Would you support mandatory tracking devices on all new cars?

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Tracking devices? You’re kidding me.

(In fact, the very idea of an “OnStar” type capability is one of the main reasons why I will never buy a General Motors vehicle…I do not care for a “big brother” capability)
Ford has Sync. And all cars…no matter the make will have full electronics. The parts (repair) are now plug and play. The days of the shade tree do it yourself mechanic are over. If the electronics on your car are bad…it will not be drivable. Note when you take your car in for maintenance. …the first thing they do is hook it up to a diagnostic machine.

Way too much “big brother”…
 
Tracking devices? You’re kidding me.

(In fact, the very idea of an “OnStar” type capability is one of the main reasons why I will never buy a General Motors vehicle…I do not care for a “big brother” capability)
See post #63.

LOVE! 🙂
 
See post #63.

LOVE! 🙂
[BIBLEDRB]Acts 5:29[/BIBLEDRB]

Robert, I wonder whether you would support such a verse if a hypothetical ultra-libertarian government was elected that utterly eliminated all social assistance to the poor? Or a totalitarian government was elected and given an enabling act that allowed them to hunt down and shoot all Catholics on sight?

And from the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace:

** 400. **Recognizing that natural law is the basis for and places limits on positive law means admitting that it is legitimate to resist authority should it violate in a serious or repeated manner the essential principles of natural law. Saint Thomas Aquinas writes that “one is obliged to obey … insofar as it is required by the order of justice”.[823] Natural law is therefore the basis of the right to resistance.

There can be many different concrete ways this right may be exercised; there are also many different ends that may be pursued. Resistance to authority is meant to attest to the validity of a different way of looking at things, whether the intent is to achieve partial change, for example, modifying certain laws, or to fight for a radical change in the situation.
**
401. **The Church’s social doctrine indicates the criteria for exercising the right to resistance: “Armed resistance to oppression by political authority is not legitimate, unless all the following conditions are met: 1) there is certain, grave and prolonged violation of fundamental rights, 2) all other means of redress have been exhausted, 3) such resistance will not provoke worse disorders, 4) there is well-founded hope of success; and 5) it is impossible reasonably to foresee any better solution”.[824] Recourse to arms is seen as an extreme remedy for putting an end to a “manifest, long-standing tyranny which would do great damage to fundamental personal rights and dangerous harm to the common good of the country”.[825]
Just sayin’
 
Mandatory tracking devices could help a lot in law enforcement, but could go against one’s rights. Personally, I would strongly support such a law. We need better cooperation between the good of society and individual rights!

(LOVE, brothers and sisters!)
“Mandatory” might be unconstitutional in the USA as a violation of the 4 th ammendment.
 
[BIBLEDRB]Acts 5:29[/BIBLEDRB]

Robert, I wonder whether you would support such a verse if a hypothetical ultra-libertarian government was elected that utterly eliminated all social assistance to the poor? Or a totalitarian government was elected and given an enabling act that allowed them to hunt down and shoot all Catholics on sight?

And from the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace:

** 400. **Recognizing that natural law is the basis for and places limits on positive law means admitting that it is legitimate to resist authority should it violate in a serious or repeated manner the essential principles of natural law. Saint Thomas Aquinas writes that “one is obliged to obey … insofar as it is required by the order of justice”.[823] Natural law is therefore the basis of the right to resistance.

There can be many different concrete ways this right may be exercised; there are also many different ends that may be pursued. Resistance to authority is meant to attest to the validity of a different way of looking at things, whether the intent is to achieve partial change, for example, modifying certain laws, or to fight for a radical change in the situation.
**
401. **The Church’s social doctrine indicates the criteria for exercising the right to resistance: “Armed resistance to oppression by political authority is not legitimate, unless all the following conditions are met: 1) there is certain, grave and prolonged violation of fundamental rights, 2) all other means of redress have been exhausted, 3) such resistance will not provoke worse disorders, 4) there is well-founded hope of success; and 5) it is impossible reasonably to foresee any better solution”.[824] Recourse to arms is seen as an extreme remedy for putting an end to a “manifest, long-standing tyranny which would do great damage to fundamental personal rights and dangerous harm to the common good of the country”.[825]
Just sayin’
I like your post, but I disagree. Who do you think guides our world? Or, do you think everything is due to the puny innate wit in us humans?
 
Robert…

Don’t you think it is about time to move onto another thread/topic?

Have you seen the poll results?

Your arguments are falling on deft ears.

No true American Catholic wants tracking devices on their cars. Judging from the comments so far, they are not very happy with any sort of government intervention in their privacy.

Time to give this this one up and move on to another failure.
Why are you so down on me all the time?

LOVE, Zoltan! 🙂
 
Ford has Sync. And all cars…no matter the make will have full electronics. The parts (repair) are now plug and play. The days of the shade tree do it yourself mechanic are over. If the electronics on your car are bad…it will not be drivable. Note when you take your car in for maintenance. …the first thing they do is hook it up to a diagnostic machine.
Ford Sync is a branded version of Microsoft Windows Embedded Automotive 7. It does not control vital systems. A vehicles’s Car Area Network (CAN) isn’t like your home Wi-Fi. To connect to it you would need to wire a physical connection to it. Stories published on how some “hacker” was able to take control of a car were based on demonstrations in which some one had opened the dash board and wired a laptop into the system. Even then their ability to control the vehicles were limited. For example, above 5 mph in some vehicles the command from the computer to stop the car was ignored since it was considered an errant command. Side note: If a hacker has physical access to your car to take the dashboard apart and rewire the electronics you’ve got bigger problems.

That’s not as big of a deal as it sounds. The OBD connectors are on pretty much all cars manufactured since 1996. A hobbiest can make a device to read from the port for about $20 in parts. In the mechanic’s shop environment these things tell fairly basic information.

Repairs are not plug and play. The port will output problems that the car’s ECU has detected like an oxygen sensor getting a bad reading or something being off about the pressure in the gas tank (usually from a missing gas cap). But you can’t do any repairs through this port.
 
That reminds me, did you read about those researchers who figured out how to hack the control systems of a regular automobile? The auto makers have put in all these interconnected smart controllers with no concern for security. The researchers showed how easy it would be to mess with the brakes, turn off all the dashboard lights and the headlights while you are driving at night, lock you in the car, stuff like that.

Click on image to magnify it:
View attachment 19479
See above. To do these things a “hacker” would need to get physical access to the vehicle and do some rewiring. Drive by hacking won’t work. And the Infotainment systems in cars don’t control vital systems.
 
I like your post, but I disagree. Who do you think guides our world? Or, do you think everything is due to the puny innate wit in us humans?
I wonder what Judas Maccabeus would think of your statement.
 
I wonder what Judas Maccabeus would think of your statement.
So, what do you think Judas Maccabeus would have to say? I have not a clue other than saying he probably believes that God (and Satan) runs the world.
 
I do not necessarily place any trust in the government, but GREAT trust in whoever it is that directly guides our lower world (without such guidance, technological advances and rapid population growth would never have succeeded).

It’s puzzling to me how Christians can believe in an all powerful God, but fail terribly in attributing the guidance of our lower world (the lowest of all worlds) to Him.

Romans 13:1 RSV
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.

LOVE! 🙂
Which makes sense if God didn’t also give our government members, free will. With that, they can choose to do pretty much anything they want. And that includes persecuting the populace.
 
Which makes sense if God didn’t also give our government members, free will. With that, they can choose to do pretty much anything they want. And that includes persecuting the populace.
Can people really do whatever they ‘want’ given their free will? I contend that God and Satan control the world, and people are bound to follow along.

Operant conditioning is based on factual principles, but it undermines free will. A toddler, for example, largely acts in accordance to rewards and punishments. Similarly, adults are often the product of operant and classical conditioning. Do you think this is a problem for the people who pay strict adherence to free will?

LOVE, sister! 🙂
 
Robert,
The NSA is collecting all our computer communications, and keeps an eye out for certain verbiage. If I get into a habit of calling something I like “da bomb”–like she’s da bomb–and then mention I need to get some ammonium nitrate for my straw bale garden, guess what? This will alert the NSA to investigate me further.

In the same way, car trackers will be set to notify them of certain patterns. A woman in NYC has an elderly mother in Florida se visits once a month? Red flags for drug transporting! A man regularly goes to the bad part of town to feed the poor–is he frequentling prostitutes, buying drugs, or, Heaven forbid, feeding uninspected food to people in a park!

But, who sets these up to notify, and what do they notify of? A man goes to a gun show out of state–might that set off a red flag? A family attends Tea Party rallies–red flag?

And what if a business owner attends Mass regularly? Should he be checked out for compliance with the HHS mandate?

No, it’s bad enough they don’t treat emails as they do USPO letters without also being able to track our every move. There are just not that many dangerous criminals in the US abd too much room for abuse for automatic car tracking to justify requiring them for the good of society.
 
Can people really do whatever they ‘want’ given their free will? I contend that God and Satan control the world, and people are bound to follow along.
As a Catholic, I can’t and don’t agree with that.
 
Robert,
The NSA is collecting all our computer communications, and keeps an eye out for certain verbiage. If I get into a habit of calling something I like “da bomb”–like she’s da bomb–and then mention I need to get some ammonium nitrate for my straw bale garden, guess what? This will alert the NSA to investigate me further.

In the same way, car trackers will be set to notify them of certain patterns. A woman in NYC has an elderly mother in Florida se visits once a month? Red flags for drug transporting! A man regularly goes to the bad part of town to feed the poor–is he frequentling prostitutes, buying drugs, or, Heaven forbid, feeding uninspected food to people in a park!

But, who sets these up to notify, and what do they notify of? A man goes to a gun show out of state–might that set off a red flag? A family attends Tea Party rallies–red flag?

And what if a business owner attends Mass regularly? Should he be checked out for compliance with the HHS mandate?

No, it’s bad enough they don’t treat emails as they do USPO letters without also being able to track our every move. There are just not that many dangerous criminals in the US abd too much room for abuse for automatic car tracking to justify requiring them for the good of society.
To each their own, but I welcome the government’s use of these data to help deal with crime, regardless of the relatively small hassles they could create. Moreover, I view it as being somewhat selfish not to sacrifice some of your liberty to promote the common good of society.

Imagine that 911 might have been prevented with some of the new security measures that the government can use.
 
To each their own, but I welcome the government’s use of these data to help deal with crime, regardless of the relatively small hassles they could create. Moreover, I view it as being somewhat selfish not to sacrifice some of your liberty to promote the common good of society.
If that’s how you feel, and if you fly frequently, you may want to sign up for TSA pre-check. As a part of the process your finger prints will be taken and a background check will be done. But from doing ityou don’t have to go through the same security procedures as every one else (you can leave your shows on and you can leave your computer(s) in your bag).
 
Why would they seek this information from you if are a law abiding citizen?
Perhaps we should all wear internet microphones to record our conversations.
In that way, they could prevent anyone how in planning a crime.

And there is nothing to worry about if we are law abiding citizens.

Correct?
 
I forgot to mention, criminals will figure out how to disable the tracking devices in their own vehicles. Better yet, they will figure out how to spoof the tracking device, so it indicates the vehicle is somewhere that it really isn’t. Only suckers like you and me will be trackable.
The first thing that I would do is to detach it from my car and leave it in the parking lot of Church.

The police will never know that I am elsewhere, as I am a law abiding citizen, and therefore they will have no need to look up the records.

More specifically, the will be CONVINCED that I am a law abiding citizen, as my car (and therefore me) is spending HUGE amounts of time at Church.
 
Perhaps we should all wear internet microphones to record our conversations.
In that way, they could prevent anyone how in planning a crime.

And there is nothing to worry about if we are law abiding citizens.

Correct?
👍 👍

Correct!

LOVE! 🙂
 
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