Anybody out there "pro-choice"?

[limerick]

Again, you don’t seem to understand what Purgatory is. I’m not going to go into it here.

Your disdain will make any answer I give pointless. It seems to me that you’ve made up your mind on things and the words of someone you have no respect for will do nothing. I’m sorry for the things that you’ve gone through, I’m glad that you’ve carried yourself through them.

I’m withdrawing from this particular discussion. I wish you the best.

**
It appears** that when a poster has no answer for a question, whether that question was posed in all sincerity or was thrown out there in contempt, that poster will “recoil, as if from a hot flame.” I’ve seen it many times on this forum. It’s easier to bow out and take your toys and go home than it is to assume responsibility for your faith and carry that message under fire.

But you’re right. I’m just here to argue.

Be well.

L

 

[royal_archer]

**Guess you have the Cliff’s Notes version of this thread, huh archer?

L**

672 post to search through to try to find out where you were you explained how nuns teaching truth was indefensible? I’m sure others would tollerate if you gave us the condensed version again. The worse thing I ever heard about nuns were a few stories about innatentive kids getting their knuckles whacked with a ruler.

 

[royal_archer]

**You’re right, FanChan, I do not understand why, when Purgatory was already in place, Christ had to gather up everyone’s wrongdoings and be hanged on a cross to redeem every sinner. Isn’t that two solutions to one big problem? Why two?

“If we do not embrace His Grace and His Redemption, then He will not save us. It’s our choice. You’re for choice, yes?”** you ask. What if we embrace His grace and redemption through avenues other than or in addition to Catholicism? Are we still entitled to be saved? Yes, I am for choice - what if I choose Lutheranism and lead a clean and moral life? Do Catholics get front row seats in Heaven and all others get the cheap seats? I’m not attempting humor here, nor am I trying to offend - I just can’t think of a more graphic way to ask my question.

Please don’t read bitterness into my posts where I’ve only meant to convey mild disdain.

Limerick

Imagine every time you sin to be like having a car wreck with your soul. Each time you incur damage and a legal responsibility. Christ has paid off our legal responsiblity but our souls still need a lot of repair work before we are ready to enter heaven. (At least this is how I have come to understand it in terms I can relate to). I have done a fair number of bad things in my time an while I have confessed and received absolution and made ammends, I am still haunted by the painful memories. As such I am looking forward to purgatory in that it is through purgatory that those wound on my soul will finally be healed.

 

[SteveGC]

**
It appears** that when a poster has no answer for a question, whether that question was posed in all sincerity or was thrown out there in contempt, that poster will “recoil, as if from a hot flame.” I’ve seen it many times on this forum. It’s easier to bow out and take your toys and go home than it is to assume responsibility for your faith and carry that message under fire.

But you’re right. I’m just here to argue.

Be well.

L

Actually, I think FanChan has been quite engaged in dialogue with you, and quite articulate in providing the essential Christian message to you, despite your sour retorts. I don’t think FC is “recoiling”, but is simply recognizing the futility of spending significant effort to explain things to someone who seems to only be looking for the loopholes, or opportunities to vent their troubled Catholic past. No doubt FanChan can answer all your questions. Do you really want the answers? Are you ready to really absorb them?

Purgatory is not redemptive, it is cleansing. By itself, without the atonement of Christ, it is useless. Purgatory is a divine weigh-station (if you will) for those bound for heaven, to cleanse them of the remnants of the sin in their lives, sins that have been forgiven already, but the damage those sins caused still remains…must be purged…for nothing unclean can enter heaven. Christ’s sacrifice made what was once impossible (us Gentiles able to spend eternity with God), now possible. Purgatory is our final “wash-up” in preparation to enter the kingdom.

 

[royal_archer]

**
It appears** that when a poster has no answer for a question, whether that question was posed in all sincerity or was thrown out there in contempt, that poster will “recoil, as if from a hot flame.” I’ve seen it many times on this forum. It’s easier to bow out and take your toys and go home than it is to assume responsibility for your faith and carry that message under fire.

But you’re right. I’m just here to argue.

Be well.

L

And when are you going to answer my question about your reason for laying accusations against nuns?

 

[GodLovesTheSpek]

This one is forty-six pages.

Endless arguing only serves the argument and the taskmaster, The Liar, who gleefully watches on. We do not recoil from the flame. Instead, we engage in prayer and focus our attention and energy to He who does have the power to defeat The Deceiver, The Liar.

The Liar looses, his flame snuffed out.

 

[CMP2]

Fan Chan:

Good for you.

Limerick and others who question the Roman Catholic Faith:

Be Catholic or not. That is your choice. The truth and the whole truth is in the Catholic teachings. Not the watered down version of the 60’s and 70’s but the truth as declared for over 2000 years.

One does not HAVE to be Catholic, but the fullness of Christ’s teachings are in the Catholic Church. If you do not subscibe to this, or are unable to understand or to want to embrace and be abandoned to the faith then so be it. Go on your way. Embrace the ethic and faith you feel is yours. But please, don’t denegrate the true beliefs of the Catholic Church.

Chic tracts and reformist theology etc. are to be spewed out of the mouth of God. To be Christian is to be Catholic. To be pagan is to be otherwise. So be it.

If the Trinity is the center of God’s truth then ecumenicism is centered on the Eucharistic truth. The Trinity is the Eucharist. To be truly One Body is to be Eucharistic. As through the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Nobody insists you believe this truth. No human can. But God does. If you want to be Buddhist, Baptist, Hindu etc. then go there. If you want the Truth be Catholic. That is the bottom line.

Does God damn the Buddhist, Hindu, Baptist to Hell. I really don’t know, but I am convinced that all will spend their time in Purgatory to atone for their unbelief. For as long as it takes for the fullness of knowledge to come. Then all will be Catholic as all are in heaven.

All Saints are Catholic as all who are in heaven will become. Myself included the least worthy of all.

God bless us and may God have mercy on our souls. c.

 

[CMP2]

QUOTE: God loves the Spek:
“Endless arguing only serves the argument and the taskmaster, The Liar, who gleefully watches on. We do not recoil from the flame. Instead, we engage in prayer and focus our attention and energy to He who does have the power to defeat The Deceiver, The Liar.”

Yes, but remember the “liar” wants to silence us on the pretense of being humble and charitable. To be called "judgemental, divisive etc. is to make us afraid to speak up. Never compromise on the pretense of being “nice”. Christ and His Apostles never did. That is why they were crucified and beheaded etc. Don’t ever let anyone silence you on the side of “nice”.

 

[GodLovesTheSpek]

The point was to focus on “endless arguing”. Certainly, always stand up and educate and engage in healthy and productive discussion. It’s the endless bickering and picking apart lengthy arguments over and over to the point that there is no longer a point – that the argument in itself becomes an unhealthy distraction and potentially confusing and misleading to the unwary.

We don’t want people of good will to be silent OR to be so busy engaged (enslaved?) in arguing irrelevant details of wordsmithing that they, in effect, become silenced, buried in the noise by The Liar.

 

[limerick]

And when are you going to answer my question about your reason for laying accusations against nuns?

**I can’t stay on this box 24/7. I’ll get to it when I get to it, or you can sift through my many posts and look for it.

Limerick**

 

[limerick]

This one is forty-six pages.

Endless arguing only serves the argument and the taskmaster, The Liar, who gleefully watches on. We do not recoil from the flame. Instead, we engage in prayer and focus our attention and energy to He who does have the power to defeat The Deceiver, The Liar.

The Liar looses, his flame snuffed out.

**The Liar “looses”?

The best suggestion I can come up with is that the administrators of CAF prohibit any topic to be discussed that is likely to turn into a debate, particularly abortion. There is no common ground, there will be name-calling and ugliness, it is futile.

Why not just stick to the meaning of transubstantiation and recipe swaps?

Limerick**

 

[royal_archer]

**The Liar “looses”?

The best suggestion I can come up with is that the administrators of CAF prohibit any topic to be discussed that is likely to turn into a debate, particularly abortion. There is no common ground, there will be name-calling and ugliness, it is futile.

Why not just stick to the meaning of transubstantiation and recipe swaps?

Limerick**

There is common ground, you just refuse to accept it and join us there.

 

[royal_archer]

**I can’t stay on this box 24/7. I’ll get to it when I get to it, or you can sift through my many posts and look for it.

Limerick**

If you are not willing to explain or provide details you should not be accusing Nuns of behavior that was “indefensible”.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

I think that I will have difficulty engaging constructively, by my definition of what that means, if I continue this conversation. If I do re-engage, I will start by defining the word slaughter. Do you want me to?

Not necessary. I am in possession of a dictionary.

It is what it is. If that displeases you, maybe you need to examine what abortion actually entails.

 

[Revert_TSIEG]

**
It appears** that when a poster has no answer for a question, whether that question was posed in all sincerity or was thrown out there in contempt, that poster will “recoil, as if from a hot flame.” I’ve seen it many times on this forum. It’s easier to bow out and take your toys and go home than it is to assume responsibility for your faith and carry that message under fire.

But you’re right. I’m just here to argue.

Be well.

L

Yep… it is unfortunate! Speaking your mind gets your warned and sometimes banned. I guess we all have to agree on everything so that we do not get based for voicing our opinions.

Just my 2c

 

[elts1956]

**You’re right, FanChan, I do not understand why, when Purgatory was already in place, Christ had to gather up everyone’s wrongdoings and be hanged on a cross to redeem every sinner. Isn’t that two solutions to one big problem? Why two?

“If we do not embrace His Grace and His Redemption, then He will not save us. It’s our choice. You’re for choice, yes?”** you ask. What if we embrace His grace and redemption through avenues other than or in addition to Catholicism? Are we still entitled to be saved? Yes, I am for choice - what if I choose Lutheranism and lead a clean and moral life? Do Catholics get front row seats in Heaven and all others get the cheap seats? I’m not attempting humor here, nor am I trying to offend - I just can’t think of a more graphic way to ask my question.

Please don’t read bitterness into my posts where I’ve only meant to convey mild disdain.

Limerick

Wow! She’s just full of herself. It seems you have reached the highest level of self actualization. Congratulations. :bowdown2: You do remind me of a General from the Civil War. “There sits Jackson like a stone wall”.

 

[elts1956]

672 post to search through to try to find out where you were you explained how nuns teaching truth was indefensible? I’m sure others would tollerate if you gave us the condensed version again. The worse thing I ever heard about nuns were a few stories about innatentive kids getting their knuckles whacked with a ruler.

Or gently whopped in the back of the head for talking during Mass. Oh, that’s right, that was Meryl Streep. Sorry I couldn’t resist. Did see a sister chase a boy out of the class room with a ruler once. Yeah, it did happen. Right in front of my eyes.

 

[limerick]

If you are not willing to explain or provide details you should not be accusing Nuns of behavior that was “indefensible”.

This website is quite accommodating. One can look up another poster and see AAAALLLL the posts that poster posted. Why, even a mere high school graduate such as myself can navigate to the collection of another’s posts and search through them for information or an opinion that might be applicable to a topic in which I’m interested.

Now, this can happen only if and when someone truly has a desire to know the thoughts and feelings and opinions and experiences of another poster :thankyou: - another poster who has addressed said topic in sufficient detail in the recent past. :yup: I suppose that’s one reason why these posts are catalogued and saved - for the Curious One’s convenience.

Happy hunting.

Limerick

 

[elts1956]

672 post to search through to try to find out where you were you explained how nuns teaching truth was indefensible? I’m sure others would tollerate if you gave us the condensed version again. The worse thing I ever heard about nuns were a few stories about innatentive kids getting their knuckles whacked with a ruler.

**
a) How is a brutal murder a gift? I’m not looking for “Christ died for our sins”. I’m looking for a believable explanation as to why His death changed anything that already had been in place before then. If He died for our sins, what’s the deal with Purgatory? Did He really only die for sins committed up until that time? Yes, yes, another thread indeed.

b) If God is “going to choose some over others”, wouldn’t this suggest favoritism? How can God be biased? ** Don’t good deeds and bad deeds, good lives and bad lives, stand on their own merits or weaknesses? Seems I heard this ques. on another thread. Was that you Lim.? If so, the question was answered. If not, let me know and I will be happy to explain MY belief of this.
c) You’re not expected to defend anything. The people to whom I was referring in my earlier posts, the ones setting me up for Epic Fail, were Roman Catholic nuns “teaching me about the Fullness of Truth” in CCD classes in the 1960s. Please, don’t try. Their behavior was indefensible. The question was rhetorical.

d) Putting words in your mouth? No, I was actually exploring your thought beyond the acceptable parameters.

Limerick

 

[elts1956]

This website is quite accommodating. One can look up another poster and see AAAALLLL the posts that poster posted. Why, even a mere high school graduate such as myself can navigate to the collection of another’s posts and search through them for information or an opinion that might be applicable to a topic in which I’m interested.

Now, this can happen only if and when someone truly has a desire to know the thoughts and feelings and opinions and experiences of another poster :thankyou: - another poster who has addressed said topic in sufficient detail in the recent past. :yup: I suppose that’s one reason why these posts are catalogued and saved - for the Curious One’s convenience.

Happy hunting.

Limerick

Originally Posted by royal archer
If you are not willing to explain or provide details you should not be accusing Nuns of behavior that was “indefensible”.

Lim. I think you are having too much fun on this thread playing the word game. This has got to stop. Besides you still haven’t given a personal experience or a source for being able to call the sister’s teaching indefensible. That is an opinion, not a fact and as with all opinions one can take it, or leave it.