Adoration idolatry a blessed bread host

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I don’t know about that, it seems to me from an Eastern Orthodox priest I had as a professor and talked to just yesterday, that they do believe in transubstantiation but they don’t use the term. In fact I remember him saying that when I was in class, he said we say it becomes the body and blood of Christ but we don’t say how.
 
Again, wrong. It’s the same concept with different terminology and traditions at use. It has never really been a problem with Catholics and Orthodox on this issue because both sides acknowledge each other as holding to the same concept, with different traditions. It is true that some Orthodox can be hostile to scholastic tradition in regards to the Eucharist, but the concept is still the same for both Catholics and Orthodox. There is no difference in doctrine between us in regards to the kind of change that takes place in the Eucharist.
He is not present typically, nor figuratively, nor by superabundant grace, as in the other Mysteries, nor by a bare presence, as some of the Fathers have said concerning Baptism, or by impanation, so that the Divinity of the Word is united to the set forth bread of the Eucharist hypostatically, as the followers of Luther most ignorantly and wretchedly suppose.

But truly and really, so that after the consecration of the bread and of the wine, the bread is transmuted, transubstantiated, converted and transformed into the true Body itself of the Lord, Which was born in Bethlehem of the ever-Virgin, was baptized in the Jordan, suffered, was buried, rose again, was received up, sits at the right hand of the God and Father, and is to come again in the clouds of Heaven; and the wine is converted and transubstantiated into the true Blood itself of the Lord, Which as He hung upon the Cross, was poured out for the life of the world.

Orthodox Confession of Dositheus, Patriarch of Jerusalem (1672)
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“He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life,I will raise him up on the last day”
John6:56🙏
 
Yes, and so Orthodox and Catholics hold to the same doctrine of the Eucharist, there is no difference except in regards to our different traditions. If you aren’t aware, Eastern Catholics are the same as Orthodox in this matter, they tend to avoid use of the word Transubstantiation and avoid explaining the definite time of change, but clearly they hold to the same doctrine. If they didn’t, they wouldn’t be in communion with Rome.
 
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“Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, “Take, eat; this is my body.” And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, “Drink of it, all of you; for this is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.” Matthew 26:26-28
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Since we understand that the one true God is present in the Eucharist, what do you suggest we do besides worship it?
 
Yes, adoring a bread host that you have been deceived into believing it is the divinity of God is Idolatry…

But Catholics do not participate in such activities.

Catholics have Adoration of the Blessed Sacrament, in which we take time to adore the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ which has been made possible through the confection of the bread host into the Body of Christ by a priest who has been validly ordained by a bishop with valid apostolic succession. This priesthood was instituted by Christ himself.

Aristotle made a distinction between the essential and accidental properties of a thing. For example, a chair can be made of wood or metal, but this is accidental to its being a chair: it is in essence still a chair regardless of the material from which it is made.

To put this in technical terms, an accident is a property which has no necessary connection or effect to the essence or substance of the thing being described.

Catholic theologians such as Thomas Aquinas have employed the Aristotelian concepts of substance and accident in articulating the theology of the Eucharist, particularly the transubstantiation of bread and wine into body and blood.

Through Transubstantiation, the accidents of the appearance of bread and wine do not change, but the entire substance changes from bread and wine to the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Christ.

Transubstantiation is the English version of the Latin word transsubstantiatio. It contains the following word elements:

** trans** - “to cross over, across, beyond, through, on the other side of, to go beyond”
substantia - translates Greek ousia meaning “that which is one’s own, one’s substance or property; the being, essence, or nature of anything.”

The Greek word for transubstantiation is metousiosis which means “a change of essence, inner reality.”

The word essence comes from the Latin word essentia, meaning “being, essence,” (to translate Greek ousia “being, essence”) from essent and esse which mean “to be.”
 
John 6:51-57
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven.
52 If any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever; and the bread that I will give, is my flesh, for the life of the world.
53 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying: How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
54 Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you.
55 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.
56 For my flesh is meat indeed: and my blood is drink indeed.
57 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, abideth in me, and I in him.
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[57 – eateth = trogon = chewing or gnawing]

If Jesus didn’t mean it or it was misunderstood, he would have corrected the misunderstanding when they said “This is a hard saying! Who can listen to it?”

Instead, he continues to further reiterate the “hard saying”:
John 6:58-71
58 This is the bread which came down from heaven, not such as the fathers ate and died; he who eats this bread will live for ever."
59 This he said in the synagogue, as he taught at Caperna-um.
60 Many of his disciples, when they heard it, said, “This is a hard saying; who can listen to it?”
61 But Jesus, knowing in himself that his disciples murmured at it, said to them, “Do you take offense at this?
62 Then what if you were to see the Son of man ascending where he was before?
63 It is the spirit that gives life, the flesh is of no avail; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life.
64 But there are some of you that do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the first who those were that did not believe, and who it was that would betray him.
65 And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”
66 After this many of his disciples drew back and no longer went about with him.
67 Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also wish to go away?”
68 Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life;
69 and we have believed, and have come to know, that you are the Holy One of God.”
70 Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the twelve, and one of you is a devil?”
71 He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the twelve, was to betray him.
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Jesus was willing to let everyone walk away over this one teaching because it is truth. Many could not accept it, but we as Christians are called to believe just as the the few who stayed with Him did, for He “has the words of eternal life.”

John 6 is crucial to our understanding and belief in the Real Presence.
 
If by idolatry you mean intending to offer divine worship to someone or something other than the one true God, then, no, I don’t think Catholics commit idolatry because they intend to offer divine worship not to bread per se but to Jesus Christ, who is the one true God.

Even if Catholics are mistaken about transubstantiation and Jesus Christ’s glorified, physical body is not really and substantially present where the appearance of bread remains after its consecration, I don’t think Catholics commit idolatry because Jesus is still spiritually present there in the space occupied by the bread by virtue of his divinity, as he is spiritually present everywhere. Omnipresence being an attribute of the one true God.
 
No need to defend revealed truth. The OP needs to defend his/her erroneous allegations. The burden of proof is on the accuser. Evangelical Christianity is a very recent development that is based on the bible. Where did Christ mention the New Testament, or make it a sole rule, or suggest that Christians run to the printed page to resolve disputes?

He did not. He founded a Church and gave it all authority. I know that the NIV has Acts 15 in it - my copy certainly has the chapter. It’s just that it is either not read, or twisted to mean something else since it lays bare the sand foundation of bible alone.
 
I was raised a Catholic and understand the emotional depth associated with belief in the real presence. But to respond to a few points in this thread: 1) I’m not entirely sure what ‘worship’ is and how it can be logically defined and separated from blessing, adoration and prayer. These words get thrown around at lot and I see them used as synonyms. So if we are going to have a debate about ‘worship’, lets define it. 2) Apart from references to other religions in the Bible I have been unable to find any religion apart from Catholicism and its cousins that actually worships a material object in the belief that the object itself IS a god. ‘Idols’ as they are described by Christians are invariably regarded as the house of a god, or a representative of a god. Does anyone have an example from a non-Bible source? If there are no such examples, it would seem the concern about ‘idolatry’ is seriously flawed. 3) If we accept Catholic teaching on both Anglican and Lutheran orders and on the real presence and the sin of ‘idolatry’ then there is a whole lot of that going on in Lutheran and high Anglican churches as they worship pieces of bread. Why do Catholics not call this out? 4) On the scriptural basis of belief on the real presence: Jesus said that the bread and wine was his body and blood. Interestingly he did not say it was ‘himself’ or what the hymn calls ‘His soul and divinity’. The plain words mean that the bread is his physical body and the blood is his physical blood. And of course it would be sinful to worship anyone’s body and/or blood. You may worship only God. And when he said ‘do this in memory of me’ what was the ‘this’ he meant? Cause transubstantiation? Confect the eucharist? ‘whenever you eat and drink’? Hold memorial events at which you drink bread and wine? How do we know?
 
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Me too. In my viewpoint, nothing can compare with the beauty of the Eucharist itself, so there is no way a Monstrance can be too ornate.
Just my personal taste.
We have a new one that has rays that appear to spin as Father moves it to the four directions (the way the light hits it) …it’s quite lovely.
 
AveOTheotokos said:
54 Then Jesus said to them: Amen, amen I say unto you: Except you eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, you shall not have life in you.
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If this is taken literally, then how would that apply to a Jew ?
 
Just like with God’s previous covenants, Jesus was establishing a new practice.

For example, before Noah, eating meat was prohibited but God changed the practice after the flood. With Abraham, circumcision was used to establish a covenant. With Moses, there were dietary restrictions placed upon the Jews as an act of obedience and reparation of their covenant relationship with God.

In the case of Jesus, He had come to establish a new and everlasting covenant that all Jews would be bound to just as they were bound to previous covenants and their practices. He would willingly offer himself as a perfect, eternal sacrifice, ending the practice of animal sacrifices and establish a new covenant in His blood.

At every Mass, this eternal sacrifice is made present to us.
 
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