Wow there are a lot of Mormon (LDS) threads and members here

[dianaiad]

This guy’s got it right, apart from the fact I don’t think patty was objecting to or unhappy about our presence, she was just expressing surprise over the amount of followers of our religion here now. Apart from that, this fellow has got it spot on.

why thank you.

Oh, except for one thing.

I’m a girl. Female. woman. Old Bat. Whatever…

 

[zaffiroborant]

I feel the need to defend the faith I belong to. There is nothing but your beliefs to say you are the one who is right. I have no right to talk to you about what Catholicism dictates and whether you’re right or not, please understand you do not have the right to bash another religion. I have made no unfounded accusations, you are the one “mormon-bashing” as it were.

Please do not tell me I am going to hell, because I see reasons to say the same to you, yet I won’t because you are probably a pure, devout and religious person. As such you probably aren’t, so please do not judge us.

@LDSGuy True, I just don’t get why people like MelanieAnne feel the need to condemn everyone. I don’t see how they have the right to judge us for having faith in something that is different from what they have faith in.

I might have more sympathy for your “offendedness” if your inaugural post hadn’t been entitled “Catholic Behavior”. Where you cited as poor behavior Catholics accosting people outside of abortion clinics. From my experience this is an unfounded accusation, no one I know “accosts” people at clinics they just pray.

And you accuse MelanieAnne of condemning.

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

I might have more sympathy for your “offendedness” if your inaugural post hadn’t been entitled “Catholic Behavior”. Where you cited as poor behavior Catholics accosting people outside of abortion clinics. From my experience this is an unfounded accusation, no one I know “accosts” people at clinics they just pray.

And you accuse MelanieAnne of condemning.

Not only did I not accuse catholicism of wrongdoing I did not condemn their actions, I was curious as to why. Asking for any potential motivation of things I’ve seen with my own two eyes is different from attacking an entire faith.

Please pay attention to all that I post as opposed to what you can use against me. As taking something in context with the rest of everything else said tends to change a lot about it. If this forum was about another faith that I have seen people that do that belong to I would’ve asked them. But since this is a catholic forum I am asking about reasons a handful of Catholics may resort to that

 

[MelanieAnne]

I might have more sympathy for your “offendedness” if your inaugural post hadn’t been entitled “Catholic Behavior”. Where you cited as poor behavior Catholics accosting people outside of abortion clinics. From my experience this is an unfounded accusation, no one I know “accosts” people at clinics they just pray.

And you accuse MelanieAnne of condemning.

That’s right Zaffiroborant, way too much of this “offendedness” appears to be nothing more than a pose. Praying the rosary anywhere doesn’t equal accosting anyone. That’s what happens at abortion clinics, people pray.

And getting all huffy when there are some that make a regular habit of attempting to proselytize (often in the form of asking loaded questions while pretending to simply discuss religion) reminds me of someone getting all upset when they get caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

With all the drama exhibited by the LDS that post to this board, it’s hard not to reach the conclusion that somehow the Mormon faith creates in its followers some sort of victim mentality or paranoia, the reactions are so extreme.

Thankfully, that’s not something Catholics have to worry about since our faith was founded by Jesus Christ, He still guides the Church today through His Holy Spirit. We don’t trace our religion back to a man who was known for duplicity, as Mormons do.

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

That’s right Zaffiroborant, way too much of this “offendedness” appears to be nothing more than a pose. Praying the rosary anywhere doesn’t equal accosting anyone. That’s what happens at abortion clinics, people pray.

And getting all huffy when there are some that make a regular habit of attempting to proselytize (often in the form of asking loaded questions while pretending to simply discuss religion) reminds me of someone getting all upset when they get caught with their hand in the cookie jar.

With all the drama exhibited by the LDS that post to this board, it’s hard not to reach the conclusion that somehow the Mormon faith creates in its followers some sort of victim mentality or paranoia, the reactions are so extreme.

Thankfully, that’s not something Catholics have to worry about since our faith was founded by Jesus Christ, He still guides the Church today through His Holy Spirit. We don’t trace our religion back to a man who was known for duplicity, as Mormons do.

Unfortunately there are a few people who do more than pray, there are some that do take matters too far. As I have stated before, I know and understand this is a very small minority. I was asking since you follow the same doctrine of faith is there any particular reason these people do these not so good things for very good reasons as opposed to doing very good things for very good reasons.

Victim mentality and paranoia are human nature, whether you wish to accept it or not is a different matter. Drama is exhibited by all people of all religions, and to speak about a religion that way shows a closed heart and a refusal to understand.

As for Joseph Smith, whatever sort of man he was, is it not in a persons heart to change? When coming face to face with the light of god it is very easy to repent and change one’s ways, who are any of us to say that anybody is beyond redemption?

 

[zaffiroborant]

Not only did I not accuse catholicism of wrongdoing I did not condemn their actions, I was curious as to why. Asking for any potential motivation of things I’ve seen with my own two eyes is different from attacking an entire faith.

I didn’t say you accused Catholicism of wrong doing I said you accused Catholics of behaving badly namely being intolerant, judgmental and attacking people. Here let me show you:

Firstly I know many Catholics are not like this, so I am not attacking Catholicism or all Catholics. Now we have that out of the way

Why do so many Catholics react with intolerance towards everything they do not believe in? I understand they do not believe in it, but what right does it give them to attack it? As well as attacking the person in question? Does it not contradict loving thy neighbor and turning the other cheek? I understand the Catholics I am describing disapprove, and some may want to save the person’s soul, but proverbial vinegar will not bring them into what you see as the light. A sin is a sin and a sinner is a sinner, and it is god’s right alone to pass judgement on them.

The awful thing is alot of these people have great amounts of intelligence, but their intolerance prevents them from seeing the big picture and then putting their intelligence to a good use.

I ended up rambling, but simply put: Could anyone shed some light on why these few bad apples behave the way they do?

P.S If this is in the wrong forum please forgive me, spirituality is all I could think of right now as it does somewhat encompass that

Nice first post! When asked for an example of what you meant, you were offended (though for the life of me I can’t understand why)and responded thus:

Rudeness isn’t necessary, I neither attacked your faith, the entirety,the majority, nor the minority. I asked a simple question. I understand you may feel I am attacking an aspect of your faith, but if you’d read the first line of the first post then you would see otherwise.

Anyway, to give you an example, accosting anybody who has anything to do with an abortion clinic. Despite the fact that it’s wrong, forbidden and immoral in the catholic faith, some people may not care, or may not understand.

Note we’ve gone from attacking people to accosting them, just like it went from “so many Catholics” to a handful later in the thread.

Please pay attention to all that I post as opposed to what you can use against me. As taking something in context with the rest of everything else said tends to change a lot about it. If this forum was about another faith that I have seen people that do that belong to I would’ve asked them. But since this is a catholic forum I am asking about reasons a handful of Catholics may resort to that

Your first post makes unfounded accusations, and when you are called on it you go all injured whatever.

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

I didn’t say you accused Catholicism of wrong doing I said you accused Catholics of behaving badly namely being intolerant, judgmental and attacking people. Here let me show you:

Nice first post! When asked for an example of what you meant, you were offended (though for the life of me I can’t understand why)and responded thus:

Note we’ve gone from attacking people to accosting them, just like it went from “so many Catholics” to a handful later in the thread.

Your first post makes unfounded accusations, and when you are called on it you go all injured whatever.

I’m sorry for conveying my message wrong, which is why I corrected myself later. I’m allowed to make mistakes when typing once in a while, right?

I apologize to you though, and to everyone who got offended by my poorly worded first post though, my brain was still somewhat asleep. I know this is no excuse, and I am truly sorry

 

[LDSGuy]

Unfortunately there are a few people who do more than pray, there are some that do take matters too far. As I have stated before, I know and understand this is a very small minority. I was asking since you follow the same doctrine of faith is there any particular reason these people do these not so good things for very good reasons as opposed to doing very good things for very good reasons.

Victim mentality and paranoia are human nature, whether you wish to accept it or not is a different matter. Drama is exhibited by all people of all religions, and to speak about a religion that way shows a closed heart and a refusal to understand.

As for Joseph Smith, whatever sort of man he was, is it not in a persons heart to change? When coming face to face with the light of god it is very easy to repent and change one’s ways, who are any of us to say that anybody is beyond redemption?

You’ll soon come to realize that some think they have Mormonism all figured out, and when they tell them what we believe, or inquire of similar stances or practices in the Catholic Church, we’re told that we don’t understand it, our religion is from Satan, we’re changing the subject, and that the Catholic Church can’t be false because it’s founded by Jesus Christ. You’ll see the typical arguments and closemindedness of some posters, especially when we try to explain what we believe.

Luckily we know that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the true Church of Christ

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

You’ll soon come to realize that some think they have Mormonism all figured out, and when they tell them what we believe, or inquire of similar stances or practices in the Catholic Church, we’re told that we don’t understand it, our religion is from Satan, we’re changing the subject, and that the Catholic Church can’t be false because it’s founded by Jesus Christ. You’ll see the typical arguments and closemindedness of some posters, especially when we try to explain what we believe.

Luckily we know that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the true Church of Christ

I’m sorry to have to disagree with you, but as much as we both believe it, there’s no way we can rightfully claim that. Catholics believe the same about their religion, and it isn’t right from any perspective to tell anyone who is right and who isn’t. We all have our own opinions and beliefs, and we should respect theirs if we expect them to respect ours. All we can do is show them our way and hope they shall join us, and/or respect that they shall stick to their beliefs.

But I agree with your first post, but it is a common practice when people of two different religions discuss religion.

 

[LDSGuy]

I’m sorry to have to disagree with you, but as much as we both believe it, there’s no way we can rightfully claim that. Catholics believe the same about their religion, and it isn’t right from any perspective to tell anyone who is right and who isn’t. We all have our own opinions and beliefs, and we should respect theirs if we expect them to respect ours. All we can do is show them our way and hope they shall join us, and/or respect that they shall stick to their beliefs.

But I agree with your first post, but it is a common practice when people of two different religions discuss religion.

Pumpkin, why should we not claim that we have the fullness of Truth when that is what we believe in, the Restoration? Yes, Catholics proudly believe that they have the fullness of Truth and are the true Church of Jesus Christ, so we should be proud of our belief as well. We should be respectful in discussion, but that does not mean we hide what we actually believe.

 

[StevenFrancis]

I just had to point this out. I’m sure it will go nowhere but I am just so shocked that I leave for a few months and now there are so many threads and members of the LDS church here. Did I miss something? I welcome all to discuss religion just I am shocked.

What a wonderful thing this is!! There are also many more from Islam as well. So many souls seeking for the truth! I rejoice.

John 6:
66 And he said: Therefore did I say to you, that no man can come to me, unless it be given him by my Father. 67 After this many of his disciples went back; and walked no more with him. 68 Then Jesus said to the twelve: Will you also go away? 69 And Simon Peter answered him: Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 70 And we have believed and have known, that thou art the Christ, the Son of God.

Peace,

Steven

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

Pumpkin, why should we not claim that we have the fullness of Truth when that is what we believe in, the Restoration? Yes, Catholics proudly believe that they have the fullness of Truth and are the true Church of Jesus Christ, so we should be proud of our belief as well. We should be respectful in discussion, but that does not mean we hide what we actually believe.

Believing we are right and voicing that we believe we are right is different than telling others we are the right path. To voice our beliefs and try to pass them on is one thing, but to tell others we are right is to some saying “you’re wrong” and many feel that it is forcing your beliefs upon them.

Believing something and outright saying “we’re right” can sometimes lead to problems. Maybe I’m the one whose wrong but I personally believe in believing you are right and Convincing others we are, rather than telling them.

 

[ParkerD]

Yea, but when you die, you do not have cliques of families, because everyone is related in the same way. we will all be THE BODY OF CHRIST joined with God for all eternity. You do not want in heaven. You do not have to fear that you will not be apart of your family if your not sealed to them on this earth. God is a loving God. It all boils down to God being our Father, and we are his children. How could families be grouped together since we would all be His children in heaven? I do not think there would be titles…I could be wrong, but I would think that we don’t have to worry about our family ties in heaven. It just doesn’t make sense.

• If you were to die, would you be disappointed if you were in heaven and found out that your family would be all of us, instead of just “your” family you know on earth?

Lamb of God Girly,
I noticed when I happened upon this thread, that no one answered your very good questions quoted above. Here goes a try:

In answer to the last question, when the LDS talk about the “sealing” of families, the concept extends not just to an immediate family, but backward in time to all of our ancestral lines who are progenitor families, and eventually that “sealing” of families needs to be worked out all the way back to Adam and Eve. Mind-boggling? You bet! How possible? We believe that perhaps the most important work to be done on earth during the thousand years of the Millenium, will be temple work for the spirits who lived on earth before our time, including those “sealings”. There will be those helping find records or to re-establish records so that every person who has ever lived is accounted for.

So, our “family” will include a vast number of people, whom we will love and cherish exactly like we do our immediate family now. We will also love and cherish every other family line who are descendants of Adam and Eve, even those who don’t accept these beliefs and who choose a different path–we’ll still love them, perhaps feel badly that they chose their different path, but love them and yet respect their choice.

I don’t think there is an intent of a sense of “fear” about sealings not being done and people getting left out because of that, if a person really understands the doctrine. The work is all-inclusive. A young couple getting married is encouraged to be married in the temple and thus be “sealed” in their marriage so their children are automatically “sealed” to them when they are born, but this encouragement isn’t to try and instill fear. It is to try and encourage covenant-making that will help the marriage to last, and help the parents try as hard as they possibly can to teach their children just as the children of Israel had a covenant and were taught to teach their children to live by the covenant (Deutoeronomy 6):

6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:
7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.
8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

 

[zerinus]

What a wonderful thing this is!! There are also many more from Islam as well. So many souls seeking for the truth! I rejoice.

John 6:
66 And he said: Therefore did I say to you, that no man can come to me, unless it be given him by my Father. 67 After this many of his disciples went back; and walked no more with him. 68 Then Jesus said to the twelve: Will you also go away? 69 And Simon Peter answered him: Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. 70 And we have believed and have known, that thou art the Christ, the Son of God.

Peace,

Steven

Think nothing of it. She is talking a lot of nonsense as usual. I have been posting here since September 2006, and I can inform you that the average number of Mormon threads here today is no greater than they have ever been; nor indeed are the number of Mormons that much greater. Just some old faces have gone, and some new ones have arrived. And most of the threads are started by non-Mormons—or anti-Mormons like Patty anyway. Very few of them have been started by Mormons. Mormons are here to respond to questions and/or false accusations by non-Mormons and anti-Mormons. Stop those, and Mormons will mostly disappear.

zerinus

 

[RebeccaJ]

Lamb of God Girly,

So, our “family” will include a vast number of people, whom we will love and cherish exactly like we do our immediate family now. We will also love and cherish every other family line who are descendants of Adam and Eve, even those who don’t accept these beliefs and who choose a different path–we’ll still love them, perhaps feel badly that they chose their different path, but love them and yet respect their choice.

Catholic belief is that this occurs automatically, as a part of heaven, no extra “sealing” required. If I’m in heaven and my husband is in heaven and all the other souls are in heaven, there we are, altogether, a vast number of people who we love and cherish just as we do our immediate family now. If not more perfectly, since as St. Paul said, “we don’t know how to love”.

I don’t think there is an intent of a sense of “fear” about sealings not being done and people getting left out because of that, if a person really understands the doctrine. The work is all-inclusive. A young couple getting married is encouraged to be married in the temple and thus be “sealed” in their marriage so their children are automatically “sealed” to them when they are born, but this encouragement isn’t to try and instill fear. It is to try and encourage covenant-making that will help the marriage to last, and help the parents try as hard as they possibly can to teach their children just as the children of Israel had a covenant and were taught to teach their children to live by the covenant (Deutoeronomy 6):

6 And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:
7 And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.
8 And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

This is the same for the Catholic Sacrament of Marriage.

 

[amontoya]

I’m sorry to have to disagree with you, but as much as we both believe it, there’s no way we can rightfully claim that. Catholics believe the same about their religion, and it isn’t right from any perspective to tell anyone who is right and who isn’t. We all have our own opinions and beliefs, and we should respect theirs if we expect them to respect ours. All we can do is show them our way and hope they shall join us, and/or respect that they shall stick to their beliefs.

If you are right in your beliefs, then we are wrong. If we are right, then you are wrong. It isn’t disrespectful to tell someone they’re wrong about something. If you really do have the truth, then you are obligated to tell others what is true and what is false. “Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage - with great patience and careful instruction,” 2 Timothy 4:2.

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

If you are right in your beliefs, then we are wrong. If we are right, then you are wrong. It isn’t disrespectful to tell someone they’re wrong about something. If you really do have the truth, then you are obligated to tell others what is true and what is false. “Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage - with great patience and careful instruction,” 2 Timothy 4:2.

Would you not be offended if I outright stated you were wrong and cited it as a fact? Would you not feel put upon or annoyed? I believe we are right, and I would shout it from the rooftops until my voice goes, but I won’t explicitly state “You’re wrong” to someone as a fact. Not because I’m unsure of my beliefs (I am 100% positive about LDS being the way) but because I want to respect the fact that other people see things differently, even if I devote all my time to convincing the person to think our way.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Would you not be offended if I outright stated you were wrong and cited it as a fact? Would you not feel put upon or annoyed? I believe we are right, and I would shout it from the rooftops until my voice goes, but I won’t explicitly state “You’re wrong” to someone as a fact. Not because I’m unsure of my beliefs (I am 100% positive about LDS being the way) but because I want to respect the fact that other people see things differently, even if I devote all my time to convincing the person to think our way.

I think that is a fine approach, if it works for you.

Obviously you aren’t able to tolerate that others use a different approach.

 

[HuMaNpUmPkIn]

I think that is a fine approach, if it works for you.

Obviously you aren’t able to tolerate that others use a different approach.

What makes you say that?

 

[amontoya]

Would you not be offended if I outright stated you were wrong and cited it as a fact? Would you not feel put upon or annoyed? I believe we are right, and I would shout it from the rooftops until my voice goes, but I won’t explicitly state “You’re wrong” to someone as a fact. Not because I’m unsure of my beliefs (I am 100% positive about LDS being the way) but because I want to respect the fact that other people see things differently, even if I devote all my time to convincing the person to think our way.

No, I would not be offended. You are “100% positive” that LDS is “the way,” so then you must be 100% positive that Catholicism isn’t the way. I can disagree with you, and not be offended. Starting from this point, we can then discuss why we each believe the other is wrong, but if we’re both right and nobody’s wrong, then what is there to discuss?

I don’t understand this trend of being afraid of telling someone they’re wrong. It makes absolutely no sense to have the attitude that “you believe what you want, I’ll believe what I want, and even if our beliefs completely contradict each other, neither of us is wrong.”

There is right and there is wrong. Period. I don’t remember Jesus ever saying, “go forth to the nations and try to make my gospel much more attractive than their already held, equally valid beliefs.”