Alabama Close to Enacting Arizona-Style Illegal Immigration Crackdown

[gilliam]

MONTGOMERY, Ala. – After years of debate, the Alabama Legislature is close to enacting an Arizona-style law cracking down on illegal immigrants and the people who hire them.

foxnews.com/politics/2011/05/01/alabama-close-enacting-arizona-style-illegal-immigration-crackdown/?test=latestnews

 

[starshiptrooper]

This is an excellent idea, however, if we want a permanent solution to illegal aliens, we need a fence on our side of the border. Otherwise, they will simply come back after we deport them.

 

[jcquezada77]

This is an excellent idea, however, if we want a permanent solution to illegal aliens, we need a fence on our side of the border. Otherwise, they will simply come back after we deport them.

Your view of immigration is absurd! Was Our Lord Jesus asked for his papers while wondering through the desert for 40 days an 40 nights. Your pseudo-christian beliefs of interogating people based on their features is disgusting. Immigrants did not cause our economic breakdown nor do they threaten our homeland security. it is the conservative base that is pushing this fallacy upon us

 

[kimmielittle]

Your view of immigration is absurd! Was Our Lord Jesus asked for his papers while wondering through the desert for 40 days an 40 nights.

An absurd argument IMO.

Are you suggesting that Jesus would break a law?
Douay-Rheims Bible
Mark 12:17

And Jesus answering, said to them: Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s. And they marvelled at him.

So no, Jesus was not asked His papers - But if there had been a law - He would have complied.

Who, in the desert, would ask Him?
My understanding is Jesus spent the time in solitude- other then being tempted.

There are laws about illegal immigration.

How are the South Americans, who illegally enter Mexico, treated?

The Holy Family Complied with laws.
Did you forget why The Holy Family had to go to Bethlehem to be counted for the census?

In Luke 2, Joseph lives in Nazareth and travels to Bethlehem, the city of David, in compliance with the requirements of a Roman census.

Your pseudo-christian beliefs of interogating people based on their features is disgusting.

Charity?

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

MONTGOMERY, Ala. – After years of debate, the Alabama Legislature is close to enacting an Arizona-style law cracking down on illegal immigrants and the people who hire them.

And a federal court will enjoin them as soon as it gets passed.

BTW, what good would a fence in the Gulf of Mexico do?

 

[mary_bobo]

Your view of immigration is absurd! Was Our Lord Jesus asked for his papers while wondering through the desert for 40 days an 40 nights. Your pseudo-christian beliefs of interogating people based on their features is disgusting. Immigrants did not cause our economic breakdown nor do they threaten our homeland security. it is the conservative base that is pushing this fallacy upon us

I respectfully suggest you read the rules of the forum before you post again. It will keep you on the forum rather than tossed by the wayside.

 

[Ender]

And a federal court will enjoin them as soon as it gets passed.

Probably so; the issue will ultimately be decided by the Supreme Court which is where the ruling on the Arizona law is headed. Arizona will not be alone, however, as Utah and Georgia have already passed similar laws … and it looks like Alabama will soon do the same. The interesting thing about this is that Missouri had already implemented a law very similar to Arizona’s which the government did not challenge. Hopefully this issue will be heard by the court prior to the 2012 elections.

Ender

 

[dixieagle]

I live in Alabama, and the mean-spiritedness of this law saddens me.

I’m all for toughening up laws on employers who hire undocumented workers; throw the book at them, follow through, and the problem will start to wither away. I find that this column, by my favorite local print journalist, sums it up nicely:

blog.al.com/press-register-commentary/2011/05/on_the_verge_of_a_new_kind_of.html#incart_mce

 

[Ender]

I live in Alabama, and the mean-spiritedness of this law saddens me.

If you’re looking for mean-spiritedness you need go no further than the article you cited:

*Here we are, in 21st century Alabama, and our Legislature is eager to pass a statute that, among other things, will allow law enforcement officers to detain a person if they have “reasonable suspicion” that he or she is in the U.S. unlawfully. (Translation: If you look Hispanic and you speak English poorly, you’ll be detained until you prove you’re here legally.) *

This claim is false and the woman who wrote the article is either ignorant of basic elements of the law (e.g. the legal definition of “reasonable suspicion”) or doesn’t care what it actually says. That statement is dishonest and deceitful. She may believe this is a reprieve of the Jim Crow laws of the past but that is her mean-spirited characterization of a law with which she disapproves. It is descriptive of nothing but her own inclinations.

She did make one comment with which I might agree: “In truth, getting rid of illegal aliens is probably as easy as drying up their source of income.” She wants employers of illegals to be fined and I have no problem with that suggestion, and if the current legislation does not include such provision then I think it would be improved by its inclusion … but the rest of her comments are unpleasant and silly.

Ender

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

If you’re looking for mean-spiritedness you need go no further than the article you cited:

*Here we are, in 21st century Alabama, and our Legislature is eager to pass a statute that, among other things, will allow law enforcement officers to detain a person if they have “reasonable suspicion” that he or she is in the U.S. unlawfully. (Translation: If you look Hispanic and you speak English poorly, you’ll be detained until you prove you’re here legally.) *

This claim is false and the woman who wrote the article is either ignorant of basic elements of the law (e.g. the legal definition of “reasonable suspicion”) or doesn’t care what it actually says.

Are you so familiar with Alabama police procedure that you can say that the claim is false? Reasonable suspicion is what the cop at the scene considers it to be and will act upon, and when you get to court, your lawyer can challenge it according to law.

 

[Ender]

Are you so familiar with Alabama police procedure that you can say that the claim is false? Reasonable suspicion is what the cop at the scene considers it to be and will act upon, and when you get to court, your lawyer can challenge it according to law.

It doesn’t take familiarity with Alabama law to know that “reasonable suspicion” means just that: reasonable. That’s a phrase that is surely common to the laws of all 50 states (or, for Obama, all 58 states) as well as the federal government.

Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard of proof in United States law that is less than probable cause, the legal standard for arrests and warrants, but more than an "inchoate and unparticularized suspicion or ‘hunch’ "; it must be based on “specific and articulable facts”, “taken together with rational inferences from those facts”

Now that’s just what Wikipedia says so I grant there is room for suspicion, still, I’m guessing this point isn’t all that contentious, but … you’re a lawyer aren’t you? You know all this stuff. You’re just teasing us.

Ender

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

It doesn’t take familiarity with Alabama law to know that “reasonable suspicion” means just that: reasonable. That’s a phrase that is surely common to the laws of all 50 states (or, for Obama, all 58 states) as well as the federal government.

Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard of proof in United States law that is less than probable cause, the legal standard for arrests and warrants, but more than an "inchoate and unparticularized suspicion or ‘hunch’ "; it must be based on “specific and articulable facts”, “taken together with rational inferences from those facts”

Now that’s just what Wikipedia says so I grant there is room for suspicion, still, I’m guessing this point isn’t all that contentious, but … you’re a lawyer aren’t you? You know all this stuff. You’re just teasing us.

Ender

Yes, I am an attorney and yes, you are correct. But, there’s often a disconnect between the street and the courtroom on interpretation.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

Another step closer to a police state. Sigh.

 

[kimmielittle]

All those that think the “Reasonable suspicion”, in these laws is unfair - Raise your hands.

While you have your hand raised can you answer this?

What Country / Police Force doesn’t use “Reasonable suspicion” to protect it’s law abiding citizenry?

Mexico has this one…Reglamento de la Ley General de Poblacion that leaves Mexico out ]

WHAT??? Can’t think of any Country or Police force who doesn’t use “Reasonable suspicion”…I rest my case - care to defend yours?

 

[kimmielittle]

Yes, I am an attorney and yes, you are correct. But, there’s often a disconnect between the street and the courtroom on interpretation.

Yes, correct - but for you to try to paint it as some sort of an American abuse is unreasonable.

“Reasonable suspicion” is used world wide. Even in Mexico

Any attempt to broad brush ALL Police Officers using “Reasonable suspicion” - is not your job.

It is Officers of the Legislative branch, attorneys you ], job… to protect any abusive use - On a case by case basis.

 

[Semper_Zelare]

Yes, I am an attorney and yes, you are correct. But, there’s often a disconnect between the street and the courtroom on interpretation.

I find the implication of this statement to be absolutely DISGUSTING. As a long term resident of the Great State of Alabama, I can attest to the police force being very decent and honourable.

As kimmielittle pointed out; you are BROAD BRUSHING the law enforcement here. Thanks for doing that.

Furthermore, I’ve been to a lot of the areas where Hispanics live here, and it’s not like they live in fear of the law. There are legitimate businesses which send their money back to families in Mexico and South America. However, at the same time… you have the drug trade which comes through here en route to Atlanta.

Just a few years ago, 5 headless Mexican bodies turned up in an Apartment complex not 10 minutes down the road. There were probably 30 or 40 police cars when I drove past it. So, I welcome this law in Alabama, to combat the drug trade here.

 

[Semper_Zelare]

My step dad immigrated legally to the United States from Colombia. It took a lot of time and efforts to become a U.S. citizen. He is also an ardent Catholic.

And it would be doing a disservice to him and all other legal immigrants who went through he legitimate process: going to get passports verified at embassies, and so on.

He obeyed the law. All the people who broke the law are guilty, and just read my signature for that. They could have full well gained citizenship the hard way, but they chose not to.

 

[kimmielittle]

I find the implication of this statement to be absolutely DISGUSTING. As a long term resident of the Great State of Alabama, I can attest to the police force being very decent and honourable.

As kimmielittle pointed out; you are BROAD BRUSHING the law enforcement here. Thanks for doing that.

Furthermore, I’ve been to a lot of the areas where Hispanics live here, and it’s not like they live in fear of the law. There are legitimate businesses which send their money back to families in Mexico and South America. However, at the same time… you have the drug trade which comes through here en route to Atlanta.

Just a few years ago, 5 headless Mexican bodies turned up in an Apartment complex not 10 minutes down the road. There were probably 30 or 40 police cars when I drove past it. So, I welcome this law in Alabama, to combat the drug trade here.

ABSOLUTELY!!

It also amazes me that this broad brushing goes against other legal criteria…“Reasonable Doubt” …“innocent until proven…”…" Due Process"… These seem, by some, to be dismissed criteria when applied to our Police Force…It only applies to someone “Reasonable suspected”.

What happens in Mexico or any other country ] if asked by a Police Officer for identification - and we offer none?

PS: You can call me kimmie, if you wish.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Yes, correct - but for you to try to paint it as some sort of an American abuse is unreasonable.

Cite where I called it an American abuse.

Any attempt to broad brush ALL Police Officers using “Reasonable suspicion” - is not your job.

Cite where I made an attempt to broad brush ALLpolice officers.

 

[mary_bobo]

My step dad immigrated legally to the United States from Colombia. It took a lot of time and efforts to become a U.S. citizen. He is also an ardent Catholic.

And it would be doing a disservice to him and all other legal immigrants who went through he legitimate process: going to get passports verified at embassies, and so on.

He obeyed the law. All the people who broke the law are guilty, and just read my signature for that. They could have full well gained citizenship the hard way, but they chose not to.

May God bless you and your family. I know it is frustrating to wait, but you must feel pride in your father for having done it the legal way.