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ProVobis
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Bezos was right all along
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Bezos was right all along
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ThinkingSapien
Guest
I’m inclined to think Trump’s negative fabrications on Amazon are motivated by his feelings of WaPo.Bezos was right all along
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upant
Guest
the postal service delivers Amazon as overnight mail while charging bulk pricing. They are losing revenue on every amazon parcel. Why doesn’t any other bulk package get delivered on Sunday? Only a government agency can shift the cost of delivery and call it profitable
The question is how much would they have made if they charged the proper rate for the delivery method used?
The question is how much would they have made if they charged the proper rate for the delivery method used?
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ThinkingSapien
Guest
Citation needed. This is contrary to previous reports on the matter.They are losing revenue on every amazon parcel.
I thought you might want to see this story from NPR .
Fact Check: Is The Post Office Losing Money By Delivering Packages For Amazon?
Fact Check: Is The Post Office Losing Money By Delivering Packages For Amazon? : NPR
Sent from NPR One. Download now: https://read.nprone.app/download
Because the respective delivery companies choose not to. The USPS has delivered on Sunday before their contract with Amazon if the mail volume justified it.Why doesn’t any other bulk package get delivered on Sunday?
I dont know if this is still the case, but FedEx Hone would not delivery on Mondays the last time I checked with them.
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upant
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the USPS won’t release its agreement but it is easy to seeCitation needed.
they are delivering it as if it was an overnight priority package, that is why it is delivered on Sunday but they are paying a bulk rate,
why doesn’t USPS delivered UPS or FedEx last-mile parcels get the same overnight service?
decades ago or parcels during Christmas, not bulk parcels all year long.The USPS has delivered on Sunday before their contract with Amazon if the mail volume justified it.
they choose for their last-mile deliveries by the USPS to not be delivered on Sunday? this needs a citation, it doesn’t make sense that they would allow the USPS to delay their parcelsBecause the respective delivery companies choose not to.
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ThinkingSapien
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No, I was stating that each delivery company has already made their own delivery policies and negotiates their own delivery contracts with other entities.they choose for their last-mile deliveries by the USPS to not be delivered on Sunday?
That’s not to say that there have not been unique agreements among these companies. A computer company had an agreement with one of these companies for routine computer services so that people would see quick turn-around on computers they send it.
Allow? Do you not mean “request” or “negotiate” here? The USPS is not under Amazon management for Amazon to allow or deny permission. For the sections of the contract that the USPS made available it is also stated either party can terminate their agreement with 30-days notice.it doesn’t make sense that they would allow
Not only decades ago. I’ve received Sunday mail after storms prevented delivery during normal days.decades ago or parcels during Christmas, not bulk parcels all year long.
Have those entities requested such service?why doesn’t USPS delivered UPS or FedEx last-mile parcels get the same overnight service?
Their actual rate schedule is unknown.they are delivering it as if it was an overnight priority package, that is why it is delivered on Sunday but they are paying a bulk rate,
Amazon performs pre-sorting of their packages by zip-code and delivery route and often moves the packages to the destination cities themselves before the USPS handoff. Some of the work the USPS does for normal deliveries is not applicable to Amazon Sunday deliveries.
Under federal law, the USPS must consider the full costs of a service when negotiating a contract. This assures that the USPS isn’t making an agreement at a loss.
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upant
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the USPS is a government entity it should charge everyone the same for the same service, that is one of their talking points same price for all, except if you are amazon,I was stating that each delivery company has already made their own delivery policies and negotiates their own delivery contracts with other entities
what does this have to do with them getting a service they didn’t pay for?For the sections of the contract that the USPS made available it is also stated either party can terminate their agreement with 30-days notice.
obviously not a normal situation. again, why is only amazon delivered on Sunday? I want the parcels I mail from this government agency treat with overnight delivery for a bulk rate.I’ve received Sunday mail after storms prevented delivery during normal days.
again, why would they want their parcels delayed?Have those entities requested such service?
have you seen the processing of these parcels? it isn’t in carrier sequence. have you talked to the managers, clerks, and carriers?Amazon performs pre-sorting of their packages by zip-code and delivery route and often moves the packages to the destination cities themselves before the USPS handoff. Some of the work the USPS does for normal deliveries is not applicable to Amazon Sunday deliveries.
the government never makes sweetheart deals to benefit someone or company?Under federal law, the USPS must consider the full costs of a service when negotiating a contract. This assures that the USPS isn’t making an agreement at a loss.
bottom line: Amazon is getting service they are not properly paying for.
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ThinkingSapien
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I don’t think that we see many others that are trying to send high volume presorted packages or handling significant portions of their own logistics for those packages. Rather, a typical case is to have the USPS handle end-to-end of delivery, For Amazon (which has been building up their own logistic capabilities) packages are often moved by Amazon to a local distribution center before being handed to the USPS for final delivery.he USPS is a government entity it should charge everyone the same for the same service
This question fails on it’s premise.what does this have to do with them getting a service they didn’t pay for?
bolding my own.again, why is only amazon delivered on Sunday?
Not “only.” USPS delivers on Sunday in areas on which there is a demand for it. Ex: NYC has Sunday delivery of mail. It doesn’t cost any extra to receive mail on a Sunday. As it sees higher demand during the holidays the USPS plans to increase the places where it delivers mail on Sundays.
Per the USPS, this is driven by demand and the volume of mail going to an area. It is likely to only be seen in areas in or close to densely populated areas.
What deal is that?Amazon is getting service they are not properly paying for.
I get the impression that this is telling me to perceive their contract in a certain way even though no evidence of exploitation has been presented.
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upant
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yes we do, UPS and Fed EX use the USPS for last-mile delivery just like amazonI don’t think that we see many others that are trying to send high volume presorted packages or handling significant portions of their own logistics for those packages
you don’t think FedEx and UPS have their own local sites?For Amazon (which has been building up their own logistic capabilities) packages are often moved by Amazon to a local distribution center before being handed to the USPS for final delivery.
the rest of the country gets amazon every Sunday, no one else has this deal and amazon pays less than the overnight cost for the overnight service. the postal service loses revenue.Not “only.” USPS delivers on Sunday in areas on which there is a demand for it. Ex: NYC has Sunday delivery of mail. It doesn’t cost any extra to receive mail on a Sunday. As it sees higher demand during the holidays the USPS plans to increase the places where it delivers mail on Sundays.
Per the USPS, this is driven by demand and the volume of mail going to an area. It is likely to only be seen in areas in or close to densely populated areas.
it is that simple
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ThinkingSapien
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How much does Amazon pay?the rest of the country gets amazon every Sunday, no one else has this deal and amazon pays
I found out under the previous Post Master General (Megan J. Brenan) the USPS announced interest in offering Sunday delivery to UPS. This was expressed to the public in July 2019. The service is available now. UPS packages sent under “Sure Post” can be delivered on Sunday. The availability of Sunday delivery is based on demand. (Src) and thus is not available in all areas.
Amazon’s reliance in the USPS has been decreasing with the expansion of “Amazon Logistics.” Amazon Logistics delivers not only Amazon packages, but packages for other companies for items not sold through Amazon. Last year Amazon delivered 46-50% of it’s own packages without the involvement of third party services (src) and is growing. Not that Amazon’s USPS and UPS arrangements will end soon (though their partnership with FedEx is over) it looks like they are progressing towards not using the USPS as much. Do you think that will be helpful?
Trump issued an executive order for the formation of a task force to look at the USPS and find the problems with their sustainability. The tasks made several suggestions for changes in operations that could help. One of the problems is the USPS isn’t made to be profitable. Like a city’s bus and subway system, the USPS was made for offering a service while not trying to necessarily seek increased profits and growth. The task force recoments that the USPS take a competitive disposition and try to compete with other delivery services.
Trump’s Task Force Report on the USPS
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upant
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are they guaranteed overnight delivery?Post Master General (Megan J. Brenan) the USPS announced interest in offering Sunday delivery to UPS.
it will continue to declineAmazon’s reliance in the USPS has been decreasing with the expansion of “Amazon Logistics
only if they eliminate the overnight delivery for bulk parcels.Do you think that will be helpful?
they should not be asking for taxpayer money when they undercharge for the services they provide.
the OIG investigated San Francisco District Sunday operation in 2017.
In “A Closer Look at Postal Labor Costs” the OIG indicated that Sunday delivery was driving up overtime cost.The San Francisco District incurred additional operating costs on Sundays by using regular full-time city carriers at higher wage rates, resulting in $1 million annually in additional operational costs. Improvements in staffing could help the district realize a cost avoidance of $1.6 million annually.
everyone says that the postal service must charge what it cost to deliver, but if you don’t label the service what it is, it can be manipulated.A third reason for the increase in overtime costs is the introduction of Sunday delivery in FY 2014
another cost I have not seen is the grievance payments for crossing crafts that were filed, another manipulation by the USPS management.
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ThinkingSapien
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I don’t know what guarantees UPS gives with SurePost. But even Amazon delivers scheduled for Sunday delivery are not guaranteed to arrive on Sunday. The delivery dates are at best an estimate.are they guaranteed overnight delivery?
I’m sure. Amazon is said to be in negotiations to take over spaces that had been anchor stores in malls as distribution spaces and further expand their Logistic operations.it will continue to decline
If a service cost more than what it cost then I think an appropriate response might be to renegotiate the contract. The 30-day notice of termination provides a continuous opportunity for negotiating required adjustments or withdrawing the Sunday service. It is up to the USPS to speak for the USPS. If the USPS says nothing, I can’t see that as a violation on the part of Amazon.they should not be asking for taxpayer money when they undercharge for the services they provide.
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upant
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have you been in a Sunday USPS hub? it gets delivered even if they are on the street in the dark.But even Amazon delivers scheduled for Sunday delivery are not guaranteed to arrive on Sunday.
you are talking about the USPS, they inked a deal with Grainger and had to buy only from Grainger even if Grainger was the highest price in town.If a service cost more than what it cost then I think an appropriate response might be to renegotiate the contract.
I can’t blame Amazon at all, they are definitely the better negotiators, but it doesn’t mean they don’t have a sweetheart deal and getting a higher service at a lower priceI can’t see that as a violation on the part of Amazon.
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ThinkingSapien
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Many times. The USPS at the Atlanta Airport is open 24/7. I ship packages from there all the time.have you been in a Sunday USPS hub?
That hasn’t been my experience. Sometimes a package is out for delivery and then goes back to the USPS without a delivery attempt being made. This isn’t specific to Sunday deliver and happens any day of the week. I have reviewed security footage to see if they even came by. Sometimes they mark a package as undeliverable because the “business was closed” without coming by.it gets delivered even if they are on the street in the dark.
Then that points to an operational issue at the USPS. Not that their operational issues all come from decisions within the USPS. Congress passing the law for the USPS to have a fund to cover the costs of employee retirement health care for 75 years into the future (Postal Accountability Enhancement Act). The USPS is the only government office constrained by such a restriction. At the time this law was applied the USPS was in a position to have made profits for the next 6 years. This is also mentioned in the above reference report from Trump’s task force to look at the USPS.you are talking about the USPS, they inked a deal with Grainger and had to buy only from Grainger even if Grainger was the highest price in town.
I don’t think that I can look at their agreement as a “sweetheart deal” without any information on the actual costs for it. The financial constraints put on the USPS appear to be constraints that are applicable even without interactions with Amazon. Spokespeople from the USPS have repeatedly declared that their agreement with Amazon is profitable.it doesn’t mean they don’t have a sweetheart deal
Kind of related: it looks like rural USA is more impacted by the recent changes in USPS operation
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Theo520
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A 2017 analysis from Citi said USPS undercharged package customers like Amazon by $1.46 per package, a number that R.J. Hottovy, a Morningstar consumer-equity analyst, says holds true today.
//www.businessinsider.com/amazon-usps-rural-packages-deliveries-2020-5
The OP analysis ignores fixed cost recovery, which is dishonest.
//www.businessinsider.com/amazon-usps-rural-packages-deliveries-2020-5
The OP analysis ignores fixed cost recovery, which is dishonest.
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PaulinVA
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Cash flow and profits are not the same thing. Profitability factors in the costs of doing business, and in the case of the Postal Service, those costs are significant.
The biggest drag on its finances is a unique rule that requires the USPS to prepay for workers’ retirement benefits for decades into the future. In 2006, Congress passed a law to require the the agency to pre-fund 75 years worth of retiree health care benefits in the span of about 10 years.
“There’s no other entity on Earth that does anything like that. When I talk about it, people say it’s utterly absurd,” said Rep. Peter DeFazio, the author of legislation that would remove that requirement. The legislation, which the USPS supports, has passed the House with bipartisan support, and a Senate version also has bipartisan sponsors, but no vote has been scheduled yet.
The rule took effect in 2007, just before the start of the Great Recession, when the Postal Service was still reporting profits. But the economic downturn hit hard and made the payments unaffordable.
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ProVobis
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Possibly, if the accounting isn’t consistent.
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upant
Guest
Why does everyone forget that the USPS was part of the deal making and said they could pay the upfront cost but didn’t.
the USPS got what they wanted inserted into the bill.
This can not be blamed solely on Congress.
the USPS got what they wanted inserted into the bill.
This can not be blamed solely on Congress.
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upant
Guest
Not the same as seeing the Amazon operation or discussing it with the managersI ship packages
What are the instructions regarding amazon delivery? I have talked with the managers running these hubs. They are delivering amazon as overnight pieces. They have to account for every non-attempted delivery. One even mentioned going on the street themself to deliver packages to avoid the non delivery. They only do this for Amazon and overnight Express.Sometimes a package is out for delivery and then goes back to the USPS without a delivery attempt being made. This isn’t specific to Sunday deliver and
This is partially self-imposed.The USPS is the only government office constrained by such a restriction
Okay I’m done, think what you want… you can’t seem to see the difference of paying for a lower priced service but getting the worked performed at the highest priced service. Look at your next amazon parcel does it have the express label or next day delivery on it? No, but that was how it was handled.without any information on the actual costs for it.
If amazon paid the right price for the service they get, the financial burden would be lessThe financial constraints put on the USPS appear to be constraints that are applicable even without interactions with Amazon.
Mail standards were changed years ago, it isn’t new, nobody paid attention. Delivery is based on the rate paid. Junk mail should not be delivered the same as first class but it is and cost overtime. It is right to cut it off at a specific time as that is the service paid for. Machines have been removed as the volume of mail dropped for over a decade.: it looks like rural USA is more impacted by the recent changes in USPS operation
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upant
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The downturn hurt but the standards also changed and management did not enforce the new standard. The overnight standard was reduced so the mail could be worked without overtime. Unfortunately, mail continues to be delivered at a standard long gone.But the economic downturn hit hard and made the payments unaffordable.
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