Adultery?

[ajecphotos]

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

Is the above adultery?

 

[Ignatius]

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

Near occasions of sin.
The claim of the spouses lacking something is the standard excuse for this.

 

[Cathoholic]

ajecphoto. You asked:

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

Is the above adultery?

Your question seems to implicitly rationalize this sort of illicit behavior (“Both sets of partners are non loving").

If this behavior is OK, why not carry on this way in front of both spouses (why behind their own spouses backs as your question implies)?

You know WHY. Because it is illicit behavior, THEY KNOW it is illicit behavior, and the rest of their families would be appalled if they were to be subjected to this scandal and disgrace because they know it is illicit behavior.

MATTHEW 5:27-28 27 "You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

The answer to your question is an easy one for those with eyes to see.

But for those involved in this, they’ve already chosen to darken their intellect through their sin (Having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their hearts.—Ephesians 4:18—Mark Shea refers to this concept as “Sin makes you stupid”) and may not see it as easy as you or I.

They need to repent and go to the Confessional ASAP.

I hope this helps.

God bless.

Cathoholic

 

[Tablefor9]

Emotional affair. Still an affair. Giving to another that which should belong to the spouse. Involved parties should cut it out and hit the bench at confessional tomorrow if not today, build in accountability and boundaries. Stop it right now, this would devastate the “non loving” spouses if they knew, which is why they don’t know, right?

 

[Beryllos]

The question seems to assume that adultery is all about sex, but is that true? I think marriage involves other kinds of love and support, though some are not exclusive. For example, a father may cuddle his son or daughter. Under what circumstances does cuddling constitute “cheating” or betrayal?

 

[marlap2]

Your loyalty to your spouse will be divided. You are receiving from this person what you should be receiving from your spouse.

If it isn’t adultery, it is surely a near occasion of sin, and for the sake of your marriage, this should end now, even if you feel innocent.

As soon as you end this and go to confession, the clearer your mind, intellect and conscience will be about this.

Praying for you.

 

[MJJean]

The question seems to assume that adultery is all about sex, but is that true? I think marriage involves other kinds of love and support, though some are not exclusive. For example, a father may cuddle his son or daughter. Under what circumstances does cuddling constitute “cheating” or betrayal?

If they wouldn’t do it in front of their spouse or their priest they are doing something wrong.

It’s “cheating” and “betrayal” the second they A) realize they wouldn’t behave that way in front of their spouses or priest and B) have to rationalize it by saying their spouses give them no love at home.

I have a clue for this type of person. There is a REASON they aren’t getting that kind of love at home and that’s where they need to start putting in effort. At home. With their spouses. Where they belong.

 

[Evania]

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

Is the above adultery?

Who said adultery is only adultery if sex is involved?

I’m pretty sure Christ has spoken about people who try to split hairs on what constitutes adultery.

“You have heard that it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery.’ But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to desire her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” Mt 5:27-28

I don’t know if you’re describing yourself and another woman, but maybe you can look inward and see the sinfulness of what you’re doing and if that is why your wife is “unloving”. When you took vows did you promise before God to forsake all others and to be true through sickness and health, good times and in bad? Do you also believe that what God has joined together, no man can seperate? If you did, then why are you sneaking behind another man’s back romancing his wife, while your wife has no one? Can you blame her for being unloving, considering you are “loving” another man’s wife? True, she may not know the deception in order to act unloving to you, but usually when a third party is involved, it manifests in various ways in the relationship. Like I said, I don’t know if you are inquiring due to you being in this scenario, but if it is, please don’t focus on another man’s wife and instead repair what is missing with your wife. God Bless!

 

[bisco]

this is very sad. i pray that these people will see the error of their ways and find good counseling and marriage retreats. remember the spouse of your youth, what happened over time? it can be repaired. with God, all things are possible. God bless.

 

[Beryllos]

Pardon me I seem to be a troublemaker. The Original Post sounded rather hypothetical. I am not sure if the Original Poster was seeking advice. I do not intend to give advice, but I am curious about Catholic beliefs and attitudes related to sex and marriage.

Things are pretty simple when adultery is defined as sexual relations with a married person other than your spouse. If you define it any other way, I think you run into contradictions or logical inconsistencies, unless perhaps you are very precise with your words.

That’s what I meant to illustrate by pointing out that a husband may cuddle his children. He may also be affectionate with them and have “lovey feelings” about them. Therefore cuddling, affection, and lovey feelings are not essential elements of adultery. One might even have some of those behaviors and feelings with a brother or sister, or a close friend, or someone with whom one has shared a powerful experience (like surviving a disaster).

So, if cuddling, affection, and lovey feelings are not key to adultery, what is? What is the essential element that I’ve failed to recognize, if it is not sex?

By the way, I do not disagree with arguments along the lines of “near occasion of sin,” or committing adultery in one’s heart (Mt 5:27-28), but once again I think the sin relates to sex. If not sex, then what exactly is it?

 

[1ke]

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

This couple should STOP immediately.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

That is unfortunate. But your vow is to your spouse. Work on your marriage to the extent that you can.

Is the above adultery?

It is not adultery in the narrow sense of the word-- which would be sexual intercourse with someone other than your spouse. But it certainly is a sin against the marriage and the sixth commandment.

the two in question should talk to their priest in confessional.

 

[thistle]

Ok, married for 30 years. Gets very friendly with a member of opposite sex who is also married. No sex. But cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving. Both agree to no sex at all.

Both sets of partners are non loving so that is why above has happened.

Is the above adultery?

YES!

 

[PolarGuy]

The relevant question is not “is it adultery?” The relevant question is “is it morally wrong?” I can do a host of bad things that do not involve murder, but the fact that my actions are not murder does not mean the acts are morally licit.

The acts described are wrong on many levels. They give scandal. They denigrate the cuckolded (rarely used word!) spouses. They tend to destroy the bonds of matrimony. The same way the Bible says to render unto Caesar that which is Caesars; that carries an implied directive to render to those deserving of something, that thing, and this cannot by any length be considered rendering to ones spouse what the spouse deserves. They place the actors in a setting where more serious (physical) wrong acts may follow.

A Jewish friend told me about the concept of “building a wall around the Torah,” ie stay far away from wrongdoing, so we never even approach the boundaries of wrongdoing. This sin way way past the boundary: it’s a morally evil act.

 

[ajecphotos]

It is definitely cheating and unfair on the couples partners but what if the marriages were dead and nothing could revive them but they were still together only for the sake of the children?

If a woman or man get married and years down the line the marriage dries up and there is absolutely no love there at all even after years of trying what does one do?

 

[PolarGuy]

ajecphotos, if it’s “definitely cheating and unfair…,” as you write, then what more need is there to discuss it? If something’s wrong, it’s wrong, and your reasons given are just rationalization of the wrongness.

And it is rationalization. Marriage vows are “in good times and bad,” not “unless our marriage becomes physically cold” or “unless I decide I want to get physical cuddling from someone else.”

Attend counseling. Seek some guidance. But don’t start cuddling with someone not your spouse.

 

[Greg1963]

Emotional affair. Still an affair. Giving to another that which should belong to the spouse. Involved parties should cut it out and hit the bench at confessional tomorrow if not today, build in accountability and boundaries. Stop it right now, this would devastate the “non loving” spouses if they knew, which is why they don’t know, right?

EXACTLY!!!

I would be more tolerant of a purely sexual encounter that what has been described above as “cuddles, holding hands. Comforting and loving” which looks to be an emotional affair.

Having been married 25 years, non-sexual does NOT mean not loving.

I doubt the “cuddling” referred to here (in subsequent posts) is the same thing that a parent does to their child.

Get Thou to a Priest!!!

 

[MJJean]

It is definitely cheating and unfair on the couples partners but what if the marriages were dead and nothing could revive them but they were still together only for the sake of the children?

If a woman or man get married and years down the line the marriage dries up and there is absolutely no love there at all even after years of trying what does one do?

If a marriage dries up there is always a reason and that means there is very likely something that the couple can do to repair their relationship. It’s just much easier to rationalize and sneak around with someone else.

Ideally, what one does in such a situation is remain faithful and work on the marriage. If that’s not possible the decent thing to do would be to openly and honestly end the marriage. There’s no excuse to be unfaithful and sneaking around like that. Either be all in or all out.

 

[styrgwillidar]

If they wouldn’t do it in front of their spouse or their priest they are doing something wrong.

It’s “cheating” and “betrayal” the second they A) realize they wouldn’t behave that way in front of their spouses or priest and B) have to rationalize it by saying their spouses give them no love at home.

I have a clue for this type of person. There is a REASON they aren’t getting that kind of love at home and that’s where they need to start putting in effort. At home. With their spouses. Where they belong.

Yep. Old philosophical question in the Navy - is doing XX or YY being unfaithful?

Doing anything that you know your spouse wouldn’t want you doing is breaking their faith and trust in you and is wrong. Call it adultery, call it betrayal, call it what you will. But consider the vows taken in marriage re forsaking all others.

If you’re giving/getting something from/to someone that should be shared between yourself and your spouse you’ve violated the vow.

 

[ajecphotos]

I agree with all the above but, if one falls in love with someone else and they with you and you have a partner that is beyond reconciliation then it can be very difficult to stay loyal when all in the marriage has died! Staying together only for the sake of the children.

Yes, one has to take the good times with the bad but when all has been tried over many years to get the relationship back and nothing has succeeded then it must be time to part?

Surely God could see that if all has been tried and nothing works he would understand?

 

[davidv]

I agree with all the above but, if one falls in love with someone else and they with you and you have a partner that is beyond reconciliation then it can be very difficult to stay loyal when all in the marriage has died! Staying together only for the sake of the children.

Yes, one has to take the good times with the bad but when all has been tried over many years to get the relationship back and nothing has succeeded then it must be time to part?

Surely God could see that if all has been tried and nothing works he would understand?

What would God’s understanding look like? Did we not promise to our spouse, faithfulness in bad times?

What does God understand about unfaithfulness? He called the Israelites prostitutes for their unfaithfulness to Him.