A Case for Once Saved Always Saved

[Prodigal_Son1]

Mat 24:45 Who, thinkest thou, is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath appointed over his family, to give them meat in season?
Mat 24:46 Blessed is that servant, whom when his lord shall come he shall find so doing.
Mat 24:47 Amen I say to you: he shall place him over all his goods.
Mat 24:48 But if that evil servant shall say in his heart: My lord is long a coming:
Mat 24:49 And shall begin to strike his fellow servants and shall eat and drink with drunkards:
Mat 24:50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day that he hopeth not and at an hour that he knoweth not:
Mat 24:51 And shall separate him and appoint his portion with the hypocrites. There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

[elvisman]

Jesus said he would not lose even one person whom the Father had given him. Thus, anyone who makes a sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior is secure in God’s promise of eternal life. Christ will not let his people be overcome by Satan and lose their salvation. This is in reference to John 6:39 about salvation.

WRONG.
Jesus said:
"And this is the will of the one who sent me, that I should not lose anything of what he gave me, but that I should raise it (on) the last day."

It is also the will of God that ALL men be saved - but that is not going to happen. Not ALL will enter heaven.
God will never turn away from us - but we CAN turn away from him (John 6:66) - just as in the story of the Prodigal Son. The father never gave up on the son. It was the son who gave up on the father, then he came back when he had nowhere else to go.

You will only attain eternal life if you endure to the end. I have already provided many verses that prove this to be true. Here are a few of them again for your edification:

Romans 11:22****
“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God’s kindness to you, provided you remain in his kindness; otherwise you too will be cut off.”

---

Hebrews 10:26-27****
“If we sin deliberately after receiving knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”

---

2 Peter 2:20-21****
**For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of (our) Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first. **
**For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them. **

Matt. 7:21
“Not everyone who says to me, “Lord, Lord” shall enter the kingdom of heaven."

 

[elvisman]

First things first. Charity. I am not being condescending or trying to belittle you. So tone it down a bit, friend.

I have no problem with the concept of Trinity because Jesus tells us in Matt 28:19. I don’t have to refer to the “Trinity” to understand God’s nature, but we aren’t talking about God’s nature. We can talk about how the Empire State Building isn’t in the Bible but it still exists, but all of this proves absolutely nothing. You are the one who is going off the debate topic and I am trying to get us back.

So, if you have some point buried deep in your post that I missed, please be so kind and to bring it front and center so we can discuss it.

Unless somehow purgatory was your proof against OSAS and then I need to flush that out a bit.

And to answer yor random question. Yes. I taught debate for 9 years. My team won a national championship.

**Charity? **
First of all, I haven’t shown any less charity than you have in some of your smug posts. You seem to have a real problem with the facts as they pertain to Scripture and are attempting to use the debate tactics you loearned in school by rationalizing the truth.

You have been given ample evidence that proves the exact opposite of what you’re trying to prove but you turn a blind eye.

Finally, it makes no difference to me if your team won a worldwide debate championship. You’re not doing a very good job at proving your point here.

 

[elvisman]

You can’t take 7:21 and leave the rest behind. Jesus is speaking of false prophets!

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

**Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? **

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Silly you, using the Bible in context!

Whis is a lot more than you’ve done on this thread . . .

**I’ve only seen a slew of mass rationalization from you, Rocket_Man and others in an attempt to prove OSAS because it cannot be proven from the Scriptures - umm, when read in CONTEXT.

Context is the key.

A false prophet is ANYBODY who perverts the Gospel message or twists the Scriptures to their own destruction (1 Pet. 3:16).

 

[RebeccaJ]

Your first premise is WRONG. Salvation is NOT A CONTRACT.
If you want a contract that ensures your salvation, believe whatever you want.
However, if you want a living, real, good relationship with God, you must do what God wills. Otherwise, you won’t have a very good relationship with Him. If you don’t think that matters, again, believe whatever you want and do whatever you please.
You might think you have a contract with God, but you won’t have a decent relationship with Him.

Did God offer you salvation?

Did you accept?

You have a contract. Ask any lawyer.

I agree with poetryforJesus. Salvation is not a contract, it is a gift. Particularly this part: “He would be a fool to offer it again.” God does not offer Salvation, then not, then OK maybe, then nope, not. Who believes this?

 

[tweetymom]

Jesus said he would not lose even one person whom the Father had given him. Thus, anyone who makes a sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior is secure in God’s promise of eternal life. Christ will not let his people be overcome by Satan and lose their salvation. This is in reference to John 6:39 about salvation.

Amen Rev.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Jesus said he would not lose even one person whom the Father had given him. Thus, anyone who makes a sincere commitment to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior is secure in God’s promise of eternal life. Christ will not let his people be overcome by Satan and lose their salvation. This is in reference to John 6:39 about salvation.

verse 70

Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you twelve? Yet is not one of you a devil?”

 

[Xavierlives]

There is a trial going on in Kansas right now. A man walked into a church and pulled out a gun and shot killed another man.

The dead man was a doctor who regularly performed abortions. Who sinned?

I’ll go ahead and answer. The doctor was living a life of sin. He was killing babies and going to church. God abhors a life of sin. The murderer commited one sin. God abhors sin. Was either man acting under God’s authority. No. Did God know it was going to happen? Sure did. What is their fate under God? We don’t know the murderer’s heart or the man who shot him. We can look to them and see Christ saying, “don’t do this!”

So, to your questions.

The point of all scripture is that you can lose your salvation.
Let me ask you this.
Once you accept Christ as you personal savior and you are born again you cannot lose your salvation. Correct?

Me? Correct. I will not lose my salvation.

What happens if you backslide? Let say you commit adultery, you do not ask God to forgive you, are you still saved? Yes or no

What is backslide? Living in sin? Living with sin? Is the sin you talk of a sin against God or a sin against man (or woman in this case)?

To answer the question though, a sinner asks for forgiveness and they are forgiven. Salvation was never an issue.

Lets say you molest a small child, you do not ask God to forgive you, are you still saved?yes or no.

You obviously do not understand molestation. Molestation is a life of sin. A person doesn’t accidently slip up and molest a child. When you are in a life of sin you are outside the fellowship of God. You can return to him as the prodigal son did, but it means leaving the life of sin and returning to God.

Please don’t tell me that someone who is saved would never do those things. We have free will, or do we?

Although I answer it above, the whole point to OSAS and the prodigal son story.

I am not saying the man who did the killing is sinless, I am saying he is not living a life in sin. The last I heard, he is truly sorry. He says he has asked for forgiveness.

 

[rev_kevin]

verse 70

Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you twelve? Yet is not one of you a devil?”

Do you think Judas was sincere?
Do you think Jesus chose Judas because he knew he was going to betray him?
Do you think Jesus made a mistake about choosing Judas?

See some people left, others stayed and truly believed and some, like Judas, stayed but tried to use Jesus for personal gain. Now many people today turn away from Christ. Others pertend to follow, you know, by going to church for status approval of family and friends or business contracts. But there are only 2 real responses to Jesus, yolu either accept him or reject him.

 

[zach_dunn]

Do you think Judas was sincere?
Do you think Jesus chose Judas because he knew he was going to betray him?
Do you think Jesus made a mistake about choosing Judas?

See some people left, others stayed and truly believed and some, like Judas, stayed but tried to use Jesus for personal gain. Now many people today turn away from Christ. Others pertend to follow, you know, by going to church for status approval of family and friends or business contracts. But there are only 2 real responses to Jesus, yolu either accept him or reject him.

John 13:27
And after the morsel, Satan entered into him. And Jesus said to him: That which thou dost, do quickly.

This seems to imply that before the morsel he was without Satan, no? Your position mandates that you believe Judas was out to get Jesus the entire time he was with Him . . . this is simply untrue.

 

[GodLovesTheSpek]

Is a contract a work?

 

[Third_Day]

=Xavierlives;6204225]

So, to your questions.
Me? Correct. I will not lose my salvation.
What is backslide? Living in sin? Living with sin? Is the sin you talk of a sin against God or a sin against man (or woman in this case)?

To answer the question though, a sinner asks for forgiveness and they are forgiven. Salvation was never an issue.

That’s not what I asked. I asked if you commited adultery and did not ask for forgiveness, would you still be saved?

You obviously do not understand molestation. Molestation is a life of sin. A person doesn’t accidently slip up and molest a child. When you are in a life of sin you are outside the fellowship of God.

What if it was the first time he molested a child.Was he still saved ?

You can return to him as the prodigal son did, but it means leaving the life of sin and returning to God

How would he show God that he has left his life of sin and is retutning to God?

I am not saying the man who did the killing is sinless, I am saying he is not living a life in sin. The last I heard, he is truly sorry. He says he has asked for forgiveness

.
Now you are sounding like a Catholic. He was truly sorry and asked for forgiveness. Those are necessary works for salvation.

 

[Third_Day]

Now many people today turn away from Christ. Others pertend to follow, you know, by going to church for status approval of family and friends or business contracts. But there are only 2 real responses to Jesus, yolu either accept him or reject him.

Rev Kevin. You are currently saved, correct? If you commit adultery and do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved?

 

[rev_kevin]

John 13:27
And after the morsel, Satan entered into him. And Jesus said to him: That which thou dost, do quickly.

This seems to imply that before the morsel he was without Satan, no? Your position mandates that you believe Judas was out to get Jesus the entire time he was with Him . . . this is simply untrue.

Yes Jesus knew he would let Satan in. Doesn’t he know everything.

 

[rev_kevin]

Rev Kevin. You are currently saved, correct? If you commit adultery and do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved?

Yes and yes. Does God take salvation away from anyone who accepts him even if they done wrong. People who are saved sin everyday. Do you go to a priest and confess your sins everyday? If not then you are not saved until you do confess to a priest.
If you do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved. Yes you are still saved but you are out of fellowship with God.

 

[tweetymom]

Yes and yes. Does God take salvation away from anyone who accepts him even if they done wrong. People who are saved sin everyday. Do you go to a priest and confess your sins everyday? If not then you are not saved until you do confess to a priest.
If you do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved. Yes you are still saved but you are out of fellowship with God.

Very nicely put. I am still saved just need a little forgiveness once in awhile. Daily if the truth be known.

 

[Third_Day]

=rev kevin;6204595]Yes and yes

.So you truly believe that you can commit adultery, not confess, and still be saved.?? THis is a dangerous doctrine. I really believe that this is a doctrine of demons.
What does the apostle John say? “If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness” 1 John 1:9
IF we confess…That means everytime we sin, not just one time and then you can commit adultery, incest, homosexual acts and you still have salvation.

Does God take salvation away from anyone who accepts him even if they done wrong. People who are saved sin everyday

.
ANd you need to confess and truly repent and “go sin no more”

Do you go to a priest and confess your sins everyday? If not then you are not saved until you do confess to a priest.

Not all sins are deadly, Rev. Kevin. Scripture clearly shows us that

1 John 5:16-17 There is sin which is deadly…all wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin which is not deadly"
Deadly (mortal) sin that is not forgiven through confession to God will send you to hell.

If you do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved. Yes you are still saved but you are out of fellowship with God.

What does “out of fellowship with God” mean? Doesn’t that mean that you no loner abide in Him?

John15 Jesus says “If anyone does not abide in Me…, he is cut off …as a dried branch …and burned.”

 

[Third_Day]

Very nicely put. I am still saved just need a little forgiveness once in awhile. Daily if the truth be known.

tweetymom, am I reading you right?. You can commit adultery, incest, homosexuality, murder and not confess and repent and you will still be saved. Do you realize what you are saying?

 

[ufamtobie]

Yes and yes. Does God take salvation away from anyone who accepts him even if they done wrong. People who are saved sin everyday. Do you go to a priest and confess your sins everyday? If not then you are not saved until you do confess to a priest.

If you do not ask God for forgiveness are you still saved. Yes you are still saved but you are out of fellowship with God.

Rev Kevin,

Your true colors are showing here.

(John 17: 12) While I was with them, I kept them in thy name. Those whom thou gavest me have I kept; and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition, that the scripture may be fulfilled.

Son of Perdition aka Judas! Judas at one point was saved, then he lost his salvation. So with any Christian who accepts Jesus Christ and then by his or her own will accepts him no longer by a sin he or she is not willing to give up and at the end not confessing it…wow lets put it this way, I sure would hate to be in thier shoes at the end.

Yes, one can loose his or her salvation.

It would be better for him or her not to have ever known Jesus Christ, than for him or her to known Jesus Christ, and then left Him because of a Mortal Sin.

Rev. Kevin, I hope you don’t find out the Truth the hard way because then it will be too late.

UfamTobie

 

[Xavierlives]

That’s not what I asked. I asked if you commited adultery and did not ask for forgiveness, would you still be saved?

Not to brush the question aside but in this hypothetical it is difficult to just look into the heart of the man. I’d have to say, it is between him and God.

What if it was the first time he molested a child.Was he still saved ?
How would he show God that he has left his life of sin and is retutning to God?

Hmm… well Moses murdered a man and he was in fellowship with God, so there must be a way.

Now you are sounding like a Catholic. He was truly sorry and asked for forgiveness. Those are necessary works for salvation.

Do Catholics hold the keys to forgiveness?