you are not welcome here...

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it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
 
I find it sad that after 8 pages of nearly unanimous support for the priest albeit based on solely your take of the situation and your estimation that the parish is indeed “conservative” (and by that I gather you really mean orthodox), that some still fail to see that sugary love isn’t all it takes…Jesus loved, and He loved perfectly, and He also said “go and sin no more”–which the church has repeatedly said to unrepentant abortion supporting politicians–they haven’t “gone and sinned no more” so the approach is still love them but try and teach them—you can’t teach them (in the same way) with the same teaching (and I mean manner, not content) that hasn’t worked since abortion was legalized.

Seems to me you have a bad taste in your mouth for this priest, as evidenced by your repeated use of the word “traditionalist” as an adjective (in your original post) and that you in fact have a great dislike for what you consider a “traditionalist.”

Glad
 
dang71 said:
for the past few years, we have had a “traditionalist” pastor (we have had an NO mass followed by a TLM every Sunday for decades). our parish is very conservative, but he has made some changes that have driven away some members of the church, and when they complained to the bishop, our traditionalist priest got up in a homily and said “shame on you” and totally railed against the people who complained. this past Sunday he was speaking about pro-abortion politicians and those that support them, and while i agree that they are in a serious state of sin, he said they “were not welcome at this communion rail”. i am conservative, but i am not a fan of the EF or traditionalism in general, and i find his attitude very disturbing. Christ came to reconcile the world to Himself, and this traditionalist priest follows the same attitude i see from almost all traditionalists i have ever met, the “holier/better than thou”, “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude which only acts to separate people. how can he stand up there and say that some people are not welcome? these people who support abortion should refrain from communion, sure, but how can he say they are not welcome? why not invite them to confession, invite them to informational meetings, invite them back to Christ and a state of grace? invite them to anything, but don’t shut the door on them! this kind of attitude only drives people AWAY from Christ. shame on him, and i pray that Christ doesn’t say to him “you are not welcome here” when his time comes.
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That priest could benefit from a Dale Carnegie course…
 
leonie said:
If the worst example you can come up with is that he admonished pro-abortion politicians to not receive communion in a state of mortal sin, it’s probably not him.

It’s probably those of us who are used to be tiptoed around.

I hope that it shakes some people up.
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:clapping:

:tiphat:

:tiphat:
 
Rickwood said:
That priest could benefit from a Dale Carnegie course…
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Why is that? and would you please answer my other questions.
Do you know this Priest?
Have you heard him speak?
What gives you the right to sit in judgement of him and trash him?
 
dang71 said:
it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
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See that post only cements in my mind that your trashing of the Priest is only because he disagrees with you.

You are very dramatic I will give you that, because posters on here did not jump on your band wagon and agree with you they all have “We don’t want your kind around here” attitude.
In reading all the post I have not gotten that ATTITUDE from anyone.
 
dang71 said:
it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. ** it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? ** Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
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Highlight Mine

I think it is amazing that after 8 pages of replies you don’t get that people are talking about going to Communion vs. attending Mass. If people chose to leave - that is on THEM, not the Priest - who was (apparently by your post) talking about receiving the Blessed Sacrament, not going to Confession (which it seemed from your post he was in fact, advocating) - much less celebrating the Mass.

Could it be you are just here baiting People?

Also - I am a convert ('06) and although I consider myself to be “Orthodox” in the sense that I believe and follow the Church’s teachings - explicitly, I do not consider myself to be “Traditionalist” in the sense that I have never been to a Latin Mass, been in a confessional booth, or seen the use of a censor (apart from Easter Vigil). Although I absolutely have no problem with people who do miss that form of the Mass, please don’t characterize me as such, especially in the tone you use it in.

Would you mind answering my post #56? (page 4)

Peace

John
 
dang71 said:
ok, maybe i did not explain fully or properly, but it seems you guys are missing the intent of what i was saying. yes, the priest should protect the eucharist, yes pro-abortion people are in a state of sin and need to correct that, yes pro-abortion people should refrain from communion.

my point is his ATTITUDE. Christ wants people to get to heaven, and having the nasty attitude i see this priest displaying is not winning any souls for Christ. when he pro-abortion people come in contact with this type of attitude, the are only driven further away. shouldn’t we act in LOVE and KINDNESS, while still maintaining our Catholic morals? having the “your not welcome here” attitude is not acting out of love.
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In our age of political correctness, it is embarrassing to the offenders when someone stands up for a conviction, with no apology. In our society of “everyone is okay,” things are usually sugar-coated and not strongly stated. You are blessed to have such a priest who will state the Truth, even if you yourself don’t find his personality attractive. In the end, he won’t be responsible for allowing people to say they weren’t guided in the right direction. Ultimately that is his job, not to win a popularity contest.
 
Lee_M said:
As some of the posters on here can back me up on this, I would not be labeled a traditionalist when it comes to the Holy Mass. I love the Norvus Ordo when done reverently.
However, WE NEED MORE PRIESTS LIKE THIS ONE! There are millions of babies murdered each year. It is the biggest holocaust in history. This has been going on legally since 1973. That is 35 years for priests to be polite and cuddly and tell us softly that we shouldn’t be supporting pro-abortion politicians. So while these priests are being polite and cuddly, there are more babies being killed everyday. It is time for some priests to have the strength and courage to get MAD and tell the people who support these politicians that they are not going to sit back and take it anymore. The “polite” messages are not sinking in.
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Dear Dang - you stated:" saying “you are not welcome here” shows a bad attitude, and is incorrect. as i have written before, all are welcome, but some must get back into a state of grace before receiving the Eucharist. being in a state of sin does not mean someone is “uninvited” or unwelcome, it does mean, however, that there is a serious situation that needs to be corrected.

if instead the priest had said “if you support abortion (or are in a state of sin), please come see me BEFORE you decide to receive the Eucharist”, then there would not be any issue here. the priest would not be compromising any church doctrine, but would be much more charitable, and therefore much more likely to win over those who are in a state of sin." in post # 99,

Has it ever occured to you that this man hears the Confessions of his parishoners and knows what they need to hear from the pulpit? He knows what he’s doing and who are you to judge the way he does? **He is the Pastor! You owe him obedience. Period. ** Obvisously the man has had enough of folks coming to him in Confession and talking politics, justifying themselves over and over and over again about a moral sickness that kills little innocent babies. What have you done lately to defend the innocent babies in the womb?

If a person’s views on abortion in all its forms is in any way contrary to the Church’ss teaching that person isn’t in Communion and shouldn’t behave as if they are. I’d go even further and wouldn’t even call them Catholic anymore. They belong in a church whose denomination begins with a “P”! Why don’t you quit belly aching about the Pastor’s “attitude.” I’m almost of a mind to ask you if you are pro-choice, pro-legal abortion and pro-contraception, etc. You seem to be taking his “attitude” too personally.

Peace,

Gail
 
jeanannemarie said:
In our age of political correctness, it is embarrassing to the offenders when someone stands up for a conviction, with no apology. In our society of “everyone is okay,” things are usually sugar-coated and not strongly stated. You are blessed to have such a priest who will state the Truth, even if you yourself don’t find his personality attractive. In the end, he won’t be responsible for allowing people to say they weren’t guided in the right direction. Ultimately that is his job, not to win a popularity contest.
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Well said!

Bravo!

👍
 
dang71 said:
it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
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Acxtually the priest was reaching out to these people with care and love. He was showing concern for most important thing theyposess their. their immortal souls. At the same time he was teaching his flock that abortion is such an abject evil that it disqualifies you from receiving the sacred body and blood of Christ. I can’t imagine any of the way he should have handled this
 
dang71 said:
it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
Click to expand...
Dang 71, I have tried to step back and be charitable about this. I think what is really going on is not that we don’t care about the sinner, it’s just that we’re not ready to jump on the bandwagon and condemn a priest for bluntly stating the truth. You say he was harsh and condemning but someone else might just have said blunt. I know a child who will say “I got in trouble” when something is simply pointed out that she did nor did not do when she should have and it’s really not even a big deal.

And in fairness, I have a wonderful priest and I’m sure if I had one that was blunt and gruff I probably wouldn’t like it as much but so what? I could live with it. And some day I probably will have to. Priests come in all sorts of temperments and personalities.

Finally, if people have a problem it should be discussed with the priest before they go over his head. I would be curious to your answers in Post #6.
 
dang71 said:
for the past few years, we have had a “traditionalist” pastor (we have had an NO mass followed by a TLM every Sunday for decades). our parish is very conservative, but he has made some changes that have driven away some members of the church, and when they complained to the bishop, our traditionalist priest got up in a homily and said “shame on you” and totally railed against the people who complained. this past Sunday he was speaking about pro-abortion politicians and those that support them, and while i agree that they are in a serious state of sin, he said they “were not welcome at this communion rail”. i am conservative, but i am not a fan of the EF or traditionalism in general, and i find his attitude very disturbing. Christ came to reconcile the world to Himself, and this traditionalist priest follows the same attitude i see from almost all traditionalists i have ever met, the “holier/better than thou”, “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude which only acts to separate people. how can he stand up there and say that some people are not welcome? these people who support abortion should refrain from communion, sure, but how can he say they are not welcome? why not invite them to confession, invite them to informational meetings, invite them back to Christ and a state of grace? invite them to anything, but don’t shut the door on them! this kind of attitude only drives people AWAY from Christ. shame on him, and i pray that Christ doesn’t say to him “you are not welcome here” when his time comes.
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Sounds as though he’s gone a bit overboard. That’s what happens when people transform Christianity into a political cause.
 
dang71 said:
it is soooo sad that after 8 pages of replies, there are very few people here who care enough for the prodigal sons of this world to try and reach out to them with care and love. it is amazing how many Catholic Christians have the “we don’t want your kind around here” attitude. Christ doesn’t have this attitude when we go to Him in confession! why then should we, who are supposed to be imitators of Christ, have any different attitude than Christ accepting us in the confessional? Christ came to heal the sick, and those who received the most anger from Christ were the self-righteous, while the sinners and sick received the most COMPASSION.

read Matthew 5:44-48 and Mark 7:5-13
Click to expand...
I think it’s so sad that you seem so intent on internet-crucifying your priest for preaching that pro-abortion politicians should not receive communion…

…when there’s hundreds and hundreds of priests out there who, instead, simply preach heresy. Who is more deserving of your criticism? The priest who says what the Catholic Church teaches in a blunt manner, or the priest who preaches lies in such a nice way that everyone believes it?
 
GladCatholic said:
I find it sad that after 8 pages of nearly unanimous support for the priest albeit based on solely your take of the situation and your estimation that the parish is indeed “conservative” (and by that I gather you really mean orthodox), that some still fail to see that sugary love isn’t all it takes…Jesus loved, and He loved perfectly, and He also said “go and sin no more”–which the church has repeatedly said to unrepentant abortion supporting politicians–they haven’t “gone and sinned no more” so the approach is still love them but try and teach them—you can’t teach them (in the same way) with the same teaching (and I mean manner, not content) that hasn’t worked since abortion was legalized.

Seems to me you have a bad taste in your mouth for this priest, as evidenced by your repeated use of the word “traditionalist” as an adjective (in your original post) and that you in fact have a great dislike for what you consider a “traditionalist.”

Glad
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I’m just curious. Do you believe that life begins at conception and that abortion is never justified? Do you believe it is okay for a Catholic to vote for a pro-abortion politician? Are there any circumstances you believe someone should be denied communion?
 
estesbob said:
I’m just curious. Do you believe that life begins at conception and that abortion is never justified? Do you believe it is okay for a Catholic to vote for a pro-abortion politician? Are there any circumstances you believe someone should be denied communion?
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:confused: why did you post this to Glad?
 
ncjohn said:
Then there is the whole overturning the tables of the moneychangers story, which is being used here to justify “tough love.” Balderdash! It is quite clear that people just don’t get why Jesus did this. It was purely and simply because there was a group of the “righteous” putting obstacles in the way of people who desired to seek God. Essentially “charging” people for access like a tollbooth. THAT is what Jesus would not tolerate.
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I want to thank “ncjohn” for making me re-think my interpretation of the Jesus overturning the tables of the money-changers. It forced me review the gospel account of Mark 11, 15-19. There was a footnote on verses 15 thru 19 that said:

“The expulsion of the buyers and sellers from the temple does not seem to be properly understood if regarded simply as an objection to the practice within the temple precincts, for it was fairly well controlled by the religious authorities. The key to an understanding of the incident is the citation of Is 56,7 and Jer 7,11. Both prophets objected that the worship in the temple was not consistent with true conversion. Jesus’ action is a symbol of God’s judgment against the abuses of his temple, due to the priests’ failure to instruct the people in the meaning of temple worship.” (The New American Bible, St Joseph Edition 1970).

Isaiah chapter 56,7 says “For my house will shall be called a house of prayer for all peoples.” The chapter heading is entitled “The Lord’s House Open to All”. Then there is a section on Blind Leaders (ch.56) and Faithless People (ch.57).

Jerehmiah chapter 7 is all about when a temple of worship is rejected by God. It talks about deceit in the temple. It talks about unfounded faith in temple worship saying, “We are safe; we can commit these abominations”. Later, it talks about abuses of temple worship, which included offering up cakes to Ishtar, goddess of fertility (according to footnote about “queen of heaven” reference), and immolating their sons and daughters as holocausts at a place to be renamed the “Valley of Slaughter”.
 
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