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Imagine23
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Call it what you want, it’s not much different from the homeless people I see talking to buildings.
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Imagine23
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They wanted to imprison him. He did stand trial for “heresy,” which is of course a ridiculous concept not even worthy of status as a Class C misdemeanor.Dont you just love those old bigotted views that surface from time to time!
I always reckon ‘the olduns’ are the best’!
It is true the Church and Galilao DID fall out for a while, but it was NOT over the relative position of the sun. In fact, the contentious issue has long since been proven in the Church’s favour.
I am not sure where you got your idea that the Church ‘imprisoned’ him. I am not aware she has prisons. But then again, some say the Catholic Church has killed more heretics than there were people alive on the entire planet at the time
The olduns are undoubtedly the best
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LilyM
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Difference being they’re not actually talking TO the building - they’re talking to a person they think is there with them. And talking total gibberish for the most part. And it’s directly related to alcoholism, drug use and abuse or some recognised mental illness in most cases.
They never congregate in groups to talk collectively to the ONE person who they think is there. If I heard of 2 billion homeless people across the world all thinking they were talking to one and the same person and all speaking coherently, it would at least give me pause to think that they’re possibly correct.
Now it can be positively established that the imaginary people these homeless think they’re talking to ACTUALLY aren’t there. Whereas it’s never been proven that God DOESN’T exist.
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Imagine23
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Good point. I see the difference. You have numerous people talking to an imaginary friend, and you are more organized and coordinate these imaginary discussions. I got it.
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Imagine23
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Wow! That’s a wonderful explanation. It’s all so clear to me now. God killing my parents is just like when you get your child to brush his teeth! That makes so much sense. Thank you.
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Mr.Ex_Nihilo
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Which, at last, fairly well sums up your entire view on prayer, right?
But you already knew that you didn’t believe in prayer, right?
And you also already knew that you were attempting to superimpose your own definition of prayer (talking to imaginary people who don’t exist) onto the Christian definition of prayer (talking to God), right?
And you pretty much already knew that you had no intention of actually listening to anything that anyone in this thread was actually going to offer to you as well, right?
See how I changed the title to…
I guess I could have said…
Or I could have written this…
Here’s the thing Imagine23-- since you’ve already got your mind made up, you don’t really care about anything that’s been offered to you. And if that’s the case, then the entire basis or your thread amounts to nothing more than troll bait, right?
So why don’t you do us all a favor and stop wasting our time with your mockery of sacred Christian beliefs and find somewhere else to troll, ok?
I can guarantee you that you really are a waste of my time. In fact, talking to you really is just like talking to a building. I’m not really expecting any coherant response from you that would suggest a cooperation in each other’s understanding. It’s pretty much a one sided discussion.
I’m pretty sure that the opposite is true too-- that we’re just wasting your time as well.
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Mr.Ex_Nihilo
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Yeah, like that wasn’t a total distortion of lil_one’s words.
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Gottle_of_Geer
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I know I don’t 
- what you describe is a magical outlook. Prayer is not magic, but a “lifting of the heart and soul to God in love”.
Our prayers are subject to the Will of God - if His Will does not suit ours, so be it : petitionary prayer is meaningless, if it is not to be in accord with His Will. The purpose of having a will at all, is that it should be in perfect uniformity with that of Christ. Prayer is not a means of having our own will done, but of coming more & more to have that of Christ, that the Father’s Will may be done on earth as in Heaven. ##
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Imagine23
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I thought I was on your ignore list. What happened?Yeah, like that wasn’t a total distortion of lil_one’s words.
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Mr.Ex_Nihilo
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I’m in the process if trying to have you removed from these forums. And if you are not removed, then I’ll suspend myself if I’m not suspended already for reporting you too many times.
My income tax will be coming through soon. But I see no point in financially contribtung to your nonsense Imagine23. And yet when I donate financially to these forums, that is exactly what I’m doing-- allowing anti-catholic / anti-religious types like you to debase and ridicule the Catholic faith at my own financial expense.
Gilbert Keith was absolutely correct when he stated his complaint to the staff of Catholic Answers. I’ve been waiting to see the repsonse that came of that, but I noticed that that post was removed. I’m beginning to suspect that there won’t be any answers coming back.
Here’s the thing Imagine23, I reported you many times and no one really cares– which is quite sad actually.
So I guess you win. Please proceed to be your usual ignorant anti-religious trollish self for these forums. The banter would apparently be much less exciting without your Jerry Springer attitude. And your ability to leads others into sacriledge will apparently not be in any way hindered here either.
And if that’s the case, then I am withdrawing my own financial support for these forums-- and focussing more on my own involvement with my family at home and at our local parish. I guess I’m giving up all forums-- cause this is just nonsense.
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Gottle_of_Geer
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Ridiculous within your (non-theistic) understanding, yes, by all means; but not within ours. Leave out the all-important God Who reveals His Will to His Church - & of course heresy looks silly; without God, it is a meaningless idea. Judge Christianity by standards which ignore its nature - & you guarantee that you won’t be able to make sense of it. Granted, there are plenty of evils in Christianity by Christian standards - but you’re not applying Christian standards, but unbelieving ones.
AFAICS, it’s as though you were playing a game of tennis, while we are playing a game of draughts; both are games, but they have different rules; & it’s not possible for tennis and draughts to be played by rules appropriate to each other.We understand prayer to be an activity of a certain kind - some at least of your objections to it make sense only if it is different from what we know it to be. So your objections can’t be treated as valid by us, even if they are valid as a decription of prayer as you see it. We’re the ones doing the praying, after all - because we are theists, & (more importantly) Christians: you say you aren’t. Christian prayer is not a theory - it’s much more like a way of living. And the only way to get a feel for living, is to be alive oneself: theory is too superficial to be able to substitute for life - especially when that life is the Life of God Himself. ##
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Morning_Star15
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Well said!
Reading through this thread, I was shocked that Imagine23 seems to claim that not having a prayer answered means that praying is futile and the equivalent of talking to a brick wall.
Prayer is a way of living in relationship with God, of communicating with our Creator. We were created to be in a relationship with God and therefore to communicate with Him. Sometimes that involves us asking Him for things that He either grants or doesn’t grant, but if a prayer is not granted the way we wanted it to be, then it’s immature to decide that we should stop having a relationship with God and communicating with Him just because we didn’ t get what we wanted. It’s like a 5-year old sulking and refusing to talk to his/her parents because they didn’t buy them the toy they wanted.
We may be initially upset that things didn’t turn out the way we wanted, but is our disappointment worth giving up our relationship with our Creator? God has already given us the greatest gift, one which we did not merit: His Son, Who died on the Cross to redeem us from our sins and grant us eternal life. What greater gift can there be than that?
Of course what I wrote above presupposes belief in God, which Imagine 23 hasn’t demonstrated. I can’t see the point in comparing people’s faith and prayer when one doesn’t believe in either - neither of these are objective things that can be analyzed or compared effectively, so why bother trying when at the end of the day it won’t make a difference in your personal life anyway?
As to this whole issue about whether we should use physicians or not, Catholics believe that faith is compatible with reason. We believe that we should be guided by our common sense as well as our faith. For example, it would be incompatible with reason to shun physicians and medicine in favour of prayer alone - God has provided those things for us. Even with physicians and medicine, faith is still required, since there’s never a guarantee, even with the best medical care, that the procedure will be effective. There are risks involved as well, so there’s plenty of room for someone seeking medical care to excercise their prayer and faith in God that they will be kept safe and that the procedure will work.
Also, if God answered all prayers directly whenever someone asked without using any people as instruments, where would be our opportunity to practice works of charity and do good deeds? We were created to live in community and do things for others, and an important aspect of that would be lost if no one ever needed anyone’s help. By using us as tools, God allows us to have a wonderful share in the work he does and in the miracles He works, something that can not only deepen our relationship with others, but with God as well, when we realize that He loves us enough to let common, sinful people like ourselves have a part in His work here on Earth.
God bless,
Karolina
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exoflare
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It’s pretty clear Imagine23 is just another standard troll. The only thing even CLOSE to talking to a building here, is continuing to reply to his posts. If he does not get suspended/banned after all, just put him on your ignore list and move on…
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Rachel_Malloy
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This thread is now closed as it has strayed FAR off topic.
Thanks to all who have participated.
Rachel
Thanks to all who have participated.
Rachel
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