Am I too scrupulous here? (speed limits)

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Yes…I’m sure as a driver you are aware that there are times when driving the speed limit regardless of what is going on around you can actually endanger the saftey of yourself and others. Then there are other times when driving the speed limit or under the speed limit is the only prudent thing to do.
I agree. I wouldn’t focus on just the speed limit, but what is going on around you in traffic. Sometimes the slowest cars can cause the biggest hazzard. But I would definitly drive with not only your own safety in mind, but that of the other drivers.
 
Ask yourself this: can your family live without the money that you will pay in fines if you get caught?

And if you get caught three times, can your family live without you being allowed to drive a car for six months?

When making your decision, consider everyone who will be affected by it.
 
Ask yourself this: can your family live without the money that you will pay in fines if you get caught?
Getting caught should not be the basis for moral decisions unless something is moral but one can still be penalized for it. However, driving a speed at which one would get a ticket is very likely to be immoral to begin with.

You are rarely going to get a ticket for 50 in a 45 zone - nor do I generally consider this immoral. If you drive 80 in a 65 zone then you deserve a ticket - it’s immoral anyway (unless maybe very brief - e.g. passing).
 
We should always assume that we’re going to get caught, and consider whether we can accept the consequences of our actions. It helps to clarify our decision-making process.

If you get caught doing 70 in a 65 zone, chances are that you won’t be stopped, or that you will get off with a warning, so when choosing to do 70 in a 65 zone, this would be part of your consideration in making the decision to do that.

Personally I’m scrupulous about speeding because I’ve fallen into their little traps. One time I was being tailgated by someone who had his high-beams on - so I sped up - and he turned on his lights and sirens, and I got a very stiff fine for speeding. :eek: 😦

Lesson: I should have changed lanes without speeding up.
 
We should always assume that we’re going to get caught, and consider whether we can accept the consequences of our actions. It helps to clarify our decision-making process.
Hi, if someone is a billionaire and doesn’t mind paying a ticket, it’s still immoral to speed (excessively). Perhaps you mean that the consequences can remind us that something has moral considerations? I can see value in that. However, we must seek to live morally even when actions have no legal consequences.
 
Hi, if someone is a billionaire and doesn’t mind paying a ticket, it’s still immoral to speed (especially to the point of getting a ticket).
True. Getting caught being fined is only one of the possible consequences. Other consequences were mentioned above, and certainly they, too, need to be taken into consideration. I didn’t feel the need to mention them, because they had already been mentioned.

A traffic law isn’t like a church law - you don’t have to obey it just because it exists. But if you choose to disobey it, you need to know why you are disobeying it, and what the realistic consequences of disobedience are.
 
One thing many people don’t understand is that momentum increases as a squared function of velocity(speed) so if a 100 lb person is driving at 20 miles an hour the change in momentum for that persons body in a sudden stop( a crash) is crudely calculated at 100lbs X 20mph X 20mph or 40,000 units.that same 100 lb person traveling at 40 mph would end up roughly at 160,000 units not double, but four times more momentum to be dissipated in a crash. In Germany where it is not unusual to travel at 100 mph on an autobahn(freeway) the survival rate in a crash is much lower than for an American traveling at say 60 mph who crashes. Those vast sudden changes in momentum can take a terrible toll on ones body and on the vehicle. So yes speed is exhilerating(sic) saves time etc. but it is prudent to be aware of the risks one takes with the body and life God has given us, a loved one, or even a stranger for that matter. I firmly believe that it is quite possible to sin mortally both physically and spiritually by being imprudent. The states post speed limits for a very good reason and exceeding them by any great magnitude is to say the least not a mark of wisdom.
 
😛
Well depending on the circumstances, speeding may or may not be a mortal sin but all sin should be avoided as far as possible - and don’t you think it’s ALSO sinful that you’ve wasted time on traffic school and money on traffic fines - for what possible benefit?
Actually, no I do not. Living in a state that is billions in debt, I have just contributed to one of its largest sources of income so maybe the money will go to something useful. Oh, and traffic school was not a complete waste of time. I found out I can make a lane change legally in the middle of an intersection since they changed the rule on that and also a few other neat things like being able to make a left turn on a red light one way to one way. I would have been stuck waiting at the red light before I knew this rule but now I get to honk at people that don’t know the rule and go through the red light when this rare scenario of one way to one way occurrs.
 
The majority of accidents happen, I’ve been told by a retired driving tester, while people are overtaking, or at junctions.
As such, I think a person who aggressivly decides to make themselves a slow hazard knowing that people Are going to take a chance and overtake in stupid places is in the wrong.
If you keep pace with traffic without going much over the limit your driving will be safer than if you are forever overtaking [speeding] or causing overtaking [dangerously slow].
Remember, the rules of the road allow you to accelerate away from some one driving to close to you.
 
Some things are legal but not moral like reading Playboy.

Some things are illegal but ok morally like not stopping for a stop sign in the middle of a desert with no one around as far as the eye can see.

If you try to adhere to the letter of every law you will make yourself crazy. (Abortion is legal.)
 
I found out I can make a lane change legally in the middle of an intersection since they changed the rule on that and also a few other neat things like being able to make a left turn on a red light one way to one way. I would have been stuck waiting at the red light before I knew this rule but now I get to honk at people that don’t know the rule and go through the red light when this rare scenario of one way to one way occurrs.
😃 Don’t honk! In most cases the left turn–or right turn–on red is optional, not obligatory! I’ve noticed in some cases when turning right on red that there is a potential conflict with other cars turning left on a green arrow from the perpendicular street.
 
alright, I won’t honk and actually, I don’t usually honk unless I am in a bad mood or in a hurry. Even so, I agree that honking in that situation is not a good thing since there is oncoming traffic unlike the green light. I still think it is really neat to be able to make a left turn on a red light though. Every time I approach that one intersection I want the light to be red since even though it is perfectly legal it just seems so wierd and fun to be able to go through a red light while making a left.
 
sigh if some drivers want to exceed the speed limit and risk fines and what have you then that’s their choice, but I’m sure I can find better uses for my money than any politician could, wjp.

I’m talking common sense here folks. Not driving at half the speed limit, but just at or very very slightly under. Not waiting for half an hour for a light when there are no other cars coming and it’s clearly out of order, but at least a few minutes and exercising a little caution before proceeding.

If my wanting to obey the law causes problems for anyone then they need to look at the way they drive and their attitude in general, unless you’re prepared to pay my fine for me as well?
 
The majority of accidents happen, I’ve been told by a retired driving tester, while people are overtaking, or at junctions.
If he was a retired accident investigator or highway patrolman, I might give his opinion some weight. Why should a driving tester know more about it than you or I?
As such, I think a person who aggressivly decides to make themselves a slow hazard knowing that people Are going to take a chance and overtake in stupid places is in the wrong.
“Aggressively” obeying the law. Weird concept.
If you keep pace with traffic without going much over the limit your driving will be safer than if you are forever overtaking [speeding] or causing overtaking [dangerously slow].
Remember, the rules of the road allow you to accelerate away from some one driving to close to you.
No they don’t. What part of the word “limit” don’t you understand/ The limit is the maximum speed under any circumstance, including if you’re overtaking, or trying to get away from someone, or going downhill, or in a hurry, or there’s no-one else in sight, or all the other lame excuses.
 
Some things are legal but not moral like reading Playboy.

Some things are illegal but ok morally like not stopping for a stop sign in the middle of a desert with no one around as far as the eye can see.

If you try to adhere to the letter of every law you will make yourself crazy. (Abortion is legal.)
Your logic is haywire. As I said above, as Christians we are bound to obey ALL laws made by the State, regardless of whether we personally think a particular law is a good idea. We can’t pick and choose which laws to obey. The only exception would be if the State passed a law REQUIRING us to do something immoral (or forbidding us from doing something which we are morally BOUND to do.) Thank God, abortion is not “legal” in that sense, at least in most countries. The law (except in China) does not compel anyone to have or perform an abortion.
 
Driving at or below the speed limit can be very dangerous for yourself and others.

The local “beltway” has a speed limit of 55 and sometimes 65. Anyone who drives at that rate will put their lives and others at risk literally.

I would consider such behavior not only sinful but irresponsible and reckless. In general most laws are morally correct but in some situations common sense makes them morally wrong. In a lot of instances civil laws are morally neutral.
 
If he was a retired accident investigator or highway patrolman, I might give his opinion some weight. Why should a driving tester know more about it than you or I?
Because they are interested parties I suppose, and have gone to school with the highway patrolmen and accident investigators and knows them all well and has probably taught them to drive and tested them, and if their clients, who are also his friends children, are killed in an accident he makes it his business to ask why, as he tested their driving.
“Aggressively” obeying the law. Weird concept.
Yes, strange as it sounds, some people think its their business to enforce the law, - sort of like road rage in reverse, actually it is road rage when some one will deliberatly slow down forcing the drivers behind to brake and refusing to let another pass or to keep pace with the traffic. Its a form of aggression.
No they don’t. What part of the word “limit” don’t you understand/ The limit is the maximum speed under any circumstance, including if you’re overtaking, or trying to get away from someone, or going downhill, or in a hurry, or there’s no-one else in sight, or all the other lame excuses.
As an example, I was walking along a road which has a 60 mph limit, (but now has a 63 -ish mph limit because it was changed over to metric 100 kilometers per hour), anyway an artic truck travelling 50 to 55-ish came around a shallow bend and lo and behold a tiny ford fiesta was ahead of him doing about 25 mph. The truck had to brake very hard, skidded, the trailer wobbling from side to side - the truck stopped about 2 feet from the back of the fiesta. Slow driving can be dangerous.
Incidently the back roads around here now have an 80 kph limit since the metric change - these are the sort of roads where the bushes on both sides scrape the your car at the same time, and grass grows in the middle. Those roads used to be maybe 30-40 mph limits but our wonderful bureaucracy arbitrarily decided that 80 looks nicer or something…
and…
When you are being tailgated you have three options under the road rules, accelerate to put a safe distance between you both, or allow the tailgater to pass by moving in if possible or continue as you are - in a dangerous situation.
 
Driving at or below the speed limit can be very dangerous for yourself and others.

The local “beltway” has a speed limit of 55 and sometimes 65. Anyone who drives at that rate will put their lives and others at risk literally.
It’s true that driving too slow for the prevailing traffic can cause accidents. Common sense is the key.

Many freeways have both minimums and maximums, typically, say, 40 mph minimum and 70 maximum. Someone doing 40 on such a highway is legal, but if a following car approaches them at a differential speed of 30 mph it can be unexpected and dangerous.

And blocking traffic in the left lane, even if you are doing the speed limit, can lead to equally dangerous consequences.

If we’re talking moral theology here, keep in mind that Jesus berated the scribes and Pharisees for trying to enforce the law too strictly!
 
I’m sure from a pharisaical point of view it is.
Code:
1  [1](http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/matthew/matthew23.htm#foot1) Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples,   2  [2](http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/matthew/matthew23.htm#foot2) saying, "The scribes and the Pharisees have taken their seat on the chair of Moses.   3  Therefore, do and observe all things whatsoever they tell you, but do not follow their example. For they preach but they do not practice.   4  They tie up heavy burdens [3](http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/matthew/matthew23.htm#foot3) (hard to carry) and lay them on people's shoulders, but they will not lift a finger to move them.  Matt 23
Christ said of the Pharisees that the people ought to do exactly as they say to do, but not to follow their example as they were hypocrites. The point is they had the seat of authority.

Christians are bound to follow all just laws.
 
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