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Luigi_Daniele
Guest
I like RealCatholic (at least the videos I’ve seen) a great deal, but I stand by the decision of the Church.
(Archdiocese of Detroit:) Statement regarding Real Catholic TV and its name
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exoflare
Guest
Apparently my profile information here violates Canon Law? 
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Sirach2
Guest
Until you have listened to all those “words” you cannot say this with certainty. Others have heard a good deal of contradiction.
Well, when Voris attains the spiritual stature of John the Baptist or Christ who made the statements you quote here, maybe the Diocese will have reason to be concerned. As for now, his accusations are scandalizing a lot of viewers who disagree with his methods.
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jam070406
Guest
You’re not allowed to call it that.
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jam070406
Guest
You are correct. 48 Parishes are closing in the Detroit archdiocese. Hopefully silencing Voris will help some to remain open!
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Sirach2
Guest
SHE’s allowed, Jam, for it is not against Canon Law for her - only for RCTV until they change their name. 
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Sirach2
Guest
Yes, I realize you are crushed in spirit about Grotto closing, and I am sorry about the others, as well. We just closed 14 here a couple years ago and merged several others, although we have a much smaller diocese - unlike the huge ARCHdiocese of Detroit.
I sense a bit of irony in your post, and am not sure how to respond. Surely, you’re not casting aspersions on the AoD ? There are so many factors that cause these decisions to be made, and I have no doubt that the Abp. grieves about making them. I sat in on the diocesan-wide sessions seeking the advice from parishioners to help the Bishop in making that difficult decision. In many cases, there was no other solution, sad to say.
So, in all charity, I ask that you bear with the process, pray for the clergy involved, and judge not until you have all the facts. Your diocese is not the only one to face this difficulty.
I sense a bit of irony in your post, and am not sure how to respond. Surely, you’re not casting aspersions on the AoD ? There are so many factors that cause these decisions to be made, and I have no doubt that the Abp. grieves about making them. I sat in on the diocesan-wide sessions seeking the advice from parishioners to help the Bishop in making that difficult decision. In many cases, there was no other solution, sad to say.
So, in all charity, I ask that you bear with the process, pray for the clergy involved, and judge not until you have all the facts. Your diocese is not the only one to face this difficulty.
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jam070406
Guest
Thanks. I admit to have been being a smart alec. As you know, I like alot of the work St. Michael’s media. You would think there would be more pressing matters to take care of in the AOD at this time but, whatever. I will refrain from saying more as to not sound uncharitable. Merry Christmas Michael Voris.
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ahs
Guest
I hope RealCatholicTV does obey. But I am rather confused by the Archdiocese of Detroit’s decision. I’ve been watching “The Vortex” for a couple years now and have not seen anything contrary to Church Teaching. Rough around the edges? Perhaps. But I don’t find it uncharitable. Charity without Truth is nothing more than blind sentimentalism…and I think Micheal Voris is a good example of Charity in Truth…maybe I’m just more thick-skinned that some.
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Dirt
Guest
I will admit that some of the topics Mr. Voris tackles may be tough on those who have suffered from the same poor catechesis that Bishop Samples has spoken of. But sometimes the Truth needs to be delivered not in meekness, but with a Spiritual Zealousness that i wish more of Our Bishops would display. These are dangerous times, and the Re-Evangilization as spoken of by The Holy Father needs this type of Zealousness to penetrate the fog of secularism
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Sirach2
Guest
Dirt,
It is not feasible to post all the information you asked for. Some of it was linked here but the threads were deleted by the moderators. Although I have a lot of links in a file on my computer, it would be a task to review them all and cite those specific areas. It’s nearly Christmas, and I haven’t got the energy to put into this, for I’m not here to prove a point. If you want to determine the truth of my words, you need only scroll through some of the closed threads to pick up the opposing views of members. Do a search on “RealCatholicTV” or “Voris” and take it in at your leisure.
As for using spiritual zealousness, I can accept strong speakers, but not a lack of charity in dispensing the subject matter - THAT’S what bothers most of the members. I’m straining to be kind. Red-neck ruffians are most likely to appreciate his crass verbiage.
It is not feasible to post all the information you asked for. Some of it was linked here but the threads were deleted by the moderators. Although I have a lot of links in a file on my computer, it would be a task to review them all and cite those specific areas. It’s nearly Christmas, and I haven’t got the energy to put into this, for I’m not here to prove a point. If you want to determine the truth of my words, you need only scroll through some of the closed threads to pick up the opposing views of members. Do a search on “RealCatholicTV” or “Voris” and take it in at your leisure.
As for using spiritual zealousness, I can accept strong speakers, but not a lack of charity in dispensing the subject matter - THAT’S what bothers most of the members. I’m straining to be kind. Red-neck ruffians are most likely to appreciate his crass verbiage.
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Dirt
Guest
I will search those threads after the weekend. Curious as to the points of departure.
As to “Red-neck ruffians”, i am guilty. check out my info on my header. Seriously i do not wish to argue, but in the history of God and his people, i hear Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, St Ignatius, St. Dominic, St. Thomas and many other devout, godly men who warned of impending chastisement not meekly, but with a devout, fearsome zealousness for Our God and his Word. Popes of the past never hesitating to Anathematize anyone or any thing that might lead the faithful astray. while i do not place Mr. Voris in the same category as these, or St. John the Baptizer, i do appreciate his desire to re-awaken the Faithful to their Faith and to their duty as Catholics. I am sure we both want the same thing, just our delivery methods differ. May God richly Bless you this Christmas season.
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jam070406
Guest
Is there an official document from an authority in the AOD that forbids RCTV to use the name Catholic? Other than “the AOD” says? It’s kinda like when a publication from “the Vatican” comes out and it’s used as authoritative, when in fact it is not. Like, Vatican calls for world bank.
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LiveCatholic
Guest
Did somebody call?
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jam070406
Guest
He usually targets those that are destroying the Faith. Like the pro abort, pro homosexual marriage, pro contraception, pro women Priest crowd. Can you provide an example of how he could be more charitable to those destroying the Faith?
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LiveCatholic
Guest
Some commentators have argued that he could be more charitable to those who are maintaining the faith–for instance “moderate conservatives” (ex: bishops, Catholic publications, &c.). I would argue that this is worse and more damaging than treating dissidents uncharitably.
Example, this ginger has something to say about it: ncregister.com/blog/in-criticism-of-michael-voris/
His approach to dealing with those destroying the faith is excoriating, but I find that a little refreshing. The counterargument is that this isn’t exactly what St. Francis de Sales meant by ‘cooking the Truth sweet with charity’–that is, he won’t win any ‘converts’ from these wayward Catholics and will be regarded as yet another polemicist. My 0.02$
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jam070406
Guest
I never seen him give anything but praise to those that maintain the Faith.Some commentators have argued that he could be more charitable to those who are maintaining the faith–for instance “moderate conservatives” (ex: bishops, Catholic publications, &c.). I would argue that this is worse and more damaging than treating dissidents uncharitably.
Example, this ginger has something to say about it: ncregister.com/blog/in-criticism-of-michael-voris/
His approach to dealing with those destroying the faith is excoriating, but I find that a little refreshing. The counterargument is that this isn’t exactly what St. Francis de Sales meant by ‘cooking the Truth sweet with charity’–that is, he won’t win any ‘converts’ from these wayward Catholics and will be regarded as yet another polemicist. My 0.02$
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jam070406
Guest
Well, well…isn’t this interesting?
From another article:
There is however an interesting twist to this story. Michael Voris, while he may be the star of RealCatholicTV’s programming, is not the owner of the website. The owner is Marc Brammer who lives in South Bend Indiana in the diocese of Bishop Kevin Rhoades.
Brammer told LifeSiteNews, “I own RealCatholicTV.com. I contracted with Michael Voris to produce video content for that website and I pay him for it. It is a business relationship between me and Michael. If all of a sudden now there’s this tussle over the use of the word ‘Catholic’ I’ll deal with it through competent ecclesial authority.”
Brammer noted that he had received a letter from the Archdiocese of Detroit acknowledging him as the owner of the website. He responded to that letter with a request for a meeting with the Archdiocese. He received no response. Brammer has not been asked by his bishop, Fort Wayne-South Bend Bishop Kevin Rhoades to cease using the word Catholic.
A LifeSiteNews request for an interview with the Archdiocese of Detroit was not returned, and the voice message noted that the office was on holiday till after Christmas.
The press release from the Archdiocese of Detroit notes, “The Church encourages the Christian faithful to promote or sustain a variety of apostolic undertakings but, nevertheless, prohibits any such undertaking from claiming the name Catholic without the consent of the competent ecclesiastical authority.”
The release adds, “For some time, the Archdiocese of Detroit has been in communication with Mr. Michael Voris and his media partner at Real Catholic TV regarding their prominent use of the word ‘Catholic’ in identifying and promoting their public activities disseminated from the enterprise’s production facility in Ferndale, Michigan.”
Voris says that communication was only one way – directives from the Archdiocese and refusal to meet with Voris or Brammer to discuss the matter. Voris told LifeSiteNews that he has requested a meeting with Archdiocesan officials seven times to discuss the matter, but each time he has been ignored or rebuffed.
According to its minutes, Elephants in the living room (the group of priests which publicly holds positions counter to Catholic teachings on women priests and contraception), met with Detroit Archbishop Allen Vigneron on February 1, 2011.
Voris notes that his conflict with the Archdiocese of Detroit has more to do with its staffers than with the Archbishop. Previous to his work for RealCatholicTV, Voris launched St. Michael’s Media and had various offers to air programs he produced, talks he was to give and television shows he was to be featured on canceled through the efforts of staff at the Archdiocese. “They have waged a quiet war since the very first time we set foot into the public realm,” he said.
In response to the press release demand from the Archdiocese of Detroit, Voris told LifeSiteNews, “I don’t have ownership over the name of the organization. It’s not my organization. The headquarters are outside of the diocese.” He concluded, “It’s the wrong person, and the wrong outfit asking the wrong person the wrong question.”
Brammer is to give a formal response to the Archdiocese after Christmas which will be aired on RealCatholicTV.
lifesitenews.com/news/archdiocese-of-detroit-asks-michael-voris-to-stop-using-the-name-catholic
(emphasis mine)
Hmmm… interesting, indeed.
From another article:
There is however an interesting twist to this story. Michael Voris, while he may be the star of RealCatholicTV’s programming, is not the owner of the website. The owner is Marc Brammer who lives in South Bend Indiana in the diocese of Bishop Kevin Rhoades.
Brammer told LifeSiteNews, “I own RealCatholicTV.com. I contracted with Michael Voris to produce video content for that website and I pay him for it. It is a business relationship between me and Michael. If all of a sudden now there’s this tussle over the use of the word ‘Catholic’ I’ll deal with it through competent ecclesial authority.”
Brammer noted that he had received a letter from the Archdiocese of Detroit acknowledging him as the owner of the website. He responded to that letter with a request for a meeting with the Archdiocese. He received no response. Brammer has not been asked by his bishop, Fort Wayne-South Bend Bishop Kevin Rhoades to cease using the word Catholic.
A LifeSiteNews request for an interview with the Archdiocese of Detroit was not returned, and the voice message noted that the office was on holiday till after Christmas.
The press release from the Archdiocese of Detroit notes, “The Church encourages the Christian faithful to promote or sustain a variety of apostolic undertakings but, nevertheless, prohibits any such undertaking from claiming the name Catholic without the consent of the competent ecclesiastical authority.”
The release adds, “For some time, the Archdiocese of Detroit has been in communication with Mr. Michael Voris and his media partner at Real Catholic TV regarding their prominent use of the word ‘Catholic’ in identifying and promoting their public activities disseminated from the enterprise’s production facility in Ferndale, Michigan.”
Voris says that communication was only one way – directives from the Archdiocese and refusal to meet with Voris or Brammer to discuss the matter. Voris told LifeSiteNews that he has requested a meeting with Archdiocesan officials seven times to discuss the matter, but each time he has been ignored or rebuffed.
According to its minutes, Elephants in the living room (the group of priests which publicly holds positions counter to Catholic teachings on women priests and contraception), met with Detroit Archbishop Allen Vigneron on February 1, 2011.
Voris notes that his conflict with the Archdiocese of Detroit has more to do with its staffers than with the Archbishop. Previous to his work for RealCatholicTV, Voris launched St. Michael’s Media and had various offers to air programs he produced, talks he was to give and television shows he was to be featured on canceled through the efforts of staff at the Archdiocese. “They have waged a quiet war since the very first time we set foot into the public realm,” he said.
In response to the press release demand from the Archdiocese of Detroit, Voris told LifeSiteNews, “I don’t have ownership over the name of the organization. It’s not my organization. The headquarters are outside of the diocese.” He concluded, “It’s the wrong person, and the wrong outfit asking the wrong person the wrong question.”
Brammer is to give a formal response to the Archdiocese after Christmas which will be aired on RealCatholicTV.
lifesitenews.com/news/archdiocese-of-detroit-asks-michael-voris-to-stop-using-the-name-catholic
(emphasis mine)
Hmmm… interesting, indeed.
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jam070406
Guest
Although, it has come to light that Michael Voris does not own the name, and the owner is not in the AOD. And…the staff at the AOD knew this and even wrote a letter acknowledging this.SHE’s allowed, Jam, for it is not against Canon Law for her - only for RCTV until they change their name.
Sorry Sirach, this seems to be turning out to be a witch hunt against Mr. Voris by liberal AOD staffers that have had it in for him from the beginning, even before RCTV was launched.
lifesitenews.com/news/archdiocese-of-detroit-asks-michael-voris-to-stop-using-the-name-catholic
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Sirach2
Guest
Just happened to stumble across this publication, huh Jam? There are always two sides to the story.
Would you happen to have the publication from Lifesitenews that gives the reasons for denying approval for his apostolate? That seems harder to find than hen’s teeth.
Yes, at the launching of St. Michael’s Media when he deliberated with the AoD for approval of his apostolate, he was given specifics as to how to come into compliance for the said approval. He has failed to meet them since 2006. So yes, I can appreciate that the Archdiocese is disturbed enough to cancel subsequent media efforts.
Would you happen to have the publication from Lifesitenews that gives the reasons for denying approval for his apostolate? That seems harder to find than hen’s teeth.
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