Anyone else believe in universal coverage for kids?

[Fitswimmer]

How can we be pro-life and not for healthy children?? I understand the need for people to punish those who don’t work as hard as they “should”-but why punish the children??

 

[sanctamaria17]

How can we be pro-life and not for healthy children?? I understand the need for people to punish those who don’t work as hard as they “should”-but why punish the children??

That’s my big question.

 

[JenDid]

Just want to clear this up:

No one in the United States is ever refused necessary medical treatment. No matter how dirt poor you are, if you walk into an emergency room with a broken arm, they have to treat you. If you go to a state or county teaching hospital and have little or no income, you will likely be treated for free (which means that others will be absorbing the cost), or else have your bill adjusted. The hitch is that if your case is a non-emergency, you might have to wait a while, or be seen by a student doctor with an overseeing teaching physician.

Socializing healthcare – even for children – would result in one great mother of an HMO. No, thank you. :nope:

So, it’s okay for poor people to wait for care, just not you.

Yes you can get a broken arm fixed in the ER. What is the poor person with a life threatening illness such as cancer supposed to do?

 

[mary_bobo]

So, should we just say kids can’t be educated because the system is flawed? Or do we fix the system?

Taxes. They pay for education, libraries, and police/fire protection, why not health too? Hey, it’s one less expense if you’re not paying for health insurance, why not just have the same amount come out of taxes? Or have a better tax system where the poor get tax cuts, not the rich.

With all due respect, the poor do not pay taxes so how can they get tax cuts?

Just because something wasn’t done on a grand scale before doesn’t mean it can’t be done. It apparently works in France, England, Canada, Italy, etc.

I have not been to France, England, or Italy. I did have a life-threatening illness while living in Canada and almost died. What happened to me would not have happened in the US, so I don’t think it works well in Canada either.

And I am talking about children here Not everyone. Kids. Who don’t have a say. If we needed to start it on the grand scale, why don’t we see if this could work? Then we see if it can work for everyone else? The government does not spend a lot of money on poor children at all,

No money on kids? What about Head Start? What about food programs in the schools?

more money gets spent on poor adults. Why can’t we at least take one concern away from poor families, the health of their children?

 

[sanctamaria17]

If they are working, they absolutely pay taxes. Working poor do exist.

Food programs, Head Start, are all good things, but what about inner city schools? Health care (which is still a problem for a lot of poor people)? And of course, what if you’re stuck in the middle and fall through the cracks (because you’re poor but not poor enough to need public assistance)? And it’s true, they spend money on poor kids, but not as much as poor adults.

No child should fall through the cracks, period. Not on health care or education. Two things that need to be fixed in this country.

 

[JenDid]

mary_bobo:

1. You obviously are not aware that there is a large population of people in this country who WORK and are still poor. If you get a paycheck, you pay taxes.
2. The comment was that the government doesn’t spend a lot on kids. Which is true. The programs you mentioned are a drop in the bucket, compared to other government programs.
3. Neither Head Start of a free lunch is going to provide preventative healthcare for children, which is what the OP was about.

 

[pathia]

With all due respect, the poor do not pay taxes so how can they get tax cuts?

I beg to differ, I pay taxes, I only make about 30k a year, not exactly poverty level, but when you consider I was paying 1250 a month in medical bills until I filed for bankruptcy my take home gets cut in half, and taking the maximum deduction for those bills out of taxes, I still owed taxes, and came out negative for the year, every year even while not buying anything for myself except food and rent. I’m only 28 and I’ve filed two bankruptcies for medical bills.

We also pay taxes on everything we buy, and usually you always at least pay some state income tax. I can’t imagine making what I do and having kids. What if one of them had the same medical problems I do?

 

[Fitswimmer]

That’s my big question.

Just to be clear here-I don’t feel the need to punish anyone for not working hard enough by denying them access to basic healthcare. I believe that regular health care for all will actually lower overall costs because people will treat problems before they become critical cases. I’d rather pay for regular diabetes care for 20 years than pay for amputations and long term care for someone who has a stroke.

My other issue with our current employer provided healthcare system is what a huge pain in the butt it is when you change jobs.

 

[sanctamaria17]

My dad was poor for quite some time and he absolutely paid taxes! He worked! He’s a conservative Republican and still supports things like this because he was there once and doesn’t wish it on anyone!

I pay taxes out of my pay check. I may not work full time (I’m a full time student, part time sales associate) but I do pay them.

I did say the govn’t didn’t spend anything on kids (when I really meant they didn’t spend much) so I should have seen that coming.

But seriously, preventative medicine is a lot cheaper than waiting for something to get worse and have them go to the emergency room. It would save tax payers a lot of money.

 

[pathia]

Just to be clear here-I don’t feel the need to punish anyone for not working hard enough by denying them access to basic healthcare. I believe that regular health care for all will actually lower overall costs because people will treat problems before they become critical cases. I’d rather pay for regular diabetes care for 20 years than pay for amputations and long term care for someone who has a stroke.

My other issue with our current employer provided healthcare system is what a huge pain in the butt it is when you change jobs.

I’m a wreck because of poor health care throughout my life. My family couldn’t afford it, and they denied the claims anyway. If we keep the kids healthy from the start, they’re much less likely to become a medical debt bomb like I have. Staying healthy is much easier than treating a near-death individual back to ‘average’ and then just letting them go again until they’re near-death over and over again.

 

[sanctamaria17]

 

[manualman]

Education in this country is an utter disaster precisely because it has been treated as a right when it really should be a priviledge. It has been made “free” and as a result it is not valued, by those whom you might have expected to benefit the most from a “free” education. If I were made education emperor, tuition based on ability to pay (but consisting of SOMETHING for everyone) would be re-instituted for all public schools. Chronic behavioral problem kids would be directed away from traditional school and put into hard labor WORK training programs that would either teach them to value their educational opportunity or give them an employable (if not much desireable) skill upon completion.

“Free” health care will turn out the same way as “free” education. Betcha we’d eventually end up with crummy public doctors, crummy public hospitals and a system of excellent private doctors and hospitals that actually cost LESS than the public ones, but will be only available to the more wealthy folks who are able to pay BOTH the tax burden of the crummy public system AND the modest fees of the private one. (Works for schools!)

This thread betrays a notion in the heads of most that all humans are entitled to a comfortable life, free of suffering - and that the government somehow has the power to make that happen.

 

[surfinpure]

So, it’s okay for poor people to wait for care, just not you.

Yes you can get a broken arm fixed in the ER. What is the poor person with a life threatening illness such as cancer supposed to do?

Apply for Medicaid, obviously. You don’t even have to be that poor to receive benefits. My daughter with a disability was covered for ROUTINE MEDICAL CARE, medication, and treatment, when we made less than 45,000 a year. So I’m quite puzzled as to why some here think that poor people cannot get regular checkups like the rest of us.

And PLENTY of us have to wait. Most especially those of us who pay taxes, pay for insurance, and get treated at teaching hospitals. I’ve done my time in waiting rooms. What about you?

 

[surfinpure]

I might add that in truth, the health care crisis in the country is most greatly affecting the MIDDLE CLASS. Those of us who are above the poverty line, but somehow not able to obtain decent insurance.

But is this really news to anyone? And do we really believe a giant, government run, tax-funded HMO is the solution???

 

[Fitswimmer]

Education in this country is an utter disaster precisely because it has been treated as a right when it really should be a priviledge. It has been made “free” and as a result it is not valued, by those whom you might have expected to benefit the most from a “free” education. If I were made education emperor, tuition based on ability to pay (but consisting of SOMETHING for everyone) would be re-instituted for all public schools. Chronic behavioral problem kids would be directed away from traditional school and put into hard labor WORK training programs that would either teach them to value their educational opportunity or give them an employable (if not much desireable) skill upon completion.

“Free” health care will turn out the same way as “free” education. Betcha we’d eventually end up with crummy public doctors, crummy public hospitals and a system of excellent private doctors and hospitals that actually cost LESS than the public ones, but will be only available to the more wealthy folks who are able to pay BOTH the tax burden of the crummy public system AND the modest fees of the private one. (Works for schools!)

This thread betrays a notion in the heads of most that all humans are entitled to a comfortable life, free of suffering - and that the government somehow has the power to make that happen.

A healthy, literate population contributes to society.

Nobody has said that “all humans are entitled to a comfortable life, free of suffering”. We are all human, therefore we will all suffer from time to time. Providing basic, preventative healthcare is a long way away from freeing people from suffering. Neither the government or anyone else on earth can do that.

I worked for the DOD for 10 years, and my Dad worked for them for over 40 years-so for half my life I was part of a government controlled healthcare system for Federal Employees. It was efficiently run, we had our choice of MD’s and plans so that we could choose for ourselves what was best. It can be done well by government and it has been for YEARS.

 

[gmarie21]

I now make a little over 20K per year, but purchased my own health insurance (since I didn’t have employer provided health insurance) straight from Unicare since a few months after my dd was born. I sacrificed in many other areas because I believe health insurance is worth it if it means I buy generic, live without a land line (cell phone is cheaper), don’t buy designer brands, wear my shoes until they are worn out, call the dr. or hospital immediately to set up payment plans, etc. Initially I paid about $230 per month for my dd and myself for health, dental, and life with a $1000 deductable. The price has slightly risen, but is still cheaper than my friends who have to pay for their group plan policies. And I have less headaches when getting treatment than my medicaid friends who struggle to even find doctors to treat them (not to mention the headaches associated with dealing with both the dr.s office and the medicaid office in getting the bills paid). I do qualify for public assistance, but, since I know how to budget I am able to pass up my tax funded possibilities so that another can use it.

As for check-ups and such…vaccines are given for free at county health departments, Walmart and many pharmacies and grocery stores both in rural areas as well as metropolitan areas have doctors on-site many days per week to do physicals and such for $25 - $50. Truly, through no fault of their own, many are just ill educated about what truly is available out there when it comes to affordable preventative health care.

Also, if you truly want healthy kids, then grocers as well as restaurants/fast food joints need to make the processed yet yummy food way more expensive than fresh and healthy food. Maybe the food programs/stamps should have a limit on what types of food can and cannot be purchased (ex. no cookies, desserts, chips, pop, etc. but you can purchase canned fruits and vegetables, frozen fruits, vegetables, meats, fresh anything, multigrain bread but not white bread). That will also help the health of the children and adults.

 

[manualman]

I certainly agree that a healthy, literate population is a necessity for modern society to function. I just happen to believe that to GET a healthy and literate poulation, you need to create an environment where people understand and VALUE the priviledge of education and health care.

Your DoD experience cannot be extrapolated to society as a whole. Military personnel and their families are not a representative sample of society as a whole. Most military folks know a priviledge when they see one! And their career choice suggests an willingness to accept hardship to achieve life goals. In other words, the military quickly weeds out the kind of folks that would destroy a national “free” health care program.

 

[pathia]

Apply for Medicaid, obviously. You don’t even have to be that poor to receive benefits. My daughter with a disability was covered for ROUTINE MEDICAL CARE, medication, and treatment, when we made less than 45,000 a year. So I’m quite puzzled as to why some here think that poor people cannot get regular checkups like the rest of us.

And PLENTY of us have to wait. Most especially those of us who pay taxes, pay for insurance, and get treated at teaching hospitals. I’ve done my time in waiting rooms. What about you?

I don’t qualify for medicaid, I don’t have children, nor do I meet any of the other qualifiers. Some people don’t get it, period, that’s how it works. I haven’t been able to have insurance my entire life, no one will cover me.

If no one will cover me, if I ever adopt, no one will ever cover my kids either.

 

[sanctamaria17]

Except I don’t just THINK, I SEE it. And I’ve come very close to LIVING it (being one of those children).

 

[gmarie21]

I don’t qualify for medicaid, I don’t have children, nor do I meet any of the other qualifiers. Some people don’t get it, period, that’s how it works. I haven’t been able to have insurance my entire life, no one will cover me.

If no one will cover me, if I ever adopt, no one will ever cover my kids either.

Why would adopted children not be covered? The rules aren’t, if the parent can’t be covered, then the child can’t be when there is no illness known to deny coverage. If I was denied insurance, I could still apply for my daughter to be covered. Insurance companies don’t say “no children unless a parent comes as part of the package”.