Would you consider this abusive or extreme?

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This is a very common manipulation tactic. People do it because they know putting themselves down is likely to make you want to reassure them about their good points (which, in turn, reminds you about their good points) The fact he is prone to blaming others is a red flag that it’s just one of his tools to manipulate you (people who have poor self-esteem are more likely to blame themselves for something that’s not their fault than to blame someone else for something that is their own doing)

A verbally abusive ex-boyfriend of mine used to pull the old “I’m worthless. I’m not good enough for you. You deserve so much better than me” card. He knew he’d be able to guilt me into falling into a protective, reassuring caretaker role if he did. Like you, for a long time I assumed he would have to think very little of himself to say things like that.

Well, come the messy end of our relationship, I’d had enough and the last time he ever tried the “I’m no good, etc. etc.” tactic- I agreed with him. I outright told him, “You’re right. I do deserve better than being insulted, belittled, and screamed at constantly. If you can’t treat me like a human being then, no, you aren’t good enough for me.” It was like I’d flipped a light switch and he immediately changed to ranting about how lucky I was to have someone like him and how, if I left, I’d never be able to find another boyfriend who would do the things for me that he did. Turns out his self-esteem was just fine and, like all manipulators, when one psychological ploy stopped working he just moved on to the next.
Very true it took me years to learn that. Luckily my parents had a good marriage with respect for each other even though they did fight and have short tempers at times they never belittled each other or physically raised a hand or tried to humiliate the other. I had a good example of a healthy relationship in front of me with 2 people who were adult enought to control it and work together not against the other person
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Yes, you should protect your interests I think. This does mean he has to step up to a more responsible mind-frame.
We can’t change our spouses but we can influence them by the way we react.

I can tell you that the early years with my husband were often horrible and miserable for me, but he has grown into a much kinder more thoughtful man. It can happen.
Many people, including family, though we wouldn’t last, and even that we shouldn’t.
It’s 95% better than it was in the early years.
For this I thank God, and am grateful that despite the pain, where I used to cry privately every day, but I gradually found strength and wisdom, he’s a nice, kind man now.

Maybe by changing things in finding your own strength you can help him gradually to grow into the man you’d hoped you w
ere marrying.

God grant that
Trish
👍👍

When my husband was unemployed he WAS miserable and said miserable things and did things like look at things we could not afford. It really can get better. My husband is an amazing father and husband but he really needs the outlet of work outside home.

Mega since we know about your work hours I really cannot imagine any other scenario then hubby getting custody and you weekends. Unless you plan on live in babysitters. Instead of therapy he needs a job. Will he consider a regular ( not freelance) job outside the home?
 
Well, I asked him yesterday if he could continue on doing freelance and make a certain amount per month. It is the threshold amount for us to survive under our current circumstances. He said that’s a “great goal”. I said but it can’t be just a great goal. It has to happen or we must move etc. He said he “thinks” he can do that…

I asked him last week to look for a job too. He has yet to apply for one.

I’m considering telling him today that I want to move. Again it would be our 4th move in 8 months. So he’s against it for our son and I hate the idea of doing it myself. But we can’t live this close financially anymore.

I know he will forbid us from moving again… And if I say too bad… I won’t hear the end of it.
 
Well, I asked him yesterday if he could continue on doing freelance and make a certain amount per month. It is the threshold amount for us to survive under our current circumstances. He said that’s a “great goal”. I said but it can’t be just a great goal. It has to happen or we must move etc. He said he “thinks” he can do that…

I asked him last week to look for a job too. He has yet to apply for one.

I’m considering telling him today that I want to move. Again it would be our 4th move in 8 months. So he’s against it for our son and I hate the idea of doing it myself. But we can’t live this close financially anymore.

I know he will forbid us from moving again… And if I say too bad… I won’t hear the end of it.
Where do you stand with the lawyer on a separation?
 
Well, I asked him yesterday if he could continue on doing freelance and make a certain amount per month. It is the threshold amount for us to survive under our current circumstances. He said that’s a “great goal”. I said but it can’t be just a great goal. It has to happen or we must move etc. He said he “thinks” he can do that…

I asked him last week to look for a job too. He has yet to apply for one.

I’m considering telling him today that I want to move. Again it would be our 4th move in 8 months. So he’s against it for our son and I hate the idea of doing it myself. But we can’t live this close financially anymore.

I know he will forbid us from moving again… And if I say too bad… I won’t hear the end of it.
Ooh, your son has had a lot of turmoil; it would really be best not to move, if you can help it. Here’s hoping the two of you can work things out in a loving, mutual manner.
 
Well, to answer your question: I have been so close to asking for a separation and then I get scared again. I talked to a lawyer and I can file but he says that since my husband is spending so much time w my son that I would at the maximum get 50/50. And it’s possible that I wouldn’t even get that.

This terrifies me. I feel like I need a master plan. Someone who can come to me and say you should do xyz …

I have prayed about this. And everytime I do that I come out thinking God would want me to forgive and not cause further pain or chaos. So it is difficult…

But my therapist says… First: you need to rip the band aid. And second: she says she thinks when I get to a better place I will look back and just freak out over what I lived through.
Where do you stand with the lawyer on a separation?
 
Well, to answer your question: I have been so close to asking for a separation and then I get scared again. I talked to a lawyer and I can file but he says that since my husband is spending so much time w my son that I would at the maximum get 50/50. And it’s possible that I wouldn’t even get that.

This terrifies me. I feel like I need a master plan. Someone who can come to me and say you should do xyz …

I have prayed about this. And everytime I do that I come out thinking God would want me to forgive and not cause further pain or chaos. So it is difficult…

But my therapist says… First: you need to rip the band aid. And second: she says she thinks when I get to a better place I will look back and just freak out over what I lived through.
First, you and the lawyer are assuming he will continue to stay at home. This is NOT the case. Once you are separated and in process of divorce he will HAVE to get a job. Which means he will have less time with your son AND that you’d have grounds to go back and have the custody arrangement modified.

No, I am pretty sure God does NOT want you allowing this man to continue ruining you socially and financially while providing an abusive and poor example for your child. Not to mention the mess he’s made at the IRS and the fact that he’s using your household bank account money to pay for equipment for a business that isn’t and probably never will be turning a profit. Because turning a profit requires discipline and hard work. Neither of which your husband is interested in.

If you cannot afford this place, move. STOP letting him throw fits and get you to sign leases you cannot afford to pay alone since he has already long since established he has zero desire to actually maintain some kind of employment.
 
MJJean is right. Even if your husband was awarded some spousal support from you, if would only be for a limited time. The court would expect that your husband, a young man in his early 40’s, would get himself a job. Even stay-at-home-moms who are divorced are only given alimony for a specific amount of time (child support, yes) so that they can prepare themselves to reenter the work force. No judge is going to be sympathetic to a gown man who doesn’t want to work. I wouldn’t be too concerned about that. I hope that you have kept a diary of your husband’s abusive outbursts and behaviors that are destructive of your financial security. Being able to describe his actions, date by date, may be very useful to you.
 
So I told my husband today that I can’t keep up this schedule. Me always working and him doing freelance. I suggested that we both do this freelance work (we work in same industry) and he get a full time gig to support us during the transition.

I said we could move into an apt and just build from there. His suggestion? Asking his elderly parents if they would use their retirement to support us while we build the biz together. When I said no! He suggested I ask my Mom.
 
  • I feel like I need a master plan. Someone who can come to me and say you should do xyz …*
The thing is, you have to be the one to create the master plan. No one can do this for you.
 
So I told my husband today that I can’t keep up this schedule. Me always working and him doing freelance. I suggested that we both do this freelance work (we work in same industry) and he get a full time gig to support us during the transition.

I said we could move into an apt and just build from there. His suggestion? Asking his elderly parents if they would use their retirement to support us while we build the biz together. When I said no! He suggested I ask my Mom.
Proving once again that YOU are the one who is going to have to do something. Even if you don’t care enough about what he’s doing to you, what about your son? He’s growing up thinking that the way his father treats his mother is normal. Is that what you want?
 
It seems that I have trouble seeing things from an objective perspective. I think well, you knew that you would have the salary advantage when you married him… So this is your fault (my) fault for being the go getter and then now expecting him to be the $$$$ maker.

But, regardless of that, the conversations we have had have not been supportive. Me saying … Hey … I want to quit my job and work freelance and really change my work hours/ requirements… And his response? Well if you did that… We’d have to ask your mother or my parents to support us since we don’t have a cushion. He then said “at least I’m eligble for bankruptcy” … He then pointed out that we wouldn’t be able to break our lease and that I’d have to pay 3k back to my employer if I broke my contract and left employment early.

He said “the unfortunate thing is your skills and talent will be more profitable than mine, so I will never be able to make your income.”

I told him that while he was gone this weekend, I wanted him to come up with a game plan to allow me to work less etc… His immediate response? The game plan is me cashing into 401k and even though it is only 10k… We live on that until you become profitable in your new business.

So… It is all on me. You are right. And I’m tired… So tired of working my life away.
 
Again, your husband is trying to put it all on you. So what, if your skills are more profitable? It doesn’t excuse him from working and it doesn’t mean that you have to be the one to work all the time simply because you can earn more money.

As far as breaking a lease is concerned, look at your lease terms. Some leases can be broken by paying a lease break fee and then are not responsible for any further rent. Even if there isn’t a lease break fee, the landlord still has the obligation to mitigate their damages and find another renter so they can’t just charge you all the rest of the lease until it expires and live on your money while the place is empty. Look at your state’s laws on this.

No way should you have to cash in your 401k. The husband needs to come up with a game plan as to how he is going to earn money and not put it all on you.
 
Yeah, see that’s the problem. He won’t. He just looks to his parents or my Mother (who he once wanted to sue) for the bail out.

Tonight he called me and told me that he wanted all of us to move across the country to live near his parents.

Then he asked me to call a wealthy friend of mine and see if he would invest in a project that could bring in business. I told him that I couldn’t because of various reasons. He just cut the call short and got off the phone.

This is all very scary. But it is getting far more obvious now even to ME. That has not been easy. But asking his elderly and barely financially stable parents to fund US? That was his answer to me leaving my current job and taking pay cut.
 
Yeah, see that’s the problem. He won’t. He just looks to his parents or my Mother (who he once wanted to sue) for the bail out.

Tonight he called me and told me that he wanted all of us to move across the country to live near his parents.

Then he asked me to call a wealthy friend of mine and see if he would invest in a project that could bring in business. I told him that I couldn’t because of various reasons. He just cut the call short and got off the phone.

This is all very scary. But it is getting far more obvious now even to ME. That has not been easy. But asking his elderly and barely financially stable parents to fund US? That was his answer to me leaving my current job and taking pay cut.
Sometimes making a change is scarey and we can’t ever depend on others to be our coach or have a masterplan. We need to do our own master plan. Your lawyer and couselor can help but at the end of the day it’s really up to you. You have to come to place within yourself where you have the confidence to do this. Weather is involves your husband is up to you. The fact that he refuses to take any responsibility and support himself it very troubling and should speak volumes to you but it’s your life and your sons life we can’t make the choices for you. He seems desparate to me like he realizes he’s losing his meal ticket he’s just to egotisicaly and immature to see beyond himself. If you do leave just make sure you know where the money is and have a separation plan to cover you and keep his and your expenses separate. I don’t think you need to worry so much on the custody. Mothers are still favored and a dad who doesn’t want to work is a common problem that judges are aware of.
 
I do want to post that I had 4 days by myself and I did miss my son but overall I feel calmer and more at peace. They come home tonight…

The good news here is I had been drinking wine. A lot. Like nearly 3 to 4 glasses a night. Well I can say I didn’t drink while they were gone. I kept myself busy and really worked to adjust my health and habits.

That’s saying something, right?
 
I’ve read all the posts in this thread.

Listen - this guy is a bum. He is adding NO value to your life or your son’s life.

Do you think your son is happy? The only reason he might be is that the situation isn’t as bad as it was before - but that doesn’t mean it’s good or healthy for him. Or that his happiness is real.

When you finally leave, you will look back at all this time and want to kick yourself for being indecisive and wasting all this time.
 
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