20 Truths about Mormons

[Allweather]

1 Corinthians 1,20-25:

“Where is the wise one? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made the wisdom of the world foolish? For since in the wisdom of God the world did not come to know God through wisdom, it was the will of God through the foolishness of the proclamation to save those who have faith. For Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we proclaim Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, but to those who are called, Jews and Greeks alike, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than human widsom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.”

And 1 Corinthians 2, 1-2:

“When I came to you, brothers, proclaiming the mystery of God, I did not come with sublimity of words or of wisdom. For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ, and him crucified.”

One of my favorite hymns is one we often sang when I was a Pentecostal. There’s Power in the Blood of the Lamb:

*"Would you be free from the burden of sin?
There’s power in the blood, power in the blood;
Would you over evil a victory win?
There’s wonderful power in the blood.

There is power, power, wonder working power
In the blood of the Lamb;
There is power, power, wonder working power
In the precious blood of the Lamb.

Would you be free from your passion and pride?
There’s power in the blood, power in the blood;
Come for a cleansing to Calvary’s tide;
There’s wonderful power in the blood.

There is power, power, wonder working power
In the blood of the Lamb;
There is power, power, wonder working power
In the precious blood of the Lamb.

Would you be whiter, much whiter than snow?
There’s power in the blood, power in the blood;
Sin stains are lost in its life giving flow.
There’s wonderful power in the blood.

There is power, power, wonder working power
In the blood of the Lamb;
There is power, power, wonder working power
In the precious blood of the Lamb.

Would you do service for Jesus your King?
There’s power in the blood, power in the blood;
Would you live daily His praises to sing?
There’s wonderful power in the blood.

There is power, power, wonder working power
In the blood of the Lamb;
There is power, power, wonder working power
In the precious blood of the Lamb."*

This hymn never made as much sense to me when I was a Protestant as it does now that I’m a Catholic, and know what it means to receive the Blood of Jesus in the Eucharist.

 

[isaac.madsen]

Maybe you need to find out God wants. You need to start buy reading the Bible not the Book or Mormon. Your ideas are just that - your Ideas.

That’s certainly true. I’ve been through a lot of the Bible, but quite frankly I haven’t read all the way through it. I was never encouraged to as a Mormon. I’ve always been told the Book of Mormon was more important. I’ve never felt any connection with the BoM though, whereas the Bible always has something to it. Quite frankly, I still keep a critical mind of the Bible because I do not believe it can have gone through 2000 years without undergoing changes, revisions, etc. It’s the same with any text. The book wasn’t written by God, or even angels. It was written by men in representation of God. There is a huge difference. Men are prone to error and evil. I will not rest my salvation on any book alone (unless it’s given to me straight from God himself - unlikely though). It’s just too risky, thank you. I believe that developing a prayerful relationship with God is far more important that any amount of reading I may ever do, but that’s just my opinion.

 

[isaac.madsen]

Here’s an interesting link regarding the stone-in-hat story:

mrm.org/topics/book-mormon/seer-stone-and-hat-translating-book-mormon

 

[GrammasRose]

No problem. It makes a lot of sense, really. What is the first great commandment? “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.”

Matthew 22:37
Mark 12:30
Luke 10:27
Hebrews 8:10, 10:16
Philippians 4:7

I hadn’t thought of it in that way Thanks for adding to that.

 

[GrammasRose]

She did. She claimed the book of mormon to be a work of god to her husband whom she married after Joseph was murdered.

can you tell me the source you gathered that from?

 

[GrammasRose]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news here but the mormons were driven from their homes on numerous occasions and did not receive an indian head nickel for their property. Likewise, when Brigham and the saints headed west, all property was left behind. I seriously doubt that the local townspeople purchased mormon property before the mormons left. And the mormon city of Nauvoo was destroyed.

Do you see my point?

After Joseph’s martyrdom in June 1844, Emma unfortunately became a symbol of the dissension within the Church. Unable to condone continuation of the practice of plural marriage or the leadership of Brigham Young, who supported it, and ambivalent about the proper line of succession to her husband, Emma made her first priority after her husband’s death the preservation of an inheritance for her five living children. Distinguishing Joseph’s personal property from that of the Church defied easy solution, however, and involved Brigham Young and Emma Smith in a series of complex and often bitter legal entanglements. Brigham Young, as president of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles and steward of the Church, claimed all that he felt rightfully belonged to its members. Emma Smith, as guardian of Joseph’s children, just as vigorously claimed their share, to which she had contributed throughout her marriage to Joseph. Unable to reach an amicable solution and unwilling to accept plural marriage even in principle, Emma elected to remain in Nauvoo with her family while Brigham Young led the majority of Church members to the Rocky Mountains in 1846. On December 23, 1847, Emma Smith married Lewis Bidamon, a non-Mormon, further estranging her from the Church, to which she had once been known as the Elect Lady. Bidamon assisted Emma in raising her five children and remained her companion until her death in 1879 in Nauvoo.

lightplanet.com/mormons/people/emma_smith.html

 

[GrammasRose]

And here are Emma’s last days:

**In the spring of 1879 Emma had a dream that “the prophet came and took her to a beautiful mansion. In one of the rooms was a baby. . .her child Don Carlos [who died as an infant]. She dreamed she caught the child up in her arms and wept. When she regained her composure, she asked Joseph where the rest of the children were. He assured her that if she would be patient, she would have them all.” [1]

In her old age Emma continued to grow weaker. By April all of Emma’s children found their way to the Mansion House in Nauvoo. Joseph III kept a “day-by-day account” of Emma’s declining health. During the night of April 29 Joseph III saw “his mother rise herself up and extend her left arm. ‘Joseph!’ [he] heard her say. ‘Yes, yes, I’m coming.’” Emma died at 4:20 a.m. on April 30, 1879. [2]

Her memorial service was held on Friday 2 May 1879 in Nauvoo, Illinois. Asleep in Jesus! Blessed Sleep! was amoung the hymns sung by the choir that day. Today Emma lies in Nauvoo, next to Joseph and Hyrum**

Any comments? It seems that she still believed in her first husband Joseph.

kirtlandtemple.org/hymns/funeral.htm

Emma Smith Bidamon’s final years in Nauvoo were family-focused and private. She shared the Nauvoo House, her final home, with relatives and friends and basked in the love and care of her children and grandchildren. She continued to live her life with genteel qualities, meeting adversity and difficulty with grace and equanimity. She was polite to the “Utah Mormons” who occasionally visited, but was firm in her decision to remain apart from them.

Though Emma was publicly criticized by Church leaders for her failure to remain faithful to her husband’s mission, she was sympathetically remembered by some of her former Nauvoo friends. Many of them, unlike Emma, had found the courage to accept the doctrine of plural marriage. “I know it was hard for Emma, and any woman to enter plural marriage in those days,” wrote Emily Partridge Young, a plural wife, “and I do not know as anybody would have done any better than Emma did under the circumstances” (Woman’s Exponent 12 [Apr. 1, 1884]:165).

lightplanet.com/mormons/people/emma_smith.html

 

[isaac.madsen]

Emma died at 4:20… interesting timing.

 

[isaac.madsen]

Here is another interesting video:

youtube.com/watch?v=LKV-f6L8cjE

 

[Allweather]

That’s certainly true. I’ve been through a lot of the Bible, but quite frankly I haven’t read all the way through it. I was never encouraged to as a Mormon. I’ve always been told the Book of Mormon was more important. I’ve never felt any connection with the BoM though, whereas the Bible always has something to it. Quite frankly, I still keep a critical mind of the Bible because I do not believe it can have gone through 2000 years without undergoing changes, revisions, etc. It’s the same with any text. The book wasn’t written by God, or even angels. It was written by men in representation of God. There is a huge difference. Men are prone to error and evil. **I will not rest my salvation on any book alone **(unless it’s given to me straight from God himself - unlikely though). It’s just too risky, thank you. I believe that developing a prayerful relationship with God is far more important that any amount of reading I may ever do, but that’s just my opinion.

The whole question of “errors” in the Bible is complex, but once you understand how the Bible fits into the Church which wrote it, you won’t have so much trouble worrying about “rest(ing) your salvation on any book alone.” Catholics do not rest their salvation on any book alone, and neither should Mormons. In fact, this is an area of disagreement with the Protestants, who by-and-large have rejected the authority of the Church they broke away from, and gone flying off into doctinal wonderland as a result. The Bible cannot function as the sole norm of faith.

However, no more important set of writings has ever been collected, than the Bible. Connected to the Church which wrote and validated them, they are very worthy of your attention. You’ve been immersed in the BoM, to the exclusion of the Bible. Why don’t you begin studying for your new independence by reading the Bible? See if you can do it without reference to the peculiar interpretations of the Mormon religion. I doubt that you can, because indoctrinations are hard to overcome. That’s where the Catechism of the Catholic Church might come in handy, to explain what those Scriptures mean.

 

[Allweather]

Here is another interesting video:

youtube.com/watch?v=LKV-f6L8cjE

Very interesting. What brand of Mormons does this lady represent?

At the end she seems to be at least close to a Christian trinitarian view, and saying that this is what the BoM teaches.

I just think it is a shame that all this time, energy, and resources are being wasted by all this arguing over inconsequential false prophets.

 

[GrammasRose]

What I find most strange about the “peep stone” is that, even though Joseph claimed to be in possession of the urim and thummim which he claimed enabled prophets to translate, he never used them. Instead, he “translated” using a “peep stone” he found while digging a well.

BTW, though Joseph described the urim and thummim as “crystal spectacles in gold wire frames”, experts have said that the urim and thummim were white and black stones (in the ancient Cannanite language urim = “the whites”; thummim = “the blacks”) used by the ancients to make a decision between two things. They would put the stones in a leather bag and pull one out, trusting God to make the choice. White meant yes and black meant no. Or you could assign values to the white and black (like “Matthias or Barnabas”?).

Paul

That is interesting about the urim and thummin. Where did you get that info if I may ask?

 

[GrammasRose]

I’m speaking of a more mature Christianity. After spending most of my life trying to bring God into line with my hopes and desires, I’ve realized that it is far more beneficial to bring myself into line with His. Only in God’s will can our own destinies be fully appreciated. To the extent that we are “independent” of God’s will, we are failing as human beings.

Kiss His feet? I’m too unworthy of so great an honor. In heaven, though, washed in the blood of the lamb, I hope to join the unending choirs of angels and saints, worshipping the Lamb who was slain.

You bring God up a notch rather than down a notch. I like that. That is how it should be. I have found to often the LDS believe in God as equal in many ways. Or I should say Jesus as equal since they believe they are separate beings and that they can become as God. In my opinion that lowers God to our level and he is worthy of so much more.from us.

 

[GrammasRose]

Maybe you need to find out God wants. You need to start buy reading the Bible not the Book or Mormon. Your ideas are just that - your Ideas.

I agree with you. He is confused however. Mormonism can cause a great deal of confusion to those who leave or are thinking about it.

 

[deb1024]

That’s certainly true. I’ve been through a lot of the Bible, but quite frankly I haven’t read all the way through it. I was never encouraged to as a Mormon. I’ve always been told the Book of Mormon was more important. I’ve never felt any connection with the BoM though, whereas the Bible always has something to it. Quite frankly, I still keep a critical mind of the Bible because I do not believe it can have gone through 2000 years without undergoing changes, revisions, etc. It’s the same with any text. The book wasn’t written by God, or even angels. It was written by men in representation of God. There is a huge difference. Men are prone to error and evil. I will not rest my salvation on any book alone (unless it’s given to me straight from God himself - unlikely though). It’s just too risky, thank you. I believe that developing a prayerful relationship with God is far more important that any amount of reading I may ever do, but that’s just my opinion.

Pick up a copy of the Case for Christ by Lee Strobel, you can get the paper back for next to nothing at any used book store. You don’t have to read the whole thing (but it is a good book) just read the parts referencing the bible and how it has been passed down to us. This might change your mind about changes, revisions, etc. If you believe in Christ as savior you must acknowledge the written accounts of Him and His apostles (Scripture). There are many proofs archaeological etc. of the Bible where as there are no proofs of the Book of Mormon. If you want to follow Christ you must get to know him.

 

[why_me]

That’s certainly true. I’ve been through a lot of the Bible, but quite frankly I haven’t read all the way through it. I was never encouraged to as a Mormon. I’ve always been told the Book of Mormon was more important. I’ve never felt any connection with the BoM though, whereas the Bible always has something to it. do, but that’s just my

Are you sure that you are a member of the lds church? At this moment, sunday school is studying the new testament for the entire year and last year, the old testament was covered. I have no idea what you are writing above. Mormons are encouraged to read the scriptures, whether it be the bible or the book of mormon or any other scripture the mormons have. My gosh Isaac, I cannot believe that you wrote what you wrote. It just leaves me a little suspicious of you. My daughter is also studying the bible in young women’s.

 

[christianley]

Are you sure that you are a member of the lds church? At this moment, sunday school is studying the new testament for the entire year and last year, the old testament was covered. I have no idea what you are writing above. Mormons are encouraged to read the scriptures, whether it be the bible or the book of mormon or any other scripture the mormons have. My gosh Isaac, I cannot believe that you wrote what you wrote. It just leaves me a little suspicious of you. My daughter is also studying the bible in young women’s.

They may study it in Sunday School, but at least in the ward my wife attends there is a constant drumbeat of read the Book of Mormon with your family. There is no similar plea to read the Bible. The same comes from President Hinckley.

 

[thomasf]

You bring God up a notch rather than down a notch. I like that. That is how it should be. I have found to often the LDS believe in God as equal in many ways. Or I should say Jesus as equal since they believe they are separate beings and that they can become as God. In my opinion that lowers God to our level and he is worthy of so much more.from us.

It lowers the level of God but also raises the level of man. Which appeals to those who don’t want to believe they’re sinners or necessarily bad people that need help getting closer to God. It appeals to people looking to escape from how menial their world is. Which is why the lds church appeals to so many people. It gets you closer to God’s level, not necessarily closer to God.

 

[why_me]

They may study it in Sunday School, but at least in the ward my wife attends there is a constant drumbeat of read the Book of Mormon with your family. There is no similar plea to read the Bible. The same comes from President Hinckley.

There was a suggestion that the lds read the book of mormon during the year. I believe that this was last year. It was also encouraged to refect on its meaning. However, that was an one off. At this moment all are studying the new testament in sunday school and so Isaac is not correct in what he wrote. Also last year, the old testament was covered and the book of mormon was encouraged to read on a member’s own time.

 

[GrammasRose]

It lowers the level of God but also raises the level of man. Which appeals to those who don’t want to believe they’re sinners or necessarily bad people that need help getting closer to God. It appeals to people looking to escape from how menial their world is. Which is why the lds church appeals to so many people. It gets you closer to God’s level, not necessarily closer to God.

I agree and that is a very apt description of how it really is too. It is quite different in that sense from the Catholic faith.