Amazing Facts bible study guide

[MarysRoses]

…and what happened to ‘the sabbath day’ when Gregory **changed the calender ** to what the whole world now lives by?

He erased about 15days from existence!!

Was Gregory, God too?

I think Adventists would argue that particular change affected dates but not the order of days…

At the same time your point is very valid. Adventists demonstrably accept changes in calendars which DO affect the order of days, most notably, the adoption of the International Date Line.

In the eastern Hemisphere, the saturday/sabbath falls BEFORE sabbath begins in Jerusalem. YET … Adventists can find no biblical command that allows this.

Adventists in Kiribati go to church on their Saturday… even though at the same exact time on the same line of longitude a few hundred miles to the north, it is Friday in Hawaii and Adventists are hard at work preparing for their sabbath, which is still in the future.

Think about this… the very SAME sunset that ENDS the Sabbath for kiribatian Adventists… BEGINS the Sabbath for Hawaiian Adventists…

I have pointed this inconsistency out Many MANY times on this forum, no adventist wants to tackle this difficult problem of theirs.

Evidently, this eternal, immutable law they like to talk about is easily changed by any civil government!

MarysRoses

 

[Protestant101]

Marys Roses

Evidently; like other ex-Adventists on this forum, you have strong feelings about Adventists and their beliefs. And yes; if an Adventist comes to a Catholic forum; then of course they can expect to be met and opposed, I am not so sure that was a point that I contested, and I find much disappointment in how Catholics; especially the exAdventist ones make so many generalizations about Adventists, and all the while complaining about how we do this to you.

You have presented so many strawmans in the above posts that it will be impossible to address them all on my limited time here; however, I will be glad to continue to respond where and when possible.

I will say one thing re your cherry-picking with the Bible texts about the covenants. Instead of explaining what the verses I alluded to allegedly “really” mean; you just came up with a few new texts and said they were the “right” ones, and of course, the ones I mentioned were mysteriously “wrong.” But you missed an important point in all of your desperate posting about it.

The Bible is not wrong. The Bible verses I mentioned are not wrong; and actually, I didn’t even quote the verses, I alluded to the points made in the verses.

Heb 8:6

But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

It is clear that from just looking at this text, that the “covenant” (New) is based upon promises, NOT constituting themselves, the Ten Commandments.

The major promise it is based upon is “better” because it was made by God Himself:

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days

, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Would you not agree that this is a better promise? But what is it a better promise than? Again, the Bible is clear:

Exo 19:8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do

. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

We have a situation where fallible people say “we will do;” and where God, after letting “the house of Israel” try, says “I will do.” God makes a better promise always!

To be sure there is no confusion about the heretical tendency to say the old testament is no longer binding on Christians; God repeats His promise in the new testament:

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

If what you say is correct Marys Roses, then we have a situation where the Bible texts you supplied literally cancel and nullify the ones that I supplied. But how can the Bible fight against Itself like this? It is impossible that the Bible would oppose itself in two different places so there must be an explanation. Why do the texts which you supplied dismiss so summarily the ones which I am including in this post?

“The house of Israel” here in the texts which I have provided refers to the Church; not just “the Jews” so we need to sort this out.

 

[Friedrich]

Hi Gabriel 12

Hope you are well. You state that SDA’s don’t read MarysRoses’ posts , and that we are only trained to fight Catholics etc.
I am very sorry you have that impression – we have much more important things to do than fight with fellow Christians – 99% of our time is spent in telling people that Jesus is coming soon, and to prepare for that; the other 1% is dialoguing with our Catholics, trying to help you understand us better…

You said:

I dont know why SDA believe the law can save them?

Because the SDA’s have been side tracking the question on how do they keep the Sabbath according to the dictate of the Law. Can an x SDA explain here, because SDA believe keeping the Sabbath can save them;

Obviously you have not read one of the many posts I have made in this forum on that topic. Also please look in the thread by Patrick on Why Sunday and not Saturday is Sabbath, I gave a plain answer to this yesterday.

Just in summary:

Does loving, hugging, kissing, obeying your wife make you married to her? NO
Why do you do these things? BECAUSE YOU ARE ALREADY MARRIED, AND WANT TO KEEP IT THIS WAY. NOT DOING THIS THINGS LETS YOUR LOVE RELATIONSHIP DIE!

Same with the Sabbath:

Does obedience to God’s laws, paying tithe, worshiping on Sabbath as He asked us to remember save us? NO!

Why do we obey all God’s laws? BECAUSE WE ARE ALREADY SAVED BY GOD’S GRACE, AND WANT TO KEEP IT THIS WAY. NOT DOING GOD’S WILL LETS OUR LOVE RELATIONSHIP DIE.

God bless

Friedrich

 

[Protestant101]

Also, Marys Roses, the Bible does come right out and say that the “covenant” is “concerning the words” of the ten commandments. This needs to be made clear before lifting out of context the cherry-picked texts of Anti-Adventist “apologists:”

Exo 24:8

And Moses took

the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of thecovenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

I think you have some explaining to do.

 

[Nan_S]

My signature pic is as big as this forum allows; (I think) it is actually three angels flying over the Earth; as in Revelation, chapter 14, 6-12.

Can I ask you; what is your understanding of the Bible’s use of the word “fulfil” here in Mat.5:17-18? If you will note; I did already quote Mat.5:18 above in post #273.

I love pictures like that. It’s the sort of picture I would make my Windows desktop background, if I could get a bigger version.

Mt 5:17 "Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them. 18 For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.

“Fulfill” as I am reading it means to bring to completion, to satisfy for all time the requirements thereof, to accomplish the objective and bring it to a close.

“Fulfill” is contrasted by Jesus with “abolish”. To abolish would be to discard it without completing it, to throw it aside as so much broken-beyond-repair offal, to abandon it unfinished.

God made a covenant with the Hebrews. A covenant is a promise that God can not break - ever. Generation after generation God renewed His covenant, and generation after generation the Hebrews broke it. It was time for God to bring the Old Covenant to a close, so that God could establish His New Covenant. The only way for God to close the Old Covenant was to bring it to a perfect completion. Therefore Jesus took on human flesh.

Jesus did not abolish the Old Covenant. Jesus, with His death and resurrection, made the perfect sacrifice which accomplished what our imperfect sacrifices could not accomplish. Jesus brought the Old Covenant to its completion and established the New Covenant.

Therefore, we no longer shed the blood of animals. Instead we share in Jesus’s own flesh that He sacrificed, and share in Jesus’ own blood that He shed. We partake of it in the way He gave it to us to consume, the bread and wine of Holy Communion.

---

I need to make one correction to something I said earlier. [The old covenant has been abolished (and with it all the nit-picky legalisms) and the New Covenant has been established.] I offer the excuse of being overtired and missing the mis-statement as I prepared my post. If I hadn’t fallen asleep at the keyboard, I would have corrected that sentence to read: “The old covenant has been concluded and closed (and with it all the nit-picky legalisms) and the New Covenant has been established.”

 

[Protestant101]

I love pictures like that. It’s the sort of picture I would make my Windows desktop background, if I could get a bigger version.

Mt 5:17 "Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them. 18 For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.

“Fulfill” as I am reading it means to bring to completion, to satisfy for all time the requirements thereof, to accomplish the objective and bring it to a close.

“Fulfill” is contrasted by Jesus with “abolish”. To abolish would be to discard it without completing it, to throw it aside as so much broken-beyond-repair offal, to abandon it unfinished.

LOL; your “excuse” is accepted, but I must have been just as tired for I think I missed seeing the statement you refer to anyways. I think if you save the pic in my sig then use Irfanview or something similar; you should be able to make it bigger and use it for wallpaper. Just pm me for more details. I will be glad to help, and then you can likely do the same with other pics that you like.

Now, about the Bible’s use of the word “fulfil.” I am going to come back to that later today and reply to your points above. They are well worth looking at.

 

[Nan_S]

LOL; your “excuse” is accepted, but I must have been just as tired for I think I missed seeing the statement you refer to anyways. I think if you save the pic in my sig then use Irfanview or something similar; you should be able to make it bigger and use it for wallpaper. Just pm me for more details. I will be glad to help, and then you can likely do the same with other pics that you like.

Now, about the Bible’s use of the word “fulfil.” I am going to come back to that later today and reply to your points above. They are well worth looking at.

Thanks. I’ll look forward to reading your response.

I tried copying and enlarging the picture, but it came out blurry. There aren’t enough pixels in a small thumbnail to fill in the gaps when the size gets expanded. Oh well.

 

[Protestant101]

The Old Covenant Proceeding from Mount Sinai bears children who are to be slaves, yet this is what you are trying to get us to follow. Why would we follow you into slavery?

Before you once again misrepresent what Adventists believe, I would urge forum members to compare and contrast from both sides, not just your’s:

Gentiles and The Sabbath

The Unchangable Covenants

The Covenants and The Law

Sunday In Honor of The Resurrection?

It is obvious that you provide many distractions in your posts but much of what you say would not even be found in the Catechism; which is the definer of catholic doctrine and practice thereof.

Brandon; you should just change your user name to “SDA2RC2SDA” because God is calling you home. You can’t fight Him forever.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Hi Gabriel 12

Hope you are well. You state that SDA’s don’t read MarysRoses’ posts , and that we are only trained to fight Catholics etc.
I am very sorry you have that impression – we have much more important things to do than fight with fellow Christians – 99% of our time is spent in telling people that Jesus is coming soon, and to prepare for that; the other 1% is dialoguing with our Catholics, trying to help you understand us better…

Greetings; Friedrich, thanks for your response. I am sorry for leaving you a negative impression. Let my reiterate what my intent for clarification; That SDA’s have not responded to MaryRoses posts from the context that she has displayed them revealing these mystical truth’s about the Law subjects. I sorry you chose the word “Fight” for my vocabulary, I did not use this word. It is amazing how one word can paint a picture about a person. My wording was that from these posts, most are directed to discredit Catholicism, I never used the word “fight” to describe the dialogue here.

You said:

Obviously you have not read one of the many posts I have made in this forum on that topic. Also please look in the thread by Patrick on Why Sunday and not Saturday is Sabbath, I gave a plain answer to this yesterday.

Just in summary:

Does loving, hugging, kissing, obeying your wife make you married to her? NO
Why do you do these things? BECAUSE YOU ARE ALREADY MARRIED, AND WANT TO KEEP IT THIS WAY. NOT DOING THIS THINGS LETS YOUR LOVE RELATIONSHIP DIE!

Same with the Sabbath:

Does obedience to God’s laws, paying tithe, worshiping on Sabbath as He asked us to remember save us? NO!

Why do we obey all God’s laws? BECAUSE WE ARE ALREADY SAVED BY GOD’S GRACE, AND WANT TO KEEP IT THIS WAY. NOT DOING GOD’S WILL LETS OUR LOVE RELATIONSHIP DIE.

God bless

Friedrich

Yes I read your posts, but you still have not answered the question here? You explain why you believe you have to keep the sabbath. But you have not explained how you keep the Sabbath? This was my description to MaryRoses and x SDA. You see, you make the claim to follow scripture and claim the sabbath. But do you follow the scriptures dictating how to keep the Sabbath? It has been posted here, that there are 613 laws to keep the law. But for some mystery these laws do not apply? What do you do on the Sabbath, that assures you to keep the sabbath, if you follow the scriptures? It has been asked many different ways here, and the only response that is repeated, is because it is in the 10 commandments. So do SDA’s follow the scriptures that dictate how to keep the sabbath, or do they just have a bible study on Saturdays? And do they neglect the “Lords Day” Sunday?

If you believe that you are saved by God’s grace, Then why do hold to an old covenant law that grace saved you from? Christians are in the New covenant under grace, we have been delivered from the dictates of the law that convicts and demands a death if you break one. I respect your Marriage analogy, but it doesnt fit into the new covenant. For one, Marriage in the new covenant is not a law, or contract. Marriage to the Catholic is a sacrament, it is holy and sacred before God. When man and woman enter into the sacrament of Marriage, the two become one. Just as the Church and Jesus are one. These cannot be seperated, what God has joined together. Another words, It is not a law of Marriage that binds the man and woman, it is Love, and God is Love, the sacrament of Marriage has God (Love) himself in the Holy Spirit joining the two as one. Where there is love there is no Law to convict, for where Love (God) is the law cannot convict the Spirit of the law which is grace.

Peace

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

The many innacuracies in your post show a clear mistake about the Bible’s views of “The Covenants.”

The “covenant” (I presume you mean Old) is not used by the Bible Synonomously with “Law” or “God’s Law.” They are two different words, meaning two different things.

In a nutshell: A covenant is simply an agreement about something. In this case; the “covenant” is regarding God’s law, but it is not God’s law.

I am sorry Protestant101 your definition of “A covenant simply an agreement about something” is not accurate according to biblical standards. A covenant is not an agreement, a covenant makes the two parties one in the same, and if the covenant is broken, then a life must be taken that is where the Law comes in. A covenant binds the two parties in a blood relationship, it is not a contract which exchanges goods. The only way out of a covenant is by death. This is why Jesus came to free us from the old covenant that convicts and brings about death. The new covenant brings grace, mercy and life. Praise be Jesus Christ both now and forever.

 

[Marsha_Adams]

Brandon; you should just change your user name to “SDA2RC2SDA” because God is calling you home. You can’t fight Him forever.

Brandon answered God’s call to come home, as did MarysRoses, AdventistNoMore, several others and myself. We came home to the One Holy Catholic Church. Why would we abandon Jesus for a day that He freed us from?

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Brandon answered God’s call to come home, as did MarysRoses, AdventistNoMore, several others and myself. We came home to the One Holy Catholic Church. Why would we abandon Jesus for a day that He freed us from?

This is very touching, for all you brave xSDA’s to leave your past faith relationships for the Catholic Church; I have learned alot from your past SDA experiences and conversions, All of you demonstrate what it is to take up your cross and follow Jesus. God bless you all. All of you have truly revealed you have a heart for Jesus from your conversion to Catholicism. Peace be with you always.

 

[Marsha_Adams]

Gabriel:

Thank you for your kind words.

Marsha

 

[Protestant101]

This is very touching, for all you brave xSDA’s to leave your past faith relationships for the Catholic Church; I have learned alot from your past SDA experiences and conversions, All of you demonstrate what it is to take up your cross and follow Jesus. God bless you all. All of you have truly revealed you have a heart for Jesus from your conversion to Catholicism. Peace be with you always.

I have learned a lot from Catholics who have left the Catholic faith to become Adventists. I have not yet met one who could be classed as someone who hates Catholics or anyone else but what they have usually received from their former Catholic friends was not “the heart of Jesus.”

 

[Patrick_Murebil]

I have learned a lot from Catholics who have left the Catholic faith to become Adventists. I have not yet met one who could be classed as someone who hates Catholics or anyone else but what they have usually received from their former Catholic friends was not “the heart of Jesus.”

Hello everyone,

Just a couple thoughts on these last couple posts, and these are strickly my opinions…if anyone agrees…well…it is nice to be agreed with!

There are so many stories of conversions from one faith to another, many anecdotal stories of how those converts act. I remember when I was at the SDA colloge in Takoma Park, Md, we would go to Georgetown in D.C. on a Saturday night. Back in the 70s the Hare Krishnas used to dance on the sidewalks at Wisconson and M streets…and hand out their literature. They would invite people to their temple in Potomac Md, to see their worship and share in a nice vegetarian Indain meal. I went a few times to talk with them about Jesus and what they believed (They loved bringing out photo albums full of pictures of the late George Harrison, the ex-Beatle, at Krishna events)…some of you younger people may have no idea what I’m talking about, but you older ones probably remember the Beatles and when Hare Krishnas danced on the streets and in airports.

Anyway, the young American Krishna converts in their peach colored robes, shaved heads with the one stirp of pony tail growing from the back of their heads, would share conversion stories. One was interesting in particular. He was a Baptist, picked up a Hare Krishna pamphlet, read it, started going to their temple and converted. How often did I hear a similar conversion story when I was a SDA…and how I have heard that similar conversion story from some who became Catholic.

I guess my point is, that God leads each of us as individuals first, and then as groups. If a person is truly and sincerely seeking God, then where ever they are at any specific point in time, is where God is with them leading them on their journey to Him. If you look at the Covenants that God made with man from the beginning you see a progression of how He gradually extended His plan of salvation.

In the Garden, the covenant was with two individuals Adam and Eve, to not eat of the fruit, and they would live. Next it was with Noah and his family to build and ark, gather the animals, and they would live. Next it was with Abraham and his tribe. Next it was with Moses and his nation. Next it was with David and his national kingdom. And finally it was with Jesus and His Church…open to all mankind, Jews, Gentiles, male, female, slaves, freemen, the entire universe of humans.

And just as God gradually extended His plan of salvation to mankind, I believe He gradually leads an individual on their journey home to Him, in fullness and completeness. As a SDA I always felt it necessary to always be working to convert someone to the “truth”…it was necessary. Then I began to understand that conversion is God’s work…God leading a person on their individual journey…and who am I to interfere with God’s work. As a Catholic, I now feel it necessary to always be praying for someone to find the “truth”…the real Truth, Jesus. God will lead all who sincerely seek Him…let God do His work and me do mine (pray without ceasing and present an honest testimony). Where ever they are on that journey is where God has them and is with them…leading. Of course we are all free to leave that leading if we want to.

To be called brave for converting from SDA to RCC, at least for me is not accurate. I faced no threats from anyone in that process…I was fortunate. I do know of stories where threats were presented to people considering joining the SDA Church, and I do know stories where threats were presented to people considering joining the RCC. I know of a young SDA boy in an African country in the 70s who was beat to death by soldiers for refusing to not worship on the 7th day sabbath (a threat to the authority of the powers that be). I know of a RC priest who was murdered by soldiers in Iraq, just recently, for refusing to stop ministering the Eucharist (a threat to the authority of the powers that be). There are many many stories like this for many many different faiths.

So NO, bravery had nothing to do with my choice. I will say that it was at times extremely difficult, and that is an understatement, but I am confident without a doubt that God has led me to the place I am supposed to be with Him. And I must assume that everyone reading these posts are equally confident without a doubt that God has led them to the place where they are supposed to be Him. That is why I no longer need to work to “convert” people to the “truth”. But if you have doubts, then please know that I am praying for you each day, as are many others on this forum, and have faith that God will lead you home. It may be difficult and it may require bravery and courage, but rest assured, God WILL lead YOU home!!

God bless all!!!

 

[SDA2RC]

Before you once again misrepresent what Adventists believe, I would urge forum members to compare and contrast from both sides, not just your’s:

Gentiles and The Sabbath

The Unchangable Covenants

The Covenants and The Law

Sunday In Honor of The Resurrection?

It is obvious that you provide many distractions in your posts but much of what you say would not even be found in the Catechism; which is the definer of catholic doctrine and practice thereof.

Brandon; you should just change your user name to “SDA2RC2SDA” because God is calling you home. You can’t fight Him forever.

Protestant101,
Please explain how I have misrepresented Adventism?

Haha… the only problem is that God has already called me home… and that home is not Adventism. I will spend the rest of my life sharing what I have learned about God, spirituality, and truth in Catholicism. There is nothing that compares. My wife and I began by Studying Adventist doctrines and reading through the NT as part of our devotional, it by seeing the inconsistency of Adventist teachings with that of the Bible, that made us start studying other denomination’s teachings… Catholicism was never an option.

Finally, God began opening our eyes to the truth in Catholicism… it was hard for us… we had a very ingrained prejudice against Catholicism… that it should not even be considered. But through God grace, we came to a point in our lives that required us to make a choice for what we knew was right and what we knew our families wanted. We chose what was right and communion with Catholicism.

Protestant101… I just hope that you will come to see the large Christian heritage and what Christ left us nearly 2000 years ago. I hope that I can help you in any way along that path. Just like there is nothing as nice as coming home after being gone a long way… the joy of entering into full communion with the Body of Christ cannot be compared to anything else. It is a deeply personal, spiritual, intellectual, and mystical experience to realize the depth and truth of Catholicism.

 

[SDA2RC]

To the SDA’s on this site…

The link below contains a Challenge to Adventists… I found it as a Challenge to Protestants, and with the authors permission I modified it slightly and posted it as a Challenge to Adventists. When I went through this series of questions and researched the answers it was eye opening to me! I hope that you would take the time (and it takes a lot of time) to really research the questions presented and complete them. If nothing else, it will serve as a way to increase your knowledge about why we believe what we believe…

One of the most profound questions to me was, “When was my opinion first formed about Catholicism, and who had taught me what I think I know about the Catholic Church?”

sda2rc.com/challenge.html

 

[SDA2RC]

Also, Marys Roses, the Bible does come right out and say that the “covenant” is “concerning the words” of the ten commandments. This needs to be made clear before lifting out of context the cherry-picked texts of Anti-Adventist “apologists:”
I think you have some explaining to do.

Protestant101,
I am afraid I have to disagree with your statement above, it specifically says that the 10 Commandments are the “words of the Covenant”.

(Exo 34:28 NASB) So he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did not eat bread or drink water. And he wrote on the tablet’s the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

GOD’S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Moses was there with the LORD 40 days and 40 nights without food or water. He wrote on the tablets the words of the promise, the ten commandments.
http://kingjbible.com/exodus/34.htm

King James Bible
And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
http://kjv.us/exodus/34.htm

American King James Version
And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote on the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

American Standard Version
And he was there with Jehovah forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

Bible in Basic English
And for forty days and forty nights Moses was there with the Lord, and in that time he had no food or drink. And he put in writing on the stones the words of the agreement, the ten rules of the law.
http://drb.scripturetext.com/exodus/34.htm

Douay-Rheims Bible
And he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights: he neither ate bread nor drank water, and he wrote upon the tables the ten words of the covenant.

 

[Friedrich]

Hello Gabriel of 12

You said:

Yes I read your posts, but you still have not answered the question here? You explain why you believe you have to keep the sabbath. But you have not explained how you keep the Sabbath? This was my description to MaryRoses and x SDA. You see, you make the claim to follow scripture and claim the sabbath. But do you follow the scriptures dictating how to keep the Sabbath? It has been posted here, that there are 613 laws to keep the law. But for some mystery these laws do not apply? What do you do on the Sabbath, that assures you to keep the sabbath, if you follow the scriptures? It has been asked many different ways here, and the only response that is repeated, is because it is in the 10 commandments. So do SDA’s follow the scriptures that dictate how to keep the sabbath, or do they just have a bible study on Saturdays? And do they neglect the “Lords Day” Sunday?

If you believe that you are saved by God’s grace, Then why do hold to an old covenant law that grace saved you from? Christians are in the New covenant under grace, we have been delivered from the dictates of the law that convicts and demands a death if you break one. I respect your Marriage analogy, but it doesnt fit into the new covenant. For one, Marriage in the new covenant is not a law, or contract. Marriage to the Catholic is a sacrament, it is holy and sacred before God. When man and woman enter into the sacrament of Marriage, the two become one. Just as the Church and Jesus are one. These cannot be seperated, what God has joined together. Another words, It is not a law of Marriage that binds the man and woman, it is Love, and God is Love, the sacrament of Marriage has God (Love) himself in the Holy Spirit joining the two as one. Where there is love there is no Law to convict, for where Love (God) is the law cannot convict the Spirit of the law which is grace.

In reply to the first paragraph on how we keep the Sabbath – read my posting to Nan S on the Why is Sunday instead of Saturday… thread. In one sentence – Keeping the Sabbath is a DELIGHT – 24 hours to spend with the One you Love! Why would we want to lose out on that?

Regarding your law/grace dichotomy – as far as marriage AND the New Covenant relationship with Jesus is concerned – LAW DOES NOT STAND IN OPPOSITION TO LOVE! LAW = BASED ON LOVE!

Let me say it again. You marry someone because of LOVE.
Let me say it again. You `marry’ Christ because of LOVE.

Let me say it again. You DO good things to someone because of LOVE!
Let me say it again. You DO the commandments for God because of LOVE!

Commandments, kind deeds DO NOT MAKE GOD/YOUR SPOUSE LOVE YOU MORE!

So where does the Curse/Old Covenant negativity come from? God? NO. Man? YES!
Let me say it clearly: GOD’S REQUIREMENTS FOR SALVATION HAVE NEVER CHANGED SINCE ADAM AND EVE SINNED! WE ARE ONLY SAVED BY FAITH IN JESUS AS OUR SAVIOUR!

The Old/New Covenant problem lies on the part of MAN, WHO TRIED TO LEGALLY KEEP THE LAW IN ORDER TO BE SAVED – that was impossible, and a curse to him. Jesus became this curse for us on the cross, and where in the OT the salvation was by faith in the Saviour to come, now in the NT the `New’ Covenant is merely salvation by faith in the Saviour who has already come!, but NOT BY LEGALISM – BY FAITH!

SO WHY BOTHER TO KEEP GOD’S LAWS? THEY HELP RESTORE GOD’S IMAGE IN US, MAKE US FIT TO REPRESENT HIM BETTER, HERE AND IN HEAVEN.

God bless

Friedrich

 

[Patrick_Murebil]

Hello Gabriel of 12

SO WHY BOTHER TO KEEP GOD’S LAWS? THEY HELP RESTORE GOD’S IMAGE IN US, MAKE US FIT TO REPRESENT HIM BETTER, HERE AND IN HEAVEN.

God bless

Friedrich

Dear Friedrich, my brother,

I am sorry, but that statement above is wrong. When people keep God’s law, the 10 commandments, it may change the way people behave. But please make no mistake about it…It is Jesus and Him in us and us in Him, through the gift of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, and receiving His body, blood, soul, and divinity through the gift of the Lord’s Supper that make us fit for heaven.

The law changes behavior…Jesus changes our hearts and minds…there is a big difference. Only Jesus can accomplish what you state above…not the law.

God bless all,