M
- Status
K
KathleenGee
Guest
And beyond beliefs…there is the international and historic objective reality of how one treats one’s neighbor.
Any contradiction to the welfare of one’s neighbor and respecting their right to exist and freely choose is not from God but of human bondage and exploitation.
Likewise, I see so much of the Quoran as indeed copying from Jewish and Christian beliefs but sweeping over them with the posture to invalidate and re-create hundreds of years away from the people of origin of Judeo Christianity, and another belief system.
Such a belief system of Islam puts itself as enemy and conqueror towards those who truly represent the beliefs of Judaism and Christianity while hijacking our beliefs.
No show of God.
Any contradiction to the welfare of one’s neighbor and respecting their right to exist and freely choose is not from God but of human bondage and exploitation.
Likewise, I see so much of the Quoran as indeed copying from Jewish and Christian beliefs but sweeping over them with the posture to invalidate and re-create hundreds of years away from the people of origin of Judeo Christianity, and another belief system.
Such a belief system of Islam puts itself as enemy and conqueror towards those who truly represent the beliefs of Judaism and Christianity while hijacking our beliefs.
No show of God.
S
Servant19
Guest
Can you please show us one passage from the Quran where the welfare of ones neighbour is abolished or contradicted?
.
8
808Catholic
Guest
9:29 “Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.”
T
TonyBS
Guest
What are the passages before and after this passage.
It is important to Include them to understand the context of this passage.
There is a lot of spiritual wisdom in The above passage that needs context.
Much like Matthew 10:34" Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword".
As you can see if one has an agenda, it can be supported. Try finding the connection of Gods Wisdom and you will find it.
Regards Tony
8
808Catholic
Guest
You can provide the context by providing the passage before and after this text.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
TonyBS
What was the doctrine within Islam that brought about the destruction of Christian nations – Palestine, Syria, Egypt early on? Why or how did Ars Arslan, the father of Turkey, convert to Islam and destroy Christian Anatolia (Asia Minor) only so many hundred years ago, demonstrating the same MO of Islamic expansion? Constantinople the center of Eastern Orthodoxy?
What about other Christian communities across Northern Africa?
Armenia, Smyrna in 1922, Cyprus, and now Lebanon, in the past a C hristian country, now majority of Muslim various factions.
The concubines, the description of Muslim heaven, the House of War?
I see people drawing from the Quoran and pointing out verses to justify warfare.
You also deflecting from the continuity of faith in Judeo Christianity which is a living contradiction to the means of expansion of Islam.
Likewise, you look at the division of Sunni vs Shi ites, and this profound conflict goes back to practically the beginning of Islam – never resolved and now Iran and Saudi Arabia want to destroy each other.
I have to ask you in return, as you come across in defense of Islam from a different interpreter of a fairly new belief system, however benevolent, that as I understand it regards universal peace, can find justification and support of such actions.
I have learned a long time ago not to listen to what people preach but what they do with their feet and hands. What is their motivation, what is their true beliefs. True beliefs are expressed as such, not debates.
There are too many contradictions in the Muslim god vs the One True God Who is Love, and is constantly calling us to reconcile.
What was the doctrine within Islam that brought about the destruction of Christian nations – Palestine, Syria, Egypt early on? Why or how did Ars Arslan, the father of Turkey, convert to Islam and destroy Christian Anatolia (Asia Minor) only so many hundred years ago, demonstrating the same MO of Islamic expansion? Constantinople the center of Eastern Orthodoxy?
What about other Christian communities across Northern Africa?
Armenia, Smyrna in 1922, Cyprus, and now Lebanon, in the past a C hristian country, now majority of Muslim various factions.
The concubines, the description of Muslim heaven, the House of War?
I see people drawing from the Quoran and pointing out verses to justify warfare.
You also deflecting from the continuity of faith in Judeo Christianity which is a living contradiction to the means of expansion of Islam.
Likewise, you look at the division of Sunni vs Shi ites, and this profound conflict goes back to practically the beginning of Islam – never resolved and now Iran and Saudi Arabia want to destroy each other.
I have to ask you in return, as you come across in defense of Islam from a different interpreter of a fairly new belief system, however benevolent, that as I understand it regards universal peace, can find justification and support of such actions.
I have learned a long time ago not to listen to what people preach but what they do with their feet and hands. What is their motivation, what is their true beliefs. True beliefs are expressed as such, not debates.
There are too many contradictions in the Muslim god vs the One True God Who is Love, and is constantly calling us to reconcile.
S
Servant19
Guest
Forced conversion and expansion is rife in Judaism and Catholicism too dear Kathleen.
Let us not fall for the trap of thinking that one religion is innocent while others are not. You may argue that it is in the “fine print” of Islamic teaching.
Should we remind you of the fine print of Pope Innocent III??
The only religion completely devoid of any forced conversion is the Baha’i religion.
.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
The good of the Church is the fact that it is self reforming.
My father was in the seminary years ago before discerning he did not have a vocation. He told me in times past, people were baptized too soon. And in regards to forced conversions, you have to look at the specific times and reasons doing so.
I was reading about the plight of Muslims in Myammar who are being expelled and how we are to help them. Then I read further and find out the abuse the Muslims put on the other natives, the fighting and raping.
Likewise I forgot to mention, those who died under Islamic expansion in India, how the Sikhs suffered, those in Bangladesh, the highest sex abuse in the world through Google happening in Pakistan, where likewise Islam has among the most violent Muslims who have blasphemy laws, and Christians are falsely accused and facing death. Others horribly murdered. And then the Arab slave trades.
You look at the history of Muslim expansion. Countries who have fallen for the most part cannot survive. And the conquerers are drawing on the Quoran to justify. And again, no resolution between the Sunnis and Shi ites going back practically to the beginning of Islam.
So yes, I have read passages that are used to justify warfare beyond Muhammed’s battles. And I am reading of this young woman, former Muslim, who went leaving her country of origin, was able to read the Quoran freely and found Muhammed a violent person.
Please know I respect you and your faith. I met a dr from Iran and shared with him what I understand of Ba Hai.
But 270 million people and growing numbers today, and now this practice of synchronized sex abuse in Europe, the growing threats by Muslims before our Catholic cathedrals, the march by Muslims in NW England to bring in more migrants, it is all very frightening and i see war coming.
I am reacting to Hasantas’ comments that the Muslims are more powerful. Look at the means and subjugation. Look at the Egyptian Copts.
I cannot believe that the God we profess…and I tend to believe your concept is close to ours, can be so contradictory and become so small to then declare war on those He created.
My father was in the seminary years ago before discerning he did not have a vocation. He told me in times past, people were baptized too soon. And in regards to forced conversions, you have to look at the specific times and reasons doing so.
I was reading about the plight of Muslims in Myammar who are being expelled and how we are to help them. Then I read further and find out the abuse the Muslims put on the other natives, the fighting and raping.
Likewise I forgot to mention, those who died under Islamic expansion in India, how the Sikhs suffered, those in Bangladesh, the highest sex abuse in the world through Google happening in Pakistan, where likewise Islam has among the most violent Muslims who have blasphemy laws, and Christians are falsely accused and facing death. Others horribly murdered. And then the Arab slave trades.
You look at the history of Muslim expansion. Countries who have fallen for the most part cannot survive. And the conquerers are drawing on the Quoran to justify. And again, no resolution between the Sunnis and Shi ites going back practically to the beginning of Islam.
So yes, I have read passages that are used to justify warfare beyond Muhammed’s battles. And I am reading of this young woman, former Muslim, who went leaving her country of origin, was able to read the Quoran freely and found Muhammed a violent person.
Please know I respect you and your faith. I met a dr from Iran and shared with him what I understand of Ba Hai.
But 270 million people and growing numbers today, and now this practice of synchronized sex abuse in Europe, the growing threats by Muslims before our Catholic cathedrals, the march by Muslims in NW England to bring in more migrants, it is all very frightening and i see war coming.
I am reacting to Hasantas’ comments that the Muslims are more powerful. Look at the means and subjugation. Look at the Egyptian Copts.
I cannot believe that the God we profess…and I tend to believe your concept is close to ours, can be so contradictory and become so small to then declare war on those He created.
T
TonyBS
Guest
Consider God has always applied Justice to the Unbeleivers.
That man has not worked out how to apply this Justice as per their Scriptures is not Gods fault. Man has the free will and this is the mystery of it all.
In all this suffering do you think God judges any one Unjustly. In the end it is how you look at this life and why we are here. Coming to terms as to why we are here is paramount as to accepting all that happens.
The revelation of Muhammad was clothed in sackcloth for its 1260 years, as per the Book of Revelation and as you noted above it happened at Muhammad’s passing when the Sunni rejected the path of Gods Covernant through the Immans. But It still played its part in moulding mankind’s direction and ability to be a united world. It has been recorded that in the last days it will be far from the truth and its leaders the worst of the Divines. The bible also tells us of these days.
God will cut these time short, but we still have time to change this world, we are always given this bounty by God.
It is Self that stops us, our worst enemy.
Glory be to all the Names of God, God grant we all can let go of self and embrace all that is of God.
God bless and regards Tony
H
hasantas
Guest
Yes. Prophets take authority from God so we should listen to them. Do you listen to Jesus or Church?Once again the books cannot speak. But Jesus spoke as Authority.
MJ
S
SyroMalankara
Guest
Do you listen to Muhammad or Allah?
H
hasantas
Guest
As much I could.
S
SyroMalankara
Guest
Which, Muhammad or Allah?
L
Lev23
Guest
God of the Jewish and Christian scriptures is known as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Allah is not.
L
Lev23
Guest
Muslims DO NOT worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob of the scriptures.
S
Servant19
Guest
Thank you for this personal and heartfelt post Kathleen.
The fall of Islam today is indeed pernicious.
All I can say is that there are valid reasons for how God brings His presence to viciously degenerated regions. The similarities to how Muhammad and Moses went about their days is surely worthy of unprejudiced exploration and examination.
What happens after a religion is born is difficult to predict and I hear you loudly in regards to your concerns.
God bless you
.
K
KathleenGee
Guest
We have to go back to the nature of God.
I like St. Thomas of Aquinas description of God the Unmoved Mover.
He also said our understanding of God is like the eye of an owl next to the sun. And I note that the owl’s eye is only used in darkness.
Another, is that in this context of the constancy of God, the only constant there is, the eternal God, is that God is the Author of Life. And in this constancy, there is this ongoing revelation of Truth of Who He is and who we are, His creatures.
God is the source of Life. Sin is the cause of death. Sin is our separation from God.
So how can God Who is life Himself, our creator, now become our Enemy and condemn us to death because we are not Muslim…600 years after Christ, Christ Who is the final and fulfillment of revelation, re uniting us to God the Creator by becoming the Lamb of God, the atonement for our sin…to save and redeem us, not to kill us.
I like St. Thomas of Aquinas description of God the Unmoved Mover.
He also said our understanding of God is like the eye of an owl next to the sun. And I note that the owl’s eye is only used in darkness.
Another, is that in this context of the constancy of God, the only constant there is, the eternal God, is that God is the Author of Life. And in this constancy, there is this ongoing revelation of Truth of Who He is and who we are, His creatures.
God is the source of Life. Sin is the cause of death. Sin is our separation from God.
So how can God Who is life Himself, our creator, now become our Enemy and condemn us to death because we are not Muslim…600 years after Christ, Christ Who is the final and fulfillment of revelation, re uniting us to God the Creator by becoming the Lamb of God, the atonement for our sin…to save and redeem us, not to kill us.
T
TonyBS
Guest
Kathleen - God Loves all His Creation
Thus who is responsible for this, us or God
Free Will - God gives the message we search our heart for the answers. God tests us, we do not test God, if we do, it is Self.
God Bless and Regards Tony
K
KathleenGee
Guest
Thanks, Tony…
Who is responsible? We as adopted heirs as God’s children through Christ, participate with God in the cooperation of grace He has bestowed on us every day.
Love is the greatest of all of God’s attributes.
Who is responsible? We as adopted heirs as God’s children through Christ, participate with God in the cooperation of grace He has bestowed on us every day.
Love is the greatest of all of God’s attributes.
- Status