Angels

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We believe Angels have no body, pure spirit. We believe that Angels think. Thinking is processing information. Information has form. Therefore Angels needs to have body in order to think. This clearly conflicts with our first belief (Angels have no body). So we are dealing with a problem.
 
We believe Angels have no body, pure spirit. We believe that Angels think. Thinking is processing information. Information has form. Therefore Angels needs to have body in order to think. This clearly conflicts with our first belief (Angels have no body). So we are dealing with a problem.
What exactly do you mean by “information has form”?
 
We believe Angels have no body, pure spirit. We believe that Angels think.
Read up on your Aquinas. 😉

Angels don’t “ratiocinate”, which – as you point out – requires a physical body
So we are dealing with a problem.
The problem is that you’re making the presumption that angels “think” in the way that humans “think”. When you do that, you place a requirement on angelic nature that doesn’t hold up to reason. 👍
 
We believe Angels have no body, pure spirit. We believe that Angels think. Thinking is processing information. Information has form. Therefore Angels needs to have body in order to think. This clearly conflicts with our first belief (Angels have no body). So we are dealing with a problem.
They’re operating on a different plane of existence, so of course they wouldn’t “think” like humans.
 
What exactly do you mean by “information has form”?
Think of an electromagnetic pulse which carry information. This pulse is made of electromagnetic field and has a very specific form otherwise it could be different from other pulse meaning that it cannot carry information. There are tons of example around you in all case information that you receive or produce has very specific form.
 
Read up on your Aquinas. 😉

Angels don’t “ratiocinate”, which – as you point out – requires a physical body
I can really read up that as I don’t have enough time. Could you please elaborate or at least give a reference to the page?
The problem is that you’re making the presumption that angels “think” in the way that humans “think”. When you do that, you place a requirement on angelic nature that doesn’t hold up to reason. 👍
That I understand but you cannot resolve the problem by saying that they are different from us. You need to give a specific method in which they could think.
 
They are a totally different species than humans.
Angels are non-corporal spiritual beings.
Lots of good books on the topic.
Also there’s much great info in the EWTN Online Library on the topic of angels.
 
They are a totally different species than humans.
Angels are non-corporal spiritual beings.
Lots of good books on the topic.
Also there’s much great info in the EWTN Online Library on the topic of angels.
I know that Angels are non-corporal beings. I have problem understanding how they could possibly think. Could you please elaborate instead referring me to books?
 
We believe Angels have no body, pure spirit. We believe that Angels think. Thinking is processing information. Information has form. Therefore Angels needs to have body in order to think. This clearly conflicts with our first belief (Angels have no body). So we are dealing with a problem.
Information doesn’t have a physical form.
Thinking is more than processing information.

Don’t confuse a representation of information with what it actually represents. A bird is a thing that exists in the physical world. But, the word bird is only a representation of it, not the thing itself. There is no required physical form of a representation of a bird like the word bird. But, there is a physical form of the bird itself. In this case the bird is not the word. 🙂

When you think of a bird the form of the bird exists not only in the bird itself but also in your mind. Angels, which are form only, without matter, process forms of things and abstract concepts in their minds like we can with less limitations.

Our immaterial minds which exist apart from the body process the forms of things and abstractions in the same way. However, our minds are intimately connected to the body through the senses which colors our perception of reality. The angels have no such sensory experiences, but have pure intellect and can therefore grasp the concepts and abstractions of things directly without any sensory (name removed by moderator)ut.

Our immaterial minds are really form without matter, like the angels. We are part form without matter and part form with matter. Which makes us interesting creatures indeed. The animals are all form with matter, having no intellectual power. The Angels are pure form with no matter having intellectual power without matter.
 
Information doesn’t have a physical form.
Physical or nonphysical, it has form otherwise we couldn’t distinguish between different infromations.
Thinking is more than processing information.
What else?
Don’t confuse a representation of information with what it actually represents. A bird is a thing that exists in the physical world. But, the word bird is only a representation of it, not the thing itself. There is no required physical form of a representation of a bird like the word bird. But, there is a physical form of the bird itself. In this case the bird is not the word. 🙂
The word bird has to have form also otherwise we couldn’t distinguish it from word human.
When you think of a bird the form of the bird exists not only in the bird itself but also in your mind. Angels, which are form only, without matter, process forms of things and abstract concepts in their minds like we can with less limitations.
How something which is not made of anything can possibly have a form?
Our immaterial minds which exist apart from the body process the forms of things and abstractions in the same way. However, our minds are intimately connected to the body through the senses which colors our perception of reality. The angels have no such sensory experiences, but have pure intellect and can therefore grasp the concepts and abstractions of things directly without any sensory (name removed by moderator)ut.
I don’t think that Angels don’t have any sensory system. How they could possibly interact with each other?
Our immaterial minds are really form without matter, like the angels. We are part form without matter and part form with matter. Which makes us interesting creatures indeed. The animals are all form with matter, having no intellectual power. The Angels are pure form with no matter having intellectual power without matter.
I don’t believe that Animals have no intellectual power. Here is an article in this regard.
 
Animals and angels are separate categories of inquiry.

And it is necessary to distinguish knowing from thinking. Knowing is timeless, and so is spiritual; thinking is how a human being, embedded in time, passes from unknowing to knowing. For that, he uses and needs his head.

Angels know, but possibly do not “think”, and so would not need heads.

ICXC NIKA
 
There is a 7-part course on ANGELS given by Deacon Reuben Dykes available from the link below:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=14371834#post14371834

(The thread was just opened today and am still in the process of posting the links to the 7 parts.)
I have a couple of objection to content of this talk: (1) Angels can read our mind and heart, how otherwise could know what we are thinking when there is no mode of communication? (based on my experiences they could read our minds in advance) (2) They need to think even if they have knowledge of everything, how they could act in a specific occasion without thinking?

Moreover this video does not answer the question related to this thread which is about thinking Angels.
 
Animals and angels are separate categories of inquiry.

And it is necessary to distinguish knowing from thinking. Knowing is timeless, and so is spiritual; thinking is how a human being, embedded in time, passes from unknowing to knowing. For that, he uses and needs his head.

Angels know, but possibly do not “think”, and so would not need heads.

ICXC NIKA
Of course, Angels do think like Human. How otherwise they could make a choice?
 
Think of an electromagnetic pulse which carry information. This pulse is made of electromagnetic field and has a very specific form otherwise it could be different from other pulse meaning that it cannot carry information. There are tons of example around you in all case information that you receive or produce has very specific form.
Your making the assumption that the intellect is dependent on, or perhaps, synonamous with physiology. There is no evidence that it is…because it’s not.
 
How do you understand otherwise? Could you please elaborate?
The only way to remove the intellect from the body is to kill the body. There are cases of people in vegetative states who still maintain their intellect despite having no detectable brainwaves.

Electrical signals are for the body not the intellect.
 
The only way to remove the intellect from the body is to kill the body.
Of course. That is true because intellect is related to neurobiological processes. A person goes to vegetative state once enough damage is made to a part of brain.
There are cases of people in vegetative states who still maintain their intellect despite having no detectable brainwaves.
So you mean that there is no purpose for brainwaves?
Electrical signals are for the body not the intellect.
Of course they made intellect. What is the purpose of them otherwise?
 
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