc.

Huh?
*How do you define “tomboy”? * I didn’t even think people used this term anymore since it doesn’t apply anymore. Today, girls who like to play sports, for example, are just…girls who likes to play sports.

And…why wouldn’t someone be fine with their son becoming a nurse? Some people, both men and women, would rather be a nurse than a doctor for several reasons.

This question baffles me.
Why would someone not let their son play with a doll?
A lot of it has to do with imagination and stories, as another poster said.

And even if the doll is a “baby” doll rather than an adult doll…how can that even be harmful, since it would actually be preparation for fatherhood?
I would imagine, since the Catholic faith is very pro-family and pro-lots of kids, that Catholic parents would actually* encourage* boys to play with dolls, including baby dolls.

Catholic fathers change diapers too, don’t they?

.

My son is interested in health care, and nursing might be one of the venues he chooses. There are lots of male nurses these days.

 

[tafan]

My youngest son will be scarred for life because when he was 3 he was my daughter’s bridesmaid when she was playing bride. Blue dress and all. I should make sure he goes hunting.

Regardless of his experience when he was three, getting him to go hunting would be a good thing. I would consider it if I was you. (note: no emoticon on this post).

 

[BoomBoomMancini]

Ok, I know I said I was out of here, but I can’t help myself.
Which is completely unrelated to boys playing with dolls. I spent the first 20 years of my marriage cooking on weekends, always did my share of changing diapers, etc. Ended up having to take care of the kids and the house all by myself for an extended period of time. the priest is obviously correct. Guess what, men figure it out. And there is nothing wrong with teaching you son how to cook. My boys certainly take a lot of interest in my cooking. Boys in college have to learn how to do laundry. And none of us ever had to play with dolls or do any type of female role-playing.

I don’t really disagree with you as far as the big picture goes, but in my experience it’s not unusual for kids to go through weird phases which they then grow out of. I just wouldn’t want to overcorrect for something that could resolve itself on its own in a few weeks.

 

[tafan]

I don’t really disagree with you as far as the big picture goes, but in my experience it’s not unusual for kids to go through weird phases which they then grow out of. I just wouldn’t want to overcorrect for something that could resolve itself on its own in a few weeks.

That I agree with. I am a pretty lazzaire-faire parent. But I would be concerned, and certainly take him out and do more “boy” type things with him.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

My son is interested in health care, and nursing might be one of the venues he chooses. There are lots of male nurses these days.

Yep! And there should be. Men and women are different, and a male nurse will relate to patients differently. When my husband was in cancer treatment, the best experience he had was with a nurse a few years older than him who helped on the bone marrow biopsy. They both played bass guitar and had a passion for comedy. For a few hours, my sick 25 year old husband just felt normal and relatable. The female nurses were just a little more doting (which is also great).

The nurse loved his job. He was a BSN and made great money working in a research hospital.

 

[UbiCaritas]

Ok, I know I said I was out of here, but I can’t help myself.
Which is completely unrelated to boys playing with dolls. I spent the first 20 years of my marriage cooking on weekends, always did my share of changing diapers, etc. Ended up having to take care of the kids and the house all by myself for an extended period of time. the priest is obviously correct. Guess what, men figure it out. And there is nothing wrong with teaching you son how to cook. My boys certainly take a lot of interest in my cooking. Boys in college have to learn how to do laundry. And none of us ever had to play with dolls or do any type of female role-playing.

But my point is: why is playing with dolls “female role playing,” if taking care of a baby is something one should expect a father to do from time to time?

If he’s getting dressed up in sexualized women’s clothing and acting strangely, that’s certainly a cause for concern, but I hardly think that giving a baby doll a bottle or putting it in a stroller is a cause for concern. Again, I pretended to be Robin Hood for quite a lot of my childhood because who wouldn’t rather shoot arrows and have quarterstaff fights than sit around and do embroidery, which is what Maid Marian seemed to spend most of her time doing. Doesn’t mean that I didn’t grow up to be a very, very feminine woman (seriously: I wear a full face of makeup when I go in for my kids’ C-sections!) who can replace a washing machine pump as well as she can cook a killer boeuf bourguignon with a baby on one hip. Which is to say, very well indeed.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

I don’t really disagree with you as far as the big picture goes, but in my experience it’s not unusual for kids to go through weird phases which they then grow out of. I just wouldn’t want to overcorrect for something that could resolve itself on its own in a few weeks.

Yeah, telling a kid who doesn’t have a grasp on sex or gender yet that some innocuous play is unacceptable because he’s a boy sounds like a recipe for confusion, tension, and a loss of innocence.

And even if your kid does grow us to be gasp gay, rest assured there’s nothing you could have done as far as childhood toys and imagination time goes to prevent that. Dolls won’t make boys gay or effeminate, and hunting trips won’t do anything to solidify straightness.

 

[EasterJoy]

Ok, I know I said I was out of here, but I can’t help myself.
Which is completely unrelated to boys playing with dolls. I spent the first 20 years of my marriage cooking on weekends, always did my share of changing diapers, etc. Ended up having to take care of the kids and the house all by myself for an extended period of time. the priest is obviously correct. Guess what, men figure it out. And there is nothing wrong with teaching you son how to cook. My boys certainly take a lot of interest in my cooking. Boys in college have to learn how to do laundry. And none of us ever had to play with dolls or do any type of female role-playing.

I hope no one is suggesting that parents should push their children into play or leisure activities that the child never showed any interest in pursuing. If you hunt or fish, take your child hunting and fishing. If they don’t like it, though, you should eventually give it up and accept that your children won’t have all the same interests that you do.

If your son doesn’t show any interest in baby dolls, there is no reason to try to interest him in it, since that isn’t something a typical boy will feel you “should” have given him when he looks back on his childhood. If he doesn’t like throwing balls, let him be. If your child does not want to play with trucks, he’ll be OK.

Is there anything you should push your child into doing? Yes.

You should push your children into play that involves getting up and getting moving. If they don’t like to move, chase them around yourself. If you love baseball and your son loves soccer or swimming, though, let the kid play soccer or swim instead of learning to throw a ball. (Yes, even if he has a killer fastball.)

You should push your children into expecting themselves to contribute to the work that needs to be done to run a household. You do not have to force them to be the one who usually vacuums if they hate vacuuming when they don’t mind emptying the dishwasher or walking the dog or enjoy other tasks that have to be done, but they ought to know how to do whatever needs doing and they should eventually expect to make themselves do it.

You should push your child into spending time reading. If it is decent, it doesn’t matter what your children like to read, but children who read will grow up into young people with more options in life.

You should push your child into using good manners. This includes being able to talk to people they do not know particularly well enough to be hospitable, it includes socializing in the absence of any electronic crutches without showing discomfort, it includes remaining in one’s chair for the duration of an entire meal, and it includes knowing what polite people do and do not say in social situations.

You should push your child into wearing clothing appropriate for his or her gender and the situation he or she is in. Yes, provide formal clothes that are comfortable, but a child should not expect to be able to wear exercise clothing everywhere he goes. (I’m not one who thinks a child should be wearing a Halloween costume to the grocery store, but I wouldn’t make that a universal rule of parenting. That one could be “just me,” LOL; I don’t think parents who allow that are “bad parents.”)

I’m sure there are more…any other suggestions?

 

[tafan]

But my point is: why is playing with dolls “female role playing,” if taking care of a baby is something one should expect a father to do from time to time?

Its not necessarily, I mentioned female role playing because another poster brought it up as behavior in boys that helps them develop empathy. So I have kind of combined the two. OTOH certainly continually playing with baby or girl dolls does seem quite close to female role playing, which is probably why EasterJoy suggested it.

 

[EasterJoy]

Its not necessarily, I mentioned female role playing because another poster brought it up as behavior in boys that helps them develop empathy. So I have kind of combined the two. OTOH certainly continually playing with baby or girl dolls does seem quite close to female role playing, which is probably why EasterJoy suggested it.

Actually, I only meant that I wouldn’t worry too much if your kids “put on a wedding” and the boys are sometimes stuck being a bridesmaid or the girls are stuck being the father of the bride once in awhile. That isn’t something I’d read a lot into. It won’t kill a child to be in a role that doesn’t fit anything they’ll “be when they grow up.”

 

[tafan]

I hope no one is suggesting that parents should push their children into play or leisure activities that the child never showed any interest in pursuing. If you hunt or fish, take your child hunting and fishing. If they don’t like it, though, you should eventually give it up and accept that your children won’t have all the same interests that you do.

Jeeze, you people are a real trip. I brought a whole list of activities to do with boys, of which hunting and fishing was one. Where did I ever imply they should be pushed into an activity they have no interest in pursuing?

 

[Arizona_Fat_Gir]

When I was a kid, I had a younger brother, and then a sister, who was the baby of the family. I loved babies. I had dolls, but wanted one that looked like a real baby. My grandmother bought me a lifelike doll for Christmas…and guess what?

My brother wouldn’t give the doll to me. He insisted on playing with it. (I guess because it was so lifelike.) It was my doll, but it was a whole year before I got it back. He was far from girly since he wanted to be a fireman when he grew up. Kids don’t always think about gender when they take a liking to something.

I loved trains, and I wanted an electric train of my own, but never got one. The train I got was a wooden one in bright colors, pulled by a cord to make it go.

 

[violetgreen]

Of course it’s okay for boys to play with dolls, even as it is okay for men to become pediatricians, pediatric nurses, fathers, and so on. Boys probably SHOULD play with dolls.

As boys get older they start to be more aware of social gender differences and to shun “feminine” pastimes and toys. This is called gender cleavage, and it starts around third or fourth grade, as I recall. Not sure.

After awhile, boys hesitate to do activities in which girls also participate. Girl cooties.

Band and orchestra in schools are mostly girls these days, as are ROTC, the debate club, and other formerly male bastions.

This never quite goes away, it seems to me. Which is why I advocate only male altar boys and lectors. So boys will enter the priesthood, is what I mean, so it has the masculine cachet. But that is probably another thread. A real long one, lol. Be good if this could change but I don’t know that’s possible.