Any Anti Vaxxers on here who do not want to take the COVID vaccine?

[redcatholic]

Actually I feel pretty good about it. The people that will be getting it first are the ones most at risk or who are in close contact with the virus. I’d feel worse taking it before they did because the risk to them from the actual virus is greater. The benefit is that I get to wait. But that waiting is also risky. I isolate a lot and those I’ve know with Covid have been pretty mild with symptoms. It will be interesting to see how long the vaccines last. Natural immunity seems to be 4 to 6 months so a double does vaccine a month apart might have to be administered 4 times a year unless it disappears.

 

[redcatholic]

Because the risk to certain people of Covid is not as great. A 30 year old might think there’s more a risk of a rushed vaccine than Covid but an 85 year old might be the opposite with a risk assessment.

 

[Glennon_P]

old people dying is G*d’s winnowing fork

The same case could be made for younger people dying from smallpox, tuberculosis, bubonic plague, influenza…name your favorite disease.

Should we do nothing to stop those diseases?

 

[MikeInVA]

The more a vaccine is pushed in the media the less likely I am to want it. The HPV vaccine is one such - the nurses in the clinic were adamant that my children get it but my wife and I refused.
I can’t wait for all of the commercials touting these miracle cures that will allow us to live normal lives again.

 

[gam197]

It depends what you mean about anti vaxxers… We did not take vaccines with fetal cell tissue in them. The vaccine was for chicken pox and Germans measles

We were able to contact a group and they gave us the name of another pharmacy that separated the German measles from the other two shots. so they shipped the other vaccines in the Measles, Mumps and Rubella (MMR) series separately. Has this changed, no idea.

That said I am so relieved that they decided not to include fetal tissue in these shots and I certainly hope it is effective and does not have any more dangerous risks than are already in the flu shots.

Final thought is for those people who are at risk of a serious Illness or death especially because of age even it they had fetal tissue in a vaccine, I believe that the Church would say get the shot. Ask a priest.

The Vaccine Dilemma | Catholic Answers Magazine

From Sunday Visitor…

Answer: It is dubious that “all vaccines” have MRC-5 derived from aborted fetuses. Nevertheless, even with this possibility, a Catholic is still free to get a vaccine. While we are never free to directly cooperate in evil —

Can Catholics get vaccines made from aborted fetal cells?

 

[Kima]

I don´t have any risk factors related to covid so I´m far back in the line of getting the vaccine either way. But if there are more risks with taking it, rather than actually getting covid then I´ll refrain from taking it. I´m very much young and healthy (as far as I know) and I don´t wanna get any side-effects or complications that could affect my life more gravely than covid.

Also, if I have to wait so long to get the vaccine that we´ve already established immunity in the population then I see less reason to take it as long as covid doesn´t become a yearly thing like the Flu etc.

But I´m in no way an anti-vaxer or anything. I´ve personally taken all of the vaccines in the program when I was a kid, and I even took the swine flu vaccine in 2009/2010. So I´m generally positive to vaccines, I just wanna make sure I´m not exposing my body to more harm than the actual disease it´s supposed to protect me from

 

[gam197]

I don´t have any risk factors related to covid so I´m far back in the line of getting the vaccine either way. But if there are more risks with taking it, rather than actually getting covid then I´ll refrain from taking it. I´m very much young and healthy (as far as I know) and I don´t wanna get any side-effects or complications that could affect my life more gravely than covid.

These are questions people are going to have to ask their doctors. My son was not allowed to get the Mumps vaccine as a child because he had seizures.

Let’s pray it is similar to a normal flu shot, so that everyone who needs it will be able to get it.

Also, if I have to wait so long to get the vaccine that we´ve already established immunity in the population then I see less reason to take it as long as covid doesn´t become a yearly thing like the Flu etc.

That is a serious concern because we are not sure how herd immunity works fully. Possibly if you get it this time, it will help if the virus mutates in the future.?

 

[Kima]

That is a serious concern because we are not sure how herd immunity works fully. Possibly if you get it this time, it will help if the virus mutates in the future.?

I´m not sure actually. I´ve heard that at least 50% of the population needs to get vaccinated in order to stop the virus from spreading much further. When 50% is vaccinated the virus will more or less stop, and it will be a lot easier to quarantine the right people etc because, hopefully, everyone who has had the virus or the vaccine will be immune.

 

[redcatholic]

Immunity seems to be about 6 months or so… I’m surprised when the news says we are a couple of weeks away from a vaccine being administered but basic questions aren’t being answered. How long does immunity last, will it be cyclical like the flu? If 35 percent or so get the vaccine including the vulnerable then letting the virus run its course won’t overwhelm healthcare? What does one dose do if a person doesn’t get the second? Will the schools be the tool used to vaccinate many children?

Also, the rollout we are told will be smooth. So, if we are weeks away, and it will relax the strain on healthcare and workers and the vulnerable, why are most governments, international, national and local relocking at such a fast pace? Why are these lockdowns not being talked about in a timetable of a couple of weeks or so? So many questions, I guess we can sit back and watch until it’s our turn and then we might know more

 

[gam197]

? What does one dose do if a person doesn’t get the second? Will the schools be the tool used to vaccinate many children?

Hopefully, both doses will be administered. I hope the schools stay out of it because it will put pressure on parents who may not want the vaccine for their children. I hope it is done by private physicians…

Also, the rollout we are told will be smooth. So, if we are weeks away, and it will relax the strain on healthcare and workers and the vulnerable, why are most governments, international, national and local relocking at such a fast pace? Why are these lockdowns not being talked about in a timetable of a couple of weeks or so?

I think they are concerned that the rates are rising . We are almost there. It will take a while but the first batch will go to healthcare workers, and hopefully teachers and supermarket personnel.

Once that is done it is on to the elderly and those with pre-existing conditions, the most at risk, , so if all goes as planned and shots are similar to flu shots, they will have clinics at many different locations so the general population will have good access.

Let’s hope within months we will be looking back at this. The news media has to have stories so we are going to hear horrors but let pray all goes as planned.

 

[gam197]

gam197:

That is a serious concern because we are not sure how herd immunity works fully. Possibly if you get it this time, it will help if the virus mutates in the future.?

I´m not sure actually. I´ve heard that at least 50% of the population needs to get vaccinated in order to stop the virus from spreading much further. When 50% is vaccinated the virus will more or less stop, and it will be a lot easier to quarantine the right people etc because, hopefully, everyone who has had the virus or the vaccine will be immune.

You do not sound like you are at risk for any problems but wonder what happens when it mutates as they always seem to. Will 50 percent get vaccinated, or will it be mostly the elderly and those with health problems? They really need to address this once they have the vaccines out there.

 

[Annie]

If a sufficient proportion choose not to vaccinate, your reason to vaccinate is negated. You won’t achieve the logical ends you sought.

I do not understand your comment here. When I had me children vaccinated, it was to protect them from getting the sickness. Even if only my children were the ones to get vaccinated, they would not get sick, and that would achieve the logical ends I sought.

Maybe your logical reasoning leaves something to be desired. Did you know that correlation does not mean causation?

Could it be that eliminating the likelihood of getting one form of flu in the population around you provides another flu with more space to be caught? I mean, I don’t know, but it seems like a possibility?

 

[Annie]

To all those who say “I won’t take it until many millions of others take it first”, how do you feel about benefitting from the risk that others take? Those who take the vaccine are doing it as much for those who don’t take it as they are doing it for themselves. To put it another way, suppose you worked at the CDC and were charged with deciding if the vaccine is safe and effective. Would you withhold approval of the vaccine until you yourself were willing to take it? Or would you approve it and then wait for millions of people to take it first before considering if you would take it?

Or, to put it a third way, do you want the CDC to withhold approval until you would be willing to be the first in the general public to take it? Or would secretly like to see the vaccine approved so others can test it for you on themselves?

Along with someone else, I am a caretaker for someone who is extremely vulnerable and homebound. If I could take the vaccine I would, because it would help me protect my loved one.

This is because I have done a risk/benefit analysis and feel that for me, in my circumstances taking the vaccine would be a benefit.

I am not doing it for the purpose of taking a risk for those who are unwilling to take the risk; they have their own situations. We have had enough problems with initial roll-out of vaccines that if they feel they would be risking too much by taking the vaccine, that is fine.

For instance, some initial forms of vaccines affected fertility. I am post-menopausal, so I do not face that risk. But if a young woman had to make the decision for herself, I would understand her waiting: her risk from the virus is low, and her fertility very important.

GK Chesteron pointed out that when one has a sick child, one calls the doctor. One does not say, but maybe other people have sicker children, one takes the responsibility one has for one’s own child and calls the doctor.

So many people who get this are asymptomatic or only mildly sick that the benefit of a vaccine for them is minimal. Why should they take it?

Thos who want to avoid catching the virus should be allowed to take it, and those who don’t it want to should be allowed not to.

 

[Annie]

That is an ironic point! Here in the US I do not think we cut benefits for lack of vaccines, but we are very concerned about disproportionate effects.

It would be a shame is forcing vaccines on people were to disproportionately affect the poor and disenfranchised…

 

[Pattylt]

From my understanding, and I could be wrong, the vaccine will be a two dose vaccine in order to achieve a longer immunity timetable. The initial shot introduces the virus so your body will recognize it but that recognition declines rather rapidly. The second booster not only awakens the immune system again, it kind of supercharges it…producing a longer lasting immunity as well as a stronger one.

Herd immunity is the idea that every virus has an R0. This is the rate that each virus needs to replicate amongst a community in order to keep spreading. At R1, the virus is halted from spreading because enough people are immune that it can’t find enough people to continue its spread. It doesn’t necessarily die out, it just goes to such a low spread rate that cases become rare. Herd immunity numbers depend on the infectious nature of the virus itself. Covid has been estimated to be around 60% of the population being immune. If 50% get the vaccine and another 10% are immune due to having had Covid, we’ve reached 60%.

I think they are assuming that the vaccine may have to be yearly or every two years…we just don’t know that yet. It may be that just the booster is needed every year or two years. It’s doubtful it would be a lifelong immunity…mostly due to the ability of virus to mutate. The initial vaccine will probably cover the initial mutations as well. There comes a point where any virus mutates enough to no longer be recognized by ones current immunity. That will also give the researchers time to develop further vaccines for mutated strains.

It’s true that long term problems with a new vaccine are not known until enough time has passed. However, most complications with any vaccine are usually known quite quickly. A problem arising two years down the road are extremely rare.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

Along with someone else, I am a caretaker for someone who is extremely vulnerable and homebound. If I could take the vaccine I would, because it would help me protect my loved one.

This is because I have done a risk/benefit analysis and feel that for me, in my circumstances taking the vaccine would be a benefit.

Not just for you, but for that loved one that you want to protect. Your risk/benefit analysis included that other person. If you don’t want to be responsible for infecting that loved one, why would you not care about your being responsible for infecting someone else?

GK Chesteron pointed out that when one has a sick child, one calls the doctor. One does not say, but maybe other people have sicker children, one takes the responsibility one has for one’s own child and calls the doctor.

The reason this makes sense is that calling the doctor only benefits the one sick child he is visiting. If the doctor is sent to a different child, that different child benefits, but your child does not. That makes perfect sense. But taking a vaccine is not like that. If you take a vaccine, you are protecting yourself and your loved ones. But you are also protecting anyone you might come in contact with. The benefit flows to everybody or to nobody. So the reasoning behind the Chesterton example does not apply to the decision to get a vaccination.

I am not doing it for the purpose of taking a risk for those who are unwilling to take the risk;

The thing is, you cannot take a vaccine and protect your loved ones without also protecting those slackers you refer to. It is all or nothing. Either you benefit everyone you come in contact with (by taking the vaccine) or you benefit no one (by not taking the vaccine.)

For instance, some initial forms of vaccines affected fertility.

The “initial forms” are not what is being evaluated. I don’t expect they will approve a vaccine that poses a risk to fertility. If there is a risk to fertility in the vaccine that gets approved, it will be specified that it must not be taken by young women. But that just isn’t going to happen because the vaccine will not have that risk.

So many people who get this are asymptomatic or only mildly sick that the benefit of a vaccine for them is minimal. Why should they take it?

Two reasons. One is that you don’t know if you are going to get a mild case until you get it. The other reason is that even if you do get a mild case, you don’t want to be responsible for spreading the virus to those that will die from it.

Thos who want to avoid catching the virus should be allowed to take it, and those who don’t it want to should be allowed not to.

We have not allowed that kind of unfettered freedom in public schools for a long time. Why should this vaccine be any different?

 

[pnewton]

I think the OP question is irrelevant. The bigger question is how will those who do take vaccines and believe in current medical science react. This vaccine is a new animal. It was rushed and has not had the test of time.

I will take it ASAP. I mean, someone has to, or some people have to. We have a quarter of a million dead and no other path to normality without digging more graves, at least as it stands now. Those that will not take it, will simply have to rely on the charity and willingness to take personal risks by those who do want the country back on its feet. This is nothing new. It has always taken some willing to step up for those who won’t, or those who are not able.

 

[gam197]

I think the OP question is irrelevant. The bigger question is how will those who do take vaccines and believe in current medical science react. This vaccine is a new animal. It was rushed and has not had the test of time.

Let’s hope that it has no more problems than a regular flu shot. The elderly and those with pre-existing conditions need to be a top priority.

We can’t all run out there and get shots if we are not at risk because there will be a delay in giving shots to the people who need it. Maybe when more vaccines are available, then others at low risk can get the shots but not initially.

Also, be prepared to get a mild case of flu because the regular flu can do that. No big deal.

 

[pnewton]

The elderly and those with pre-existing conditions need to be a top priority.

That is one of the questions I have with this vaccination program. I understand medical workers being at the top, and I would understand those who work with the elderly, including family that regularly visits assisted care facilities, but I worry that putting the elderly at the top might leave the more vulnerable in the position of testing the side effects.

 

[gam197]

gam197:

The elderly and those with pre-existing conditions need to be a top priority.

That is one of the questions I have with this vaccination program. I understand medical workers being at the top, and I would understand those who work with the elderly, including family that regularly visits assisted care facilities, but I worry that putting the elderly at the top might leave the more vulnerable in the position of testing the side effects.

That has always been the way with flu shots… If you are concerned that you cannot survive this flu no matter what age, then please get the vaccine. That is not being selfish.

Others do not feel at risk and more than likely are not at risk and they need to hold back until those at higher risk get the shot. Then when more vaccines arrive, they should feel free to get it. Hopefully that will not be too long.