Are husbands the leaders of the family or when did it change?

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St Joseph received his commands from God, and made sure that the Holy Family complied. Perfect leadership.
 
WingedHussar said:
St Joseph received his commands from God, and made sure that the Holy Family complied. Perfect leadership.
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He was told they were in danger. He wasn’t. He could easily have done his job by sending them with someone else.
 
His family, his authority, his responsibility. Wearing the crown means being responsible for the people under you. Responsibility and authority, perfectly balanced as all things should be.
 
WingedHussar said:
She brought the problem to his attention. Subordinates are supposed to do that.

The age for Bar Mitzvah seems to be 13, not 12 according to Wikipedia. This seems like a question @meltzerboy2 might be able to assist with.
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Quibbling. Still far from a mere dependent child even if true. Being God and all.
 
WingedHussar said:
His family, his authority, his responsibility. Wearing the crown means being responsible for the people under you. Responsibility and authority, perfectly balanced as all things should be.
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And yet Mary went off.by herself to Elizabeth, even though they were already betrothed and so he was in theory already in authority. No hint of her seeking his permission or showing deference to hus authority in any way.
 
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You were wrong about the details you based your argument on, pointing that out was not quibbling.
 
LilyM said:
And yet Mary went off.by herself to Elizabeth, even though they were already betrothed and so he was in theory already in authority. No hint of her seeking his permission or showing deference to hus authority in any way.
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There are no records of St. Joseph, Mary, and Jesus taking care of their daily hygiene, are we to assume that never happened either?
 
WingedHussar said:
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LilyM:
And yet Mary went off.by herself to Elizabeth, even though they were already betrothed and so he was in theory already in authority. No hint of her seeking his permission or showing deference to hus authority in any way.
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There are no records of St. Joseph, Mary, and Jesus taking care of their daily hygiene, are we to assume that never happened either?
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That is because every human takes care of their daily hygiene. Not every woman is a submissive wife in the.mould slim is pomoting upthread.

Rather an important omission if all wives are supposed to be docilely submissive.
 
WingedHussar said:
You were wrong about the details you based your argument on, pointing that out was not quibbling.
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It is one years difference. And today at least it is 13, I agree I may have been wrong.

But it is.still like calling a 17 year old a child today. They are far from it.
 
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The point is that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. We can safely assume that Mary followed the norms.
 
WingedHussar said:
The point is that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. We can safely assume that Mary followed the norms.
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The norm, then as now, is that wives ran a large spectrum in terms of their levels of independent agency and the levels of control exerted over them by their husbands.

So it is not unreasonable to wonder 'WHICH norms"? And look at what is recorded, not what we take to be the norm, as guidance as to what is required today.
 
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Bar Mitzvah, for boys, at age 13; Bat Mitzvah, for girls, at age 12. This is an oral tradition based on girls’ achieving maturity earlier than boys, and it has Torah and Talmud backing. In Genesis, according to the Hebrew language (the word “built”), when Gd created woman from man, He created her “with greater understanding” so that woman would mature, not only physically but mentally and emotionally, sooner than man.
 
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WingedHussar said:
So how about St Paul and St Peter then?
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How about them? They didn’t write in English and didn’t write in light of today’s society. That limits what we can say about them.

Far more learned and authoritative persons than you or I have written on the topic of the dignity of women - St John Paul II for starters.

They have made clear that excessive docility or subservience is not ideal or required in wives.
 
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Huh, I subscribe to the Aristotelian view myself, and so did the Church Fathers.
 
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Freddy said:
Who should make the decision on how many children we have?
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Preferably both of you, since you both engage in the act which creates them, and presuming the marriage lasts, both of you will be responsible for them until adulthood (and given what some consider a “new normal”, possibly beyond that). 😁
 
otjm said:
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Freddy:
Who should make the decision on how many children we have?
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Preferably both of you, since you both engage in the act which creates them, and presuming the marriage lasts, both of you will be responsible for them until adulthood (and given what some consider a “new normal”, possibly beyond that). 😁
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Well, yes. It needs (name removed by moderator)ut from both of us. But this thread is an excercise in nonsensical propositions being made on the basis of a ridiculous op so I’ll pass on any further comments unless specifically asked a question.
 
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