Anti-Mexican Hatred disguised as patriotism

[Ituyu]

I want to thank all of you for your (name removed by moderator)ut on this thread. As I’ve gone along looking materials on the web, I found the following one. I think it gives a nice balanced view at some of the elements at play on this issue.

ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/JWCRAWFORD/anatomy.htm

 

[Hastrman]

First off, let me just point something out. Someone up there said something about how “we”, meaning white people, don’t see that this has never been a white country because we were the oppressors. Well speak for yourself, because my ancestry is Czech, Irish, and New England Acadian. We’ve been the oppressed, not the oppressors, for four hundred, eight hundred, and a hundred fifty years, respectively. You’ve doubtless heard of the Long Walk and the Trail of Tears, well how about Le Grand Dérangement? How about the suffering of the Irish under Cromwell, in the '98, or with the Black and Tans?

Anyway, that said, much of the anti-immigration sentiment in this country is racism, and even where it’s not that, it’s isolationism and a weird, non-bigoted Anglo-supremacism. Have you read anything by Pat Buchanan on the topic? His views have only one consistent element: isolationism. We should be out of Iraq and Afghanistan, our border (with Mexico of course; Canadians are white) should be closed, and anyone who leaves and tries to reenter should be executed. No, wait, that last one was Edo period Japan, but it’s a natural mistake.

 

[KathleenElsie]

I believe that both borders should be closed. Now understand that does not mean no one enters. Just that everyone enters legally.

I also believe that there should be no special privileges for those that come here legal or not. Our social services in this country should allow for citizens and legal workers first. This includes education, welfare, social security and yes medical care (non-emergency).

Charity to help the poor and oppressed should be provided so they can stay with their families and live in their home countries. My hope for them is to have good lives without having to leave their loved ones behind. We need to help them as much as we can. But, the solution is not to bring them all here.

If this makes me a bigot then so be it. I just think it is more Christian to keep societies together and allow them to grow. The time it takes for them to grow and how they grow should not be on an American timetable.

 

[rlg94086]

I basically agree with you, except the bolded section where you wrote two sentences that contradict. People here on legal work visas do send their kids to public school…should they be required to send their kids to private schools? What if they buy a home and are paying the property taxes which support the schools?

As far as a Guest Worker Program (you didn’t mention it, but I’m adding on ), I think an employer that hires somebody under such a program should be required to provide health benefits and possibly housing to those workers. That way the burden is not our our local/federal government, rather on the employer who is benefiting from the program.

I believe that both borders should be closed. Now understand that does not mean no one enters. Just that everyone enters legally.

I also believe that there should be no special privileges for those that come here legal or not. Our social services in this country should allow for citizens and legal workers first. This includes education, welfare, social security and yes medical care (non-emergency).

 

[SeekerJen]

I basically agree with you, except the bolded section where you wrote two sentences that contradict. People here on legal work visas do send their kids to public school…should they be required to send their kids to private schools? What if they buy a home and are paying the property taxes which support the schools?.

Thank you! My father’s parents came here legally from Mexico and my grandfather was always employed. All seven of their children were born here and they worked harder than most to make sure that they could buy a house, feed their family, pay their bills and taxes, and otherwise be responsible residents. If their kids, legally-born American citizens, hadn’t been allowed to go to public schools, likely none of them would be the self-sufficient, well-off employed (or retired after full legal employment) people that they are today. Why should my family have been denied public schooling?

 

[KathleenElsie]

I basically agree with you, except the balded section where you wrote two sentences that contradict. People here on legal work visas do send their kids to public school…should they be required to send their kids to private schools? What if they buy a home and are paying the property taxes which support the schools?

As far as a Guest Worker Program (you didn’t mention it, but I’m adding on ), I think an employer that hires somebody under such a program should be required to provide health benefits and possibly housing to those workers. That way the burden is not our our local/federal government, rather on the employer who is benefiting from the program.

You misread my post it said “citizens and legal workers”. Those here on a workers visa, green card etc are legal.

I agree with the employer being responsible for the costs of health and housing for “guest workers”.

 

[rlg94086]

You misread my post it said “citizens and legal workers”. Those here on a workers visa, green card etc are legal.

I agree with the employer being responsible for the costs of health and housing for “guest workers”.

Okay. The sentence before that one you said "I also believe that there should beno specialprivileges for those that come here** legal or not ", **so it was a little confusing.

I’m glad we agree.

 

[KathleenElsie]

Special privileges meaning things that citizens are not entitled to on any basis.

 

[a_priori]

If you step back and look at the big picture you will see that a large portion of this country used to belong to the Mexicans. This was someone else’s land altogether.

My family has been here since 1632. What gave us the moral license to come here with superior technology and displace the inhabitants? Maybe they objected to us “coming over the border” to find a better standard of living. They had a sense of higher purpose and believed they had a God-given mandate to claim the land, eventually in the form of manifest destiny.

All you need to take over a place is technology and a strong philosophical underpinning that supports and justifies your intentions. This is as old as mankind. I would argue that Christianity is often interpreted to achieve certain political/military goals. This is not good but history is littered with examples. The Gospel gets lost.

Immigration will take place, people will move across borders upsetting the status quo and the land will serve a new people and their aspirations. It is as inexorable as the course of a mighty river. My ancestors would be spinning in their graves if they could see my Mexican daughter (now at B.U.) and Korean son in their family tree.

We should see all people through God’s eyes as image-bearers of His and conduct our civic affairs accordingly. All immigrants want is what most of us have. A better life. This reminds me of that old distinction between a developer and an environmentalist. A developer wants a house in the woods. An environmentalist already has a house in the woods. It’s a loose parallel but concept is the same.

 

[rlg94086]

Hi a_priori,

We went down this road in a couple of other threads. You could make the same argument in Europe with all the invasions, wars, etc. through history. We need to deal with governments and borders today. I don’t know of a country that has open borders, with no immigration control.

This is not a matter of stopping immigration, it’s legal vs. illegal immigration.

If you step back and look at the big picture you will see that a large portion of this country used to belong to the Mexicans. This was someone else’s land altogether.

My family has been here since 1632. What gave us the moral license to come here with superior technology and displace the inhabitants? Maybe they objected to us “coming over the border” to find a better standard of living. They had a sense of higher purpose and believed they had a God-given mandate to claim the land, eventually in the form of manifest destiny.

All you need to take over a place is technology and a strong philosophical underpinning that supports and justifies your intentions. This is as old as mankind. I would argue that Christianity is often interpreted to achieve certain political/military goals. This is not good but history is littered with examples. The Gospel gets lost.

Immigration will take place, people will move across borders upsetting the status quo and the land will serve a new people and their aspirations. It is as inexorable as the course of a mighty river. My ancestors would be spinning in their graves if they could see my Mexican daughter (now at B.U.) and Korean son in their family tree.

We should see all people through God’s eyes as image-bearers of His and conduct our civic affairs accordingly. All immigrants want is what most of us have. A better life. This reminds me of that old distinction between a developer and an environmentalist. A developer wants a house in the woods. An environmentalist already has a house in the woods. It’s a loose parallel but concept is the same.

 

[Liberalsaved]

But I think alot of people despise Mexicans in this country. I think they hate them. I think people say other reasons for not wanting Spanish spoken, or immigration, but basically they just can’t stand Mexicans.

Definitely. I know people otherwise intelligent who, if there are just one or two factors in place if a crime is committed (thus “It’s in so and so neighborhood”) it must have been mexicans.

 

[Liberalsaved]

I think the hatred you are sensing is not rooted deeply, but is the manifestation of fear: the fear that the country is being substantially changed and that they will become “foreignors” in their own nation.

I find a lot of the people opposed to an influx of citizenry from Mexico are simply in need of a broader acceptance that in the ebb and flow of time, things will change. We each occupy such a small dot in that flow, that we get used to everything being similar.

 

[Hastrman]

One thing that does need to be dealt with is a change in our policy on coyotes (border smugglers). For those of you who don’t live on the border, coyotes are among the most evil human beings in the world, often abandoning or even murdering their ‘cargo’ halfway through because of complications, or even if they just feel like it. Many of them rape women they’re transporting, or demand sexual favors in addition to payment.

They’re vile individuals, but for some stupid reason, they’re deported, and the people they smuggle are jailed. They need to reverse that–deport illegals, but imprison (or crucify… ) coyotes. With them out of the way, much of the violence at the border goes away, too.

 

[KathleenElsie]

Definitely. I know people otherwise intelligent who, if there are just one or two factors in place if a crime is committed (thus “It’s in so and so neighborhood”) it must have been Mexicans.

How I understand what you are saying is when you live in an area some one group is always blamed on the spot.

in the country it is the “hicks” etc

in the inner city it could be the “blacks”, “Mexicans”, “Cubans”
in ethnic neighborhoods it could be the “French”, “Polish” etc

in religious based neighborhoods it is “Catholics”, “Protestants”, “Jews” etc

So maybe someone can tell me how you should describe someone. What is the correct that way for some accused of committing a crime? Is there a politically correct way? Or can we just say a human being did it? Then everyone will be equal.

What should be call people that enter a country illegally? What should we call people of color in order to describe them?

 

[bapcathluth]

I see a lot of Mexican hatred. In my experience these immigrants are very hard-working. I see them on the hottest days of summer working as roofers and gardeners. They take the low paid jobs and work hard.

Yet, I hear many people calling them lazy. I don’t understand that.

 

[geezerbob]

Before I retired, I had several Mexicans who worked for me. They had the same virtues and faults as anybody else. I had one group that was lazy and had to get rid of the whole bunch. In the next group, I had a hard working but alcoholic family man and three all around good people other than their lack of English skills. Except for the English, pretty much the same problems as with the locals.

 

[SeekerJen]

I see a lot of Mexican hatred. In my experience these immigrants are very hard-working. I see them on the hottest days of summer working as roofers and gardeners. They take the low paid jobs and work hard.

Yet, I hear many people calling them lazy. I don’t understand that.

I don’t understand it either. I grew up watching my father work 12-16 hour days, 6 or 7 days a week all through my childhood, which allowed my mother to stay home and me to attend a Catholic school. Hard factory and warehouse labor, too, nothing cushy. I know that he learned his work ethic from his parents (legal Mexican immigrants), who raised seven children in a home that they bought, working night and day to make ends meet. I know that every weekend of the summer was spent picking for area farmers to raise extra money. Lazy? I think not.

 

[Jedi_Master]

there is a lot of hatred towards Mexicans these days. The fact that there are more hate crimes committed these days against Mexicans is just one indication of it.

 

[Jeffrey]

there is a lot of hatred towards Mexicans these days. The fact that there are more hate crimes committed these days against Mexicans is just one indication of it.

 

[Syele]

I don’t hate Mexicans, but I’ve recently (the last couple of years) started having, well, “issues”. Why?

I couldn’t enjoy the city 4th of July Celebration because the entire crowd started a chat “Proud to Be Mexican! Proud to be Mexican!” And none of the music was in English. (I can just imagine the news coverage that would have ensued if I went to the Cinco de Mayo fiesta with a large crowd of people and started chanting “Proud to be American!” I can’t get a job in my hometown because my Spanish is not good enough. There are people working at jobs I applied for who can only barely speak English. I get called Racist if I say “Mexican” instead of “Hispanic.” (This one confuses me… they had no trouble being proud of it on the 4th of July!)

Then I hear the numbers of people from Mexico who are here illeagally and I have to wonder if it’s an immigration problem or a Hostile takeover attempt.