Would you support mandatory tracking devices on all new cars?

[Cimachol]

Even if the government did mandate tracking devices on vehicles, the people we’d most want to see monitored would be the first to figure out how to disable the devices. Just like when you outlaw guns, only the outlaws have guns.

 

[tabycat]

Even if the government did mandate tracking devices on vehicles, the people we’d most want to see monitored would be the first to figure out how to disable the devices. Just like when you outlaw guns, only the outlaws have guns.

 

[Skadi]

-]/-]

Even if the government did mandate tracking devices on vehicles, the people we’d most want to see monitored would be the first to figure out how to disable the devices. Just like when you outlaw guns, only the outlaws have guns.

Right on target:thumbsup:

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Even if the government did mandate tracking devices on vehicles, the people we’d most want to see monitored would be the first to figure out how to disable the devices. Just like when you outlaw guns, only the outlaws have guns.

(I say the following with sarcasm)

Set up a custom radio to emit GPS signals. Finding a power level to override real GPS signals without broadcasting two far out of the vehicle should not be hard. Have the signal indicate you are in your own yard when you are actually driving around.

Alternatively splice into the serial communications cable between the gps module and the transmitter. Pump your own location information into the transmitter. If in doubt get a second year computer engineering student to do this. It isn’t hard. A lot of gps modules communicate at 9600 baud, no parity bit, one stop bit. Tools for generating the gps signals to play back to the receiver are out there (usually for developers, though nothing stops them from being used nefariously).

Alternatively find some one with a rep sheet and have their cars gps record altered to reflect where you actually were. For bonus points leave a piece of evidence of the crime on their vehicle. Since the person has a rep their claims to innocence will not be taken seriously. The person will be arrested and convucted, proving the system works. The bad guy got caught. And we are all a little safer thanks to this great idea.

 

[Robert_Sock]

Yes we do. The fact that you think people don’t have any rights, that are of any value, just confirms to me how ignorant you are of Catholic teaching.

Why the rude wording?

Just because your bank requires your SSN to set up an account doesn’t mean that the government has access to that information. If they do, it’s illegal an unconstitutional. Period.

I believe I had to sign a waiver.

Yes, your insurance company requires proof that you can legally drive before they insure you. That doesn’t mean that a government can find out what kind of car I drive from just my driver’s license information.

You grossly underestimate the government and its covert collection of data. The government in covert operations do not see it as a violation of rights, but an everyday occurrence in collecting data.

This, again, shows me just how ignorant you are of Catholic teaching. We do have God-given natural rights and the Catholic Church states this explicitly. You really should read more of the Popes’ encyclicals.

What you see is only a reflection of an ever-present illusion.

Here’s what the bible says about liberties.
Gal 5:13 (Douay Rheims)
13 For you, brethren, have been called unto liberty: only make not liberty an occasion to the flesh, but by charity of the spirit serve one another.

To operationalize ‘liberty’ in a manner like Galatians causes me to strongly agree with it.

Yes we do and the Catholic Church agrees.

No!

Just because you believe something to be true, doesn’t mean it is.

Yes, that makes a lot of sense, but it could easily apply to you as well

Did the man ever kill his wife? So his constitutional rights were violated and you applaud this? If his rights were violated, he could find many lawyers that would represent him pro bono.

I moved not long after the incident. He may very well have qualified for pro bono, but I wasn’t exactly rooting for this hot-tempered man.

 

[TEPO]

(I say the following with sarcasm)

Set up a custom radio to emit GPS signals. Finding a power level to override real GPS signals without broadcasting two far out of the vehicle should not be hard. Have the signal indicate you are in your own yard when you are actually driving around.

Alternatively splice into the serial communications cable between the gps module and the transmitter. Pump your own location information into the transmitter. If in doubt get a second year computer engineering student to do this. It isn’t hard. A lot of gps modules communicate at 9600 baud, no parity bit, one stop bit. Tools for generating the gps signals to play back to the receiver are out there (usually for developers, though nothing stops them from being used nefariously).

Alternatively find some one with a rep sheet and have their cars gps record altered to reflect where you actually were. For bonus points leave a piece of evidence of the crime on their vehicle. Since the person has a rep their claims to innocence will not be taken seriously. The person will be arrested and convucted, proving the system works. The bad guy got caught. And we are all a little safer thanks to this great idea.

Copied, pasted and saved… Thanks for the info!

(Just kidding, just kidding )

 

[TEPO]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/files/2013/12/ukraine-2010-election.jpg

washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/12/09/this-one-map-helps-explain-ukraines-protests/

According to the above referenced map, there may still be a lot of problems in Eastern Ukraine even if Crimea goes to Russia. it would be best if Ukraine was divided up into a Confederation under the EU umbrella when they get there. That way Russian culture in Ukraine would be protected yet there would still be unity.

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Copied, pasted and saved… Thanks for the info!

(Just kidding, just kidding )

Some time ago some students demonstrated the GPS signal hack (with permission) against a boat. The boats navigation system showed it was off course. It applied correction in the direction the students wanted it to go.

GPS just wasn’t made with security in mind. There are other location technologies available along with other ways to spoof and hack them.

 

[Robert_Sock]

I would like to take all the ‘yes’ people out to dinner, but I’m broke! Maybe they could pitch in and take me out to dinner!

 

[Cimachol]

Originally Posted by freeRadical

Yes!

“Respect for the human person entails respect for the rights that flow from his dignity as a creature. These rights are prior to society and must be recognized by it. They are the basis of the moral legitimacy of every authority: by flouting them, or refusing to recognize them in its positive legislation, a society undermines its own moral legitimacy. If it does not respect them, authority can rely only on force or violence to obtain obedience from its subjects. It is the Church’s role to remind men of good will of these rights and to distinguish them from unwarranted or false claims.” –Catechism of the Catholic Church, 1930

 

[Peter_Plato]

Do you have a source from the Bible that teaches love of liberty? I can find plenty of sources/commands that we are bound to love our neighbor!

The greatest liberty of all is the right to learn of, and experience, Christian LOVE!

If it were true that love can exist without liberty, then God could have saved us all a whole lot of grief by merely programming us to “love our neighbor.”

The problem, it seems to me, is that persons are not automatons. In other words without autonomy, without the possibility of originating choices we have no identity. Without identity we are not individual persons that can be loved in any true sense, as persons.

In other words love depends upon persons capable of love and persons do not exist without personal identity - the loci of personhood grounded in the ability of make self-determined choices.

The cross, which you keep bringing up, has two aspects to it. The horizontal member represents both love and liberty as two “arms” of the cross to symbolize what it means to be human. The vertical member prioritizes or gives perspective and depth to human existence by fixing a reference point to which the human (horizontal) aspect is affixed. The vertical represents Goodness, Truth and Beauty, the Divine in humanity, the focal or reference point from which human freedom and love can both radiate.

Human existence isn’t merely unrestrained liberty, nor slavish love, but love freely given and ordered with reference to or in harmony with Goodness, Truth and Beauty.

Love, in other words, is 3-dimensional, it doesn’t merely encompass breadth, but, crucially, depth, as well.

 

[Robert_Sock]

Yes!

“Respect for the human person entails respect for the rights that flow from his dignity as a creature. These rights are prior to society and must be recognized by it. They are the basis of the moral legitimacy of every authority: by flouting them, or refusing to recognize them in its positive legislation, a society undermines its own moral legitimacy. If it does not respect them, authority can rely only on force or violence to obtain obedience from its subjects. It is the Church’s role to remind men of good will of these rights and to distinguish them from unwarranted or false claims.” –Catechism of the Catholic Church, 1930

Yes, from a certain perspective we do have rights, but only from a certain perspective. In reality, however, we live in a fantasy where we are really slaves.

"The death of the just: Death will reach everyone, the good and the bad; but the destiny of each one is quite different. The just man sees himself in this valley of tears as a prisoner, serving a very hard term. He considers himself a slave in this world, suffering an extremely distressing servitude. He regards himself a sailor caught in a horrible storm. And as death means an end of his confinement, an end of his slavery, and is the port of his salvation, he ceases not to cry with David, ‘Woe is me that my sojourning is prolonged!’ (Ps. 119:5)… He ceases not to ask with the Apostle’… Who shall deliver me from the body of this death? (Rom. 7:24)”
-The Golden Key to Heaven, by Saint Anthony Mary Claret

 

[Zzyzx_Road]

I would like to take all the ‘yes’ people out to dinner, but I’m broke! Maybe they could pitch in and take me out to dinner!

No wonder you love the government, you want their help! The more statist, the more taxes they take from me, the better for you! Got it! Why didn’t I think of that? Why don’t I just slack off my contributions to St Vincent de Paul, Catholic Charities, CRS and my local parish so you can have more of my tax dollars? Yep, that’s the spirit…

In a more serious vein, the country you live in was founded on the principle that we the people are the sovereign, not the government, that we the people have an unalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. With those rights come the right to defend that life and the lives of those who cannot defend themselves such as our children and our unborn, the right to my liberty which includes the right to be left alone and the right to worship who I want, and the right to be free from unreasonable searches, that is, searches that don’t have a justifiable cause. Read your history about the Writs of Assistance during Colonial times just prior to the Revolutionary War.

Yes, Robert, I love ya, you have long since said goodbye to these things, who cares about such quaint, old-fashioned concepts like rights when you love government and everything they do. Those concepts are so far behind you that you have even bypassed the Catholic Church. Nice!

 

[Wampa]

After reading 13 pages of this, I’ve come to the conclusion this entire premise and argument must be a wind-up. No one could possibly be this Pollyanna-ish on this topic.

Now that I note post #83 again (where you agreed that we should all wear internet microphones to record our conversations to prevent crime), it becomes obvious. Well played.

 

[tabycat]

No wonder you love the government, you want their help! The more statist, the more taxes they take from me, the better for you! Got it! Why didn’t I think of that? Why don’t I just slack off my contributions to St Vincent de Paul, Catholic Charities, CRS and my local parish so you can have more of my tax dollars? Yep, that’s the spirit…

In a more serious vein, the country you live in was founded on the principle that we the people are the sovereign, not the government, that we the people have an unalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. With those rights come the right to defend that life and the lives of those who cannot defend themselves such as our children and our unborn, the right to my liberty which includes the right to be left alone and the right to worship who I want, and the right to be free from unreasonable searches, that is, searches that don’t have a justifiable cause. Read your history about the Writs of Assistance during Colonial times just prior to the Revolutionary War.

Yes, Robert, I love ya, you have long since said goodbye to these things, who cares about such quaint, old-fashioned concepts like rights when you love government and everything they do. Those concepts are so far behind you that you have even bypassed the Catholic Church. Nice!

I agree.

 

[Cimachol]

After reading 13 pages of this, I’ve come to the conclusion this entire premise and argument must be a wind-up. No one could possibly be this Pollyanna-ish on this topic.

Now that I note post #83 again (where you agreed that we should all wear internet microphones to record our conversations to prevent crime), it becomes obvious. Well played.

You may be right. I think it’s time for us to stop playing his game by responding to this silliness.

 

[tabycat]

You may be right. I think it’s time for us to stop playing his game by responding to this silliness.

Many of his threads end this way.

 

[Robert_Sock]

Why are you guys still here?

LOVE!

 

[Wampa]

Many of his threads end this way.

Frustrating. Well, at least now I know and can avoid these in the future!

 

[TEPO]

In reality, however, we live in a fantasy

Robert, I’m not sure what your position is in life, but I’d like to suggest getting out of LA for a while. Head down here to OC and do some beach camping and maybe a little fishing with a loved one.

I remember when I lived up there everything seemed so robotic and predictable sometimes. It’s nice to get away.