Anti-Mexican Hatred disguised as patriotism

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Jedi_Master said:
there is a lot of hatred towards Mexicans these days. The fact that there are more hate crimes committed these days against Mexicans is just one indication of it.
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This is a news forum. If you’re going to make such a statement, you’re expected to furnish a link to a news article supporting it.
 
Could it be fear? A waitress from India objected loudly when my children and I spoke Spanish among ourselves. We are at home with either tongue, and since the waitress was not the topic of our conversation, or even if she had been, her fright should not have been turned on us. (The restaurant company has apologized, and I notice the waitress is gone.)
In our public school district, Spanish-speaking children are put into “immersion”, a sink-or-swim English program. But the district hires translators and schedules special classes for new arrivals from Asian countries.
Am I anti-Asian? My favorite aunt, a native of Tokyo, doesn’t think so.
 
I strongly believe that communist front groups are causing the hatred amoungst races. In order to take over they start to create hatred amoungst all races, promote immorality(Abortion, sex outside of marriage, sodomy, pornography , all sorts of sexual deviant behaviors) persecute religion Judeo Christian especially Catholicism! they tax the people to death!, start to take away our rights to bear arms, tear down the countrys borders, they use certain ethnic groups , you have the KKK and skin heads poisioning the minds of certain “white people” , the Nation of Islam poisioning certain"black people", La Raza poisioning hispanic people. Iam sure there is a group for all races poisioning the minds of certain people of that particular ethnic group. I believe we need to protect the borders from illegal immigration , because we need to asmilate the people who are already here and also help those who are desperate to feed their families who come from countries that are so corrupt because of Marxism, facism, socialism, Communism, I have to find the Catechism Quote on this issue. If Our Country goes down no one is going to get help. Who does the world turn to when in need of money? The Good old USA! My late grandfather of Spanish/English descent spoke both English and Spanish fluently fought for our country during WWII , he has two purple hearts ,he would be turning over in his grave if The USA was taken over by communist, facist ,socialist ,marxist of any kind. In spite of all the problems we are still best country in the world , that is why so many people want to come here! Yes! Iam a patriot!, because my grandfather taught me how to be!
 
mystified said:
In our public school district, Spanish-speaking children are put into “immersion”, a sink-or-swim English program. But the district hires translators and schedules special classes for new arrivals from Asian countries.

I think a lot of the national discussion has focused on people from Mexico, but as you note there are distinctive regional differences in how people are treated. In the Dallas area a friend who is a US citizen whose children are billingual in German/English was told by the school district that his children are not “billingual” because their other language is not Spanish! Mind you they were born in Germany and one had initial schooling in German. No special services are provided unless the 1st language is Spanish, so other children must “sink or swim” while dual instruction is provided for Spanish speakers. He pays the same taxes for the district, but his kids are not eligible for special help in transitioning. I think that sort of preferential treatment has fueled resentment in some people which does not necesarily mean that they are prejudiced against a whole group of people.
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Jedi_Master said:
cute face to post after stating that there is a rise in hate crimes. Totally unexpected in a Catholic forum. My guess you’re not Catholic.
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There seems to be a lot of people questioning others relgious faith on the forums lately. A lot of people are getting desperate.
 
No personal attacks, please. Also, as someone pointed out earlier, this is a news forum. Claims should be supported by links to news articles.

Walt
 
I have helped an illegal immigrant have her child when she became pregnant and had no where to go.

What could I do? These people are human beings, just like us.

I don’t think people hate the Mexicans. They resent being used.
That they are taking advantage of the system is our fault for allowing it.

My husband is an immigrant (not from Mexico). He would never even dream of using the system. He says it is against the law to be an illegal immigrant in Mexico, and that a person cannot own land even after being naturalized (why anyone would want that is beyond me). This land is a virtual candyland compared to there. But their families and their hearts remain. They can no more stop being Mexican here than we could stop being American there.

Not all of them are trying to take over. Some traitors in this country are putting ideas in their heads. Plus, the rumours abound in those countries about how their elderly can come over and get social security and what-not. We need to go after the traitors that are baiting these people. We are rich beyond thier wildest dreams to them. And, frankly, I don’t feel I’m eating any less because of them. If they want to work like dogs for next to nothing, more power to them. They are not entitled to special treatment, however.
 
geezerbob said:
My personal observations are that what we are seeing is not hatred as much as it is annoyance that this group of immigrants, legal or not, is demanding and getting all sorts of concessions that no previous group has gotten. Some things are indeed irritating and I can understand at least some of the anger.

Those who are here without family do tend to crowd way too many people into a rental house so they can send more money back home. That money never makes its way into our economy. This practice also has some undesired effects on the neighborhoods.

Smaller annoyances include calling a business and being asked to press 1 for English.

The Hispanics didn’t exactly endear themselves to the rest of the population when they hoisted Mexican flags above public buildings and burned American flags during their demonstrations a few month ago, either.

I guess what can be seen as hatred is sometimes annoyance at some of the things these people are doing rather than out-and-out racial hatred.

My :twocents:
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This is right on the money although I think the level of frustration far exceeds annoyance. We have politicians on both sides of the aisle pandering for the immigrant vote, legal or otherwise. That is totally self serving on the part of the career politicians in that it smacks in the face of true American citizens who get stuck with dealing with the aftermath. It is not a hatred for Mexicans but for the inequities associated with their migration into this country. For those catholics out there, the Legionaires of Christ are at the top of the list for being the most devout order of priests on the planet; an order which was founded in Mexico. It’s not just Mexican immigrants but also those coming here from third world countries that has people up in arms and for good reason. The only thing they bring to the party is cheap labor and a new wave of diseases (e.g., tuburculosis, leprosy, etc.) most of which were extinct in this country. For that, they pay no taxes, do not assimilate, get free health care, free education and subsidized housing just to name a few of the perks. We who live here, work here, pay the taxes to support the former and yet do not receive the same benefits think the politicians have gone loco cabassa. :confused:
 
geezerbob said:
Of the 8,000+ victims of crimes identified as hate crimes, 8.2% of the total was because of anti-Hispanic bias. The reporting year was 2005. The numbers look a little different when put in the proper context.
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Geezerbob,

It’s really late but I just had to reply before retiring for the night.

I wouldn’t take too much comfort from your figures even if they were true, Hate Crimes are nothing to ignore even if they were 1%.

Anyone can manipulate these figures. Take a look at Table 5 by subtracting out the unknown numbers from the total against Hispanics one can conclude that 71.2% of the known Hate Crime perpetrators were White and none of the Hispanics were known to be guilty of Hate Crimes. I don’t buy those conclusions. I think both are understated.

Look at Tables 11 & 12 and there are some revealing problems with this type of document. Look at the figures for California and New York. Notice anything? Of all 50 states California has the highest reported Hate Crimes. Does this mean that California is a more dangerous state for victims of Hate Crimes? Though I think that in general Hate Crimes are under reported, California simply does a better job of reporting. Now look at Texas. No way am I buying those figures. Simply too low from what I have known the Texan experience has been compared to the Californian experience. But the truly tell tale numbers come from a combined total of 99 agencies from Alabama and Mississippi with ZERO Hate Crimes reported. Do you believe those figures to be indicative of the reality in those two states? No, I think the only thing we know for sure is that these numbers aren’t reflective of the reality and that the reality is likely worse than the figures indicate.
 
Ituyu, you seem to be reading something into my post which wasn’t intended. I had questioned another poster who had made a statement about hate crimes and he responded with this study and used it to support a 58% number. The problem is, 58% of what? I was merely pointing out that the number is misleading, just as the lower number I posted is misleading because it is not in the context of total crimes committed. I was in no way trying to justify violence against anyone, merely pointing out the error of pulling numbers out of a report to justify a broad statement.

This whole “hate crime” thing is beyond political correctness. How do you identify hate crimes? Does a crime of opportunity suddenly become a hate crime if the assailant utters a racial slur during its commission? Even with the best methods of gathering data, the identification of hate crimes still comes down to a judgment call on the part of law enforcement, and that’s never going to be uniform. There seems to be a disturbing tendency for advocates of any particular group to want to classify all violent crimes against members of that group as hate crimes, and that isn’t necessarily the case.

To illustrate the difficulty, we’ve had three recent cases here that could be considered borderline hate crimes against Hispanics. In one, a drug deal gone bad resulted in a shootout between the Blacks and Hispanics involved. In another, a group of Blacks was targeting Hispanics and robbing them during home invasions. Law enforcement officials are still unsure if this was a result of an intense dislike for Hispanics or if they were considered easy targets because of their reluctance to call police. A half dozen or so robberies occurred before the police were notified. Once the complaints were filed, though, arrests were made within a few days. The third case, which is unsolved at this time, targets Hispanic construction workers. Somebody is following them home from job sites, then coming back later and stealing expensive power tools from them, usually stored on trailers or in trucks. Again, it is very difficult to determine if these are hate crimes or simply crimes of opportunity.

Another point is that your post implied that I was somehow trying to justify violence against Hispanics when I was merely pointing out an error in using numbers from a report. If you will read some of my other posts, you will see that I have employed (legal) Hispanics in the past and have found them to have the same characteristics, both good and bad, as local workers. Some go to church, some don’t; some are womanizers, some are devoted family men; some drink too much, some don’t; some are industrious, some are lazy. They’re individual humans, just like the rest of us, and I’ve always treated them as such. It is just as biased to say that all immigrants, legal or otherwise, are just hard working people who want to support their families as it is to say that they are all a bunch of thieving, beer drinking ingrates, so please don’t assume that I am prejudiced against them because I try to tell it like it is and refuse to use a broad whitewash brush to make them appear to be something they’re not.
 
Sailboat said:
I was posting at another forum for awhile, but quit yesterday because I noticed again and again that alot of the anti-immigration talk was really hatred for Mexicans. The post that finally got to me said that the solution was to shoot them and pile up their corpses.

Now I’d like to see some better enforcement of immigration laws. I think that the children of illegals born in the U.S. should NOT be given U.S. citizenship unless one of the parents is a citizen. I think our social welfare system encourages not only foreigners to take advantage of it, but also discourages our own poor people from seeking the employment that supposedly we need foreigners for. I also think that we should really come down on employers.

But I think alot of people despise Mexicans in this country. I think they hate them. I think people say other reasons for not wanting Spanish spoken, or immigration, but basically they just can’t stand Mexicans.
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maybe this will explain their reason to feel unsecure about the mexicans youtube.com/watch?v=HODz9r-khws this one is disturbing and it makes me wish america was never created because what do you think they will use the power of weapons for when they take over?, the english should just let the indians alone and btw im not american but i can undertsand their feelings in this sitiation, but do you? youtube.com/watch?v=RM9uH4XgOmI
 
geezerbob said:
Ituyu, you seem to be reading something into my post which wasn’t intended. I had questioned another poster who had made a statement about hate crimes and he responded with this study and used it to support a 58% number. The problem is, 58% of what?

I fail to see how the 58% figure is misleading. I double checked the figure, it is rounded off, but under the heading listed on Table 5, indeed of the Reported Hate Crimes against individuals based soley on Ethincity/National Origin the figure is correct. What one can legitimately conclude is that Hispanics as an Ethnic group bear the brunt of Hate Crimes against them that is disproportionate to their population. In other words indeed their appears to be a spike in Hate Crimes against Hispanics.
This whole “hate crime” thing is beyond political correctness. How do you identify hate crimes? Does a crime of opportunity suddenly become a hate crime if the assailant utters a racial slur during its commission? Even with the best methods of gathering data, the identification of hate crimes still comes down to a judgment call on the part of law enforcement, and that’s never going to be uniform.
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Another point is that your post implied that I was somehow trying to justify violence against Hispanics when I was merely pointing out an error in using numbers from a report. If you will read some of my other posts, you will see that I have employed (legal) Hispanics in the past and have found them to have the same characteristics, both good and bad, as local workers. Some go to church, some don’t; some are womanizers, some are devoted family men; some drink too much, some don’t; some are industrious, some are lazy. They’re individual humans, just like the rest of us, and I’ve always treated them as such. It is just as biased to say that all immigrants, legal or otherwise, are just hard working people who want to support their families as it is to say that they are all a bunch of thieving, beer drinking ingrates, so please don’t assume that I am prejudiced against them because I try to tell it like it is and refuse to use a broad whitewash brush to make them appear to be something they’re not.
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Actually there was no error in the report nor in the method used to come up with the figure. It what one concludes the figure means. That figure does not say that 58 percent of all Hate Crimes are directed at Hispanics due to their ethnicity, only those reported where ethnicity was THE motive.

I don’t recall anyone saying that ALL immigrants are “hard working people who want to support their families”. I’ve always used the words, “the vast majority” or “most”. But, those on the opposing side have used the blanket statement that, “All illegal immigrants are CRIMINALS”. When one considers the “crime” is a “Civil Infraction” and such persons are not usually referred to as “Criminals” and that neither “work” or “contributing” to our economy are crimes, the label is not an appropriate one for “MOST”. To proceed against those who are here, working hard and supporting their families while obeying our laws once here is difficult if not impossible to reconcile to Church Teachings on our neighbors, the poor etc. as it serves no meaningful purpose that serves the “Common Good”.

My concern were your words that:
“The numbers look a little different when put in the proper context.”

For two reasons: One, the proper context of a Hate Crime should be that they are all BAD and should not be casually dismissed. For me, there is no other context. And, two, you seem to be inclined to support those with the most extreme anti-immigrant views lately, Though in fairness, I do recall you posting a concern about the plight of the"Illegal"immigrant student. So, I am aware of your other positions but this is more for the benefit of those reading these posts who may not know you as well.
 
I guess Mexicans and other Latin Americans, in fact also Asians should feel a fear and hatred towards Americans considering that many go to their countries to exploit children. Countless of Americans go on these “sex tours” to have sex with children. Should these countries then consider Americans as child predators because some Americans that travel into their country go into for abusing children? What bothers me about some of these posts is that they will take the ugliest aspect of what some illegal immigrants do and smear every person with it. It is wrong. Just as it is wrong to consider every American travelling to Latin America a child predator.
 
Jedi_Master said:
I guess Mexicans and other Latin Americans, in fact also Asians should feel a fear and hatred towards Americans considering that many go to their countries to exploit children. Countless of Americans go on these “sex tours” to have sex with children. Should these countries then consider Americans as child predators because some Americans that travel into their country go into for abusing children? What bothers me about some of these posts is that they will take the ugliest aspect of what some illegal immigrants do and smear every person with it. It is wrong. Just as it is wrong to consider every American travelling to Latin America a child predator.
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Amen! I’ve seen it here in LA. An immigrant commits a crime that makes the news and the next day, all over right-wing radio, it’s “see how the Mexicans are!” It’s sickening.
 
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