Are Protestants going to Heaven?

[Resurrexit]

The answer is that it is possible, but not particularly likely.

That’s truth. Feenyism (all non-Catholics are damned), and liberalism/semi-universalism, are both errors.

 

[Beyrak]

John 20:22 “When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost.” 23 "Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained."

I would never say, as it is not for me to say, that it’s impossible for protestants to go to heaven, as I don’t believe that. BUT, I do know as a person raised baptist and a southern baptist preacher’s son, there was no way I was going to heaven as a baptist!

I am a wicked, unworthy excuse for a man that commits a mortal sin at least monthly, usually more often. It is so clear to me now that Christ depends on the Apostolic succession to be stewards of his Church. And there is no way my father could and any other protestant can talk and explain away the above scriptures where Christ appointed the apostles as his Church and Christ gave the keys to the Church to Saint Peter in **Matthew 16:18 “And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

19 “And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.”**

And as a wicked and unworthy man who is and never will be worthy of Christ’s salvation, I need the Absolution of sins from Christ in the confession booth. And I am not willing to gamble that me asking Christ ‘myself’ is enough as He made it quite clear above in John 20 that it was not!

Once I found the above scriptures, that baptists will NEVER quote or they did not at my baptist church, and I also found and read Matthew 16, it was quite clear to me the ONLY way I was ever going to see heaven was as a Catholic.

Protestants can talk their ‘sola scriptura’ all they want, but they must cherry pick through them and avoid some or the above scriptures would, as they did me, toss your insides upside down.

I was watching a former protestant minister last night on EWTN that had recently converted to Catholicism, and he finally made me realize the problem with ‘some’ protestant ministers who study the scriptures in depth but do not convert (although many like him do), even ater realizing the truth. And that’s because most are married and they make their living with their ministry. If they converted, they would have to find a real job.

So in a sense when preachers and ministers defend protestantism, one must wonder if they really believe what they say, or are they only defending their way to make a living. At least it is that way for me. I knew from attending a Baptist University here in the Bible belt, that you often overheard students who were finishing their pastoral studies, speak about their opportunites of pastoring certain churches, and they bragged about starting salaries. I know my own dad, when he said God had called him to another Church, it always corresponded to being a larger church with a larger congregation and a larger paycheck.

Father Corapi speaks often that he thinks some protestants are very good Christians. But he also said he thinks that people who teach false doctrines will be greeted on judgement day worse than unrepented murderers and rapists. Wo to them that realize the truth but continue to preach false doctrine. They will have to answer to God for leading people astray and to hell.

 

[Revelation13_16]

I was just looking at the Catechism again, and this jumped out at me:

818 '‘However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers …** All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians,** and with good reason are** accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church**.’'272

819 '‘Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth’'273 are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: '‘the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.’'274 Christ’s Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him,275 and are in themselves calls to '‘Catholic unity.’'276

I’ve bolded the parts that I think are important, here is my understanding of this Catechism:

All Protestants are Christians, and part of the Catholic Church.

God keeps Protestants seperate from Catholicism because he uses them to save people.

Is this right?

Love,
Rev

 

[Beyrak]

God keeps Protestants seperate from Catholicism because he uses them to save people.

I fell asleep with my TV on EWTN, and early this morning as it is, the voice of the Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI, brought me wide awake. I don’t think that there is more of a reassuring voice then his.

Rev, it is true that authorized baptisms will cleanse ‘original sin’, but I think that protestants are obsessed with the word “saved”, as some protestants believe that ‘one saved, always saved’.

But if someone is baptized and commits a mortal sin a few days later, they have a problem. Just because someone is drowning and the coast guard pulls them out of the ocean and saves them, doesn’t mean that this person can jump right back in the water and assume the coast guard will assure their safety. The person should accept some personal responsibility, especially after receiving a second chance.

This personal responsibility one takes is equivalent to a sinner repenting, and attempting to live a righteous life. When they fail and sin, the Church is there for them and Christ is there in the confession booth to give absolution.

This absolution is available from the Catholic Church because of the gift of the Apostolic succession, something protestants do not have. Protestants also argue, why should they go through a man, and not directly to God for forgiveness. But then you are arguing with Christ, who set up his Church and appointed the Apostolic to do exactly this (and much more), to forgive or retain sins.

When one goes into a Catholic confession booth, one is not speaking to a man, but to Jesus himself through the tool of a priest.

John 20:23 "Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.

It’s hard to get around John 20:23. It is so clear…

 

[MariaG]

I was just looking at the Catechism again, and this jumped out at me:

I’ve bolded the parts that I think are important, here is my understanding of this Catechism:

• All Protestants are Christians, and part of the Catholic Church.

Yes.

God keeps Protestants seperate from Catholicism because he uses them to save people.

Is this right?

Love,
Rev

No. God does not keep us separate. We know Gods desire is for us to be one and so God would not deliberately keep us separate. This is not God’s will for Christians to lack unity. But God certainly has made something good out of something so bad.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[Revelation13_16]

No. God does not keep us separate. We know Gods desire is for us to be one and so God would not deliberately keep us separate. This is not God’s will for Christians to lack unity. But God certainly has made something good out of something so bad.

God Bless,
Maria

Hi Maria,

Could you explain CCC 819 to me please?

Thankyou.

God Bless,
Rev

 

[exiled]

Rev,
CCC 819 says, “*many elements *of sanctification and of truth are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church.” and then it goes on to that which you bolded. The church has said that there are “elements of truth”, which is different from the fullness of truth found only in the Catholic Church. That protestant churches bring people to Christ is a good thing, and God will use that good to ultimately bring men to that Catholic unity.
There are also elements of truth in Islam, I suppose, in that they worship the same God of the OT. But, they do not possess the Truth of the Holy Trinity, so they may be at the start of a path that eventually leads to Christianity and then the fullness of Christ’s Church.
CCC818 recognizes that some protestants have known nothing else as a result of being born hundreds of years after the protestant revolt, so as Trinitarians (as opposed to Mormon theology, for instance) they are Christians, which Mormons are not, although they’ll tell you different.

 

[MariaG]

**Sure **

**819 **“Furthermore, many elements of sanctification and of truth” are found outside the visible confines of the Catholic Church: “the written Word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope, and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, as well as visible elements.” Christ’s Spirit uses these Churches and ecclesial communities as means of salvation, whose power derives from the fullness of grace and truth that Christ has entrusted to the Catholic Church. All these blessings come from Christ and lead to him, and are in themselves calls to “Catholic unity.”

It is pretty self explanatory and is basically what I was saying. God has made good (see above) out of bad, the broken communion of churches.

It is contrary to scripture to believe that God “keeps Protestants separate from Catholics”. Sin keeps protestants separate from Catholics.

God certainly works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches, but it is false idea to think that GOD chooses to keep the Protestant and Catholic Churches separate.

Scripture is filled with “be ye one” and other such words telling us we need to be one christian community. So it would be impossible to think that God now desires more than one christian community for that would contradict scripture.

God Bless,
Maria

 

[StevenFrancis]

If a protestant took the time to come to this forum, they probably know that the Catholic Church can be traced back to the times of Christ, where Christ instituted the Church. They may be in denial and deny it, but that doesn’t change a thing.

Protestantism is only an imitation, and only a casual student of history should realize this. So if one is on this forum, I believe that they are no longer in ignorance and will be held accountable.

Why argue or gamble with your eternal soul? Protestants do not have the apostolic, so they do not have Christ in their confession booth to give them absolution. It’s not a priest in that booth, IT IS JESUS CHRIST! And for a human being to think that they don’t need anyone but themselves to go straight to God and confess are ignoring Christ’s own teachings. My reasoning are the following scriptures which drives protestants batty;

Matthew 16:18…And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 19…And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.

Jesus Christ himself started the Catholic Church. So who is the heretic? Jesus Christ, or Martin Luther and John Calvin the ones most responsible for the Catholic Church dividing, fracturing, and splintering until you now have over 33,000 protestant denominations? That in itself should be enough evidence to put doubt in any reasonable, critically thinking person. I don’t think Christ is the heretic.

I’m a protestant convert. I once thought the Catholic Church was so far off base. But it was because I had been lied to by protestants (including my parents) who did not understand or want to understand the true Church! That makes me angry! How dare they lie to me all my life! But in the next breath, I need to pray for them to see the light as I did.

Read about, study, and even watch videos about the Saints. You don’t see any protestant churches that can produce the miracles and blessings the Saints have brought us. There is a reason for this, and that’s because the Saints understood and had the full faith, not fragments and half truths of it.

This says it all. Thank you. Please copy and paste this response into about 20 different threads that I can think of just off hand!! I am a convert as well. I’ve been trying to formulate exactly what you’ve said here, and have done a fair job, but this is really just excellent.

Pax

Steven

 

[Beyrak]

This says it all. Thank you. Please copy and paste this response into about 20 different threads that I can think of just off hand!! I am a convert as well. I’ve been trying to formulate exactly what you’ve said here, and have done a fair job, but this is really just excellent.

Pax

Steven

Thanks Pax. I do want to stress that I am very thankful for my parents at least introducing me to “some” of the truths that the baptist Church I attended did teach, and for my baptism. But it only takes some research and simple investigation, and the willingness to open one’s heart to find the truth.

One should not accept something to be truth just because it was the way you were raised, the nearest church is convenient and the last few generations of your family believed in something. Following that reasoning, we will never be able to stamp out prejudice and racism as these things are passed on from generation to generation.

How many protestant ministers out there have read the “Early Church Fathers”, have realized the truth like so many other pastors and ministers that have converted, but because they do not want to lose their way to make a living, they continue to walk the wayward path? Too many I bet.

EWTN TV shows frequently the testimonies of quite a few protestant pastors and ministers that have converted, and some of them even explain that their biggest hurdle in converting was figuring out how they will get a job and support their families. The Catholic Church should go beyond the call of duty to find these ministers suitable employment to use the pastor’s talents and experiences and help unite our fractured Catholic Church. The more protestant pastors and ministers we can bring over, the closer the unification gets.

Feel free to copy/paste away and use any words of mine you see fit as your own. I feel honored they touched at least one individual. And if they did, they must be from a higher authority, and not from me.

 

[Revelation13_16]

It is contrary to scripture to believe that God “keeps Protestants separate from Catholics”.

HI Maria,

Could you show me where it’s contrary to scripture?

God certainly works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches

I’m interested to know how God works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches.

Could you tell me?

Scripture is filled with “be ye one” and other such words telling us we need to be one christian community. So it would be impossible to think that God now desires more than one christian community for that would contradict scripture.

I guess this depends on how you define “Christian community”.

Do you believe that the only Christian community is the Catholic Church?

God Bless,
Rev

 

[Sixtus]

As a Protestant I’m interested to know whether Catholics believe Protestants will be going to heaven or not.

As a practising life-long Catholic, I am in no doubt.

Among Catholics are some of the most judgmental critical nasty cruel people I have ever known. They say ‘we are the true church therefore we are going to heaven’. I think not!! I have always argued there will be a lot of Protestants, and other religions going to heaven before us.

I was given an ill-health retirement from work. This was not something I wanted. But it was forced upon me due to a disability. I started going to daily mass and spending a lot of my time doing work [as best as I could] at our local Catholic Church. It was then that I began to be attacked by ‘some but not all’ Catholics ‘why are you off work’? ‘Why are you not working instead of sponging off the State’? ‘You ought to get off your lazy a… and get another job’! Little did they know that I was spending a lot of time trying to find other work. I was amazed at how quickely they judged me without ever asking ‘why I was off’.

To answer your question, when you get to heaven please pray for me

 

[valient_Lucy]

Hi CA,

As a Protestant I’m interested to know whether Catholics believe Protestants will be going to heaven or not.

Before you answer, I have some sketchy details that around 50-60 years ago the Catholic church took a ‘kinder’ view to Protestants than before, is this true or have I heard incorrectly.

Thanks.

(Waiting to find out if Heaven or Hell awaits)
Rev13_16

A Protestant can go to Heaven. I’m not saying that every single Protestant will go to Heaven, but Catholics do not teach categorically that every non-Catholic will go to Hell.

 

[Beyrak]

Among Catholics are some of the most judgmental critical nasty cruel people I have ever known. They say ‘we are the true church therefore we are going to heaven’. I think not!!

The Church is perfect, the people in it or not.

You have personal issues that should not have been brought into this discussion.

To tell someone that “You think not” confuses things. You think the Catholic Church, created by Christ “Is not” the true Church, but protestant churches, one of any 33,000 created by man is? You think (or think not) people can get to heaven without the “Apostolic Succession” which enables us to receive Sacraments such as penitence, the Eucharist, etc?

I too hope my dead relatives, including my deceased father who was a So. Baptist minister, gets to heaven. But to facilitate and witness to others where they may stay in a false Church, which any Catholic who believes their own faith would know and realize this would be very, very difficult (but not impossible if you never commit grave sin {better man than I}), may endanger your own prospects.

There is a difference between ignorant protestants who do not know the truth because of false prophets like Martin Luther and John Calvin and people who know the truth. And people who read this forum are not ignorant but have read the truth.

 

[Beyrak]

Revelation,

Maybe you have done this already. But one of the biggest helps to me during my conversion was the ‘Catholic Answer’ audio archived shows you can find free at catholic.com/radio/calendar.php

You can go back several years as I did, and cherry pick your subjects of interest. They even have a search engine to browse topics, it is somewhat hidden on the right of the page.

But some of the best shows are just listed as “Q&A”. Jimmy Aiken, Tim Staples, Karl Keating, and Steve Ray are some of my favorite guests that answer questions. Some people really like listening to Rosalind Moss, but I don’t. She rambles on too much for my tastes. But you might want to give her a try also. She does have an interesting story.

If you have an individual question, as it seems, that is churning you inside out, I suggest phoning the Catholic Answer Apologist line at 1-619-387-7200, ask for Father Vincent Serpa (if he’s available) or any other apologist may be able to help answer your question. They are on west coast time, so keep that in mind. Father Serpa is also a frequent guest on Catholic Answers.

But as I said above, please also make use of all those archived shows that have a wealth of information. They are the reason of my conversion.

 

[MariaG]

Hi Rev,

It is contrary to scripture to believe that God “keeps Protestants separate from Catholics”. Sin keeps protestants separate from Catholics.

HI Maria,

Could you show me where it’s contrary to scripture?

That God KEEPS the Churches separate? Sure. It is contrary since God tells us to be one, therefore God would never CHOOSE to KEEP the Churches separate.

Jn 10:16 - there will be one fold and one shepherd.
Eph 4:3-6 - one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father
Rom 16:17 - I urge that there be no divisions among you
1Cor 1:10 - I urge that there be no divisions among you
Phil 2:2 - be of same mind, united in heart thinking one thing
Rom 15:5 - God grant you to think in harmony with one another
Jn 17:17-23 - I pray that they may be one, as we are one
Jn 17:23 - that they may be brought to perfection as one
1Cor 12:13 - in one spirit we are baptized into one body
Rom 12:5 - we, though many, are one body in Christ
Eph 4:4 - one body, one Spirit, called to be one hope
Col 3:15 - the peace into which you were called in one body
Mt 16:18-19 - upon this rock I will build my Church (singular)
Mt 18:17 - tell it to THE Church; if he refuses to listen even to THE Church…

God certainly works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches, but it is false idea to think that GOD chooses to keep the Protestant and Catholic Churches separate.

I’m interested to know how God works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches.

Could you tell me?

You are Protestant and you don’t know? Yikes! Find a new Church! Better yet, enroll in RCIA.

Scripture is filled with “be ye one” and other such words telling us we need to be one christian community. So it would be impossible to think that God now desires more than one christian community for that would contradict scripture.

God Bless,
Maria

I guess this depends on how you define “Christian community”.

Do you believe that the only Christian community is the Catholic Church?

God Bless,
Rev

Depends on how I Define it? No, I am using the BIBLICAL definition as well as a historical one. We see in scripture and in history that unity was not defined as “agreeing on the essentials” but belonging to different denominations that teach different “truths” or interpretations of scripture.

And do I believe the only Christian community today is Catholic? Another odd question. I said that our christian community today is not as God intends. Your statement that GOD KEEPS the christian community broken as it is cannot be true, as scripture clearly shows.

It is the teaching of the Catholic Church (as well as my belief) that Protestants are our separated brethren. So, no, I do not believe that the only Christian community today consists of card carrying Catholics.

 

[Revelation13_16]

Hi Rev,

That God KEEPS the Churches separate? Sure. It is contrary since God tells us to be one, therefore God would never CHOOSE to KEEP the Churches separate.

I’m aware of the Scripture (remember I’m a Protestant) and the need for unity, I asked this because you said in explaining CCC 819:

“God certainly works through the protestant Churches and can save people through those churches,”

I didn’t understand this and it seemed to imply that God kept them seperate, since he doesn’t, I don’t understand how God uses Protestant Churches for salvation, because the atonement theories of Christ’s sacrifice is different from Catholicism.

You are Protestant and you don’t know? Yikes! Find a new Church! Better yet, enroll in RCIA.

Or you could have just told me.

Depends on how I Define it? No, I am using the BIBLICAL definition as well as a historical one. We see in scripture and in history that unity was not defined as “agreeing on the essentials” but belonging to different denominations that teach different “truths” or interpretations of scripture.

I don’t understand this.

By this definition, Gnostic Christians were just another denomonation in the Christian Community of that time.

Their “truths” are severely heretical. (Demiurge etc)

And do I believe the only Christian community today is Catholic? Another odd question. I said that our christian community today is not as God intends. Your statement that GOD KEEPS the christian community broken as it is cannot be true, as scripture clearly shows.

It is the teaching of the Catholic Church (as well as my belief) that Protestants are our separated brethren. So, no, I do not believe that the only Christian community today consists of card carrying Catholics.

The problem I have is this.

If I’m a great protestant and seek to imitate Christ, what advantage is there for me to become a Catholic if I can make it into heaven as a Protestant?

God Bless,
Rev

 

[Church_Militant]

The problem I have is this.

If I’m a great protestant and seek to imitate Christ, what advantage is there for me to become a Catholic if I can make it into heaven as a Protestant?

God Bless,
Rev

Hi Rev…

Good point. My answer:

If all you want is to make it into heaven…otherwise shouldn’t** every** believer seek the fullness of the truth which is Christ and desire to be as close to Him as possible? Isn’t that what we are all called to? If you have heard the fullness of truth why would anyone settle for less? Remember Matthew 13:44.
Pax tecum,

 

[Revelation13_16]

Hi Rev…

Good point. My answer:

If all you want is to make it into heaven…otherwise shouldn’t** every** believer seek the fullness of the truth which is Christ and desire to be as close to Him as possible? Isn’t that what we are all called to? If you have heard the fullness of truth why would anyone settle for less? Remember Matthew 13:44.
Pax tecum,

Hi CM,

Many Protestants question if Catholics are saved, so please see it from this P.O.V.

So If Catholicism is the truth and I’m a Protestant and I’m “good” I’ll go to heaven. And you as a Catholic will also go to heaven. (but probably have a higher status than me)

But if Catholicism is false and it’s adherants don’t go to heaven because they’ve added things that anger God, Good Protestants go to heaven, good catholics don’t.

So as you can see, from these two scenarios, the Protestant wins twice, the catholic only once, therefore it makes more sense to be a Protestant and maximize your chances of heaven.

Ofcourse, I have a hard time believing catholics will go to hell, I don’t think God would disregard people for certain ‘men’s traditions’ (if they are men’s traditions, they could be God’s if Catholicism is true!) because the Bible says trust in Jesus is the only requirement.

But I’m sure some anti-Catholic sites have some arguments against catholics going to heaven, I just haven’t read any.

But anyway, going by their “claims”, it seems safer to be a Protestant with sola scriptura/sola fide.

God Bless,
Rev

 

[Church_Militant]

Hi CM,

Many Protestants question if Catholics are saved, so please see it from this P.O.V.

This I know right well…yet does that make them correct any more than the inverse opinion from Catholics? Of course not…

So If Catholicism is the truth and I’m a Protestant and I’m “good” I’ll go to heaven. And you as a Catholic will also go to heaven. (but probably have a higher status than me)

But if Catholicism is false and it’s adherents don’t go to heaven because they’ve added things that anger God, Good Protestants go to heaven, good catholics don’t.

So as you can see, from these two scenarios, the Protestant wins twice, the catholic only once, therefore it makes more sense to be a Protestant and maximize your chances of heaven.Fallacious reasoning. Are all facts in in your investigation of the Catholic faith? If not then it is yet too soon to say. Have you prayed and put your willing heart on the altar before the Holy spirit and just like Our Lord prayed, “Not my will but thine be done”?

You cannot provide evidence that the Catholic Church has “added” anything that angers God? PM me with anything you thing does and I’ll deal with it as the Holy Spirit gives me grace and wisdom.

Of course, I have a hard time believing catholics will go to hell, I don’t think God would disregard people for certain ‘men’s traditions’ (if they are men’s traditions, they could be God’s if Catholicism is true!) because the Bible says trust in Jesus is the only requirement.

The problem there is that these are not just men’s traditions, like making baptism non-essential for salvation when the New Testament plainly says different, or teaching that faith without works will save one when the New Testament plainly says otherwise so that in the end what you have is another gospel being preached.

I tested all things and proved what is true and that my friend is why I am Catholic.

But I’m sure some anti-Catholic sites have some arguments against catholics going to heaven, I just haven’t read any.

You’ll understand I hope when I say that I really don’t care what anti-Catholics have to say aside from the risk of them misleading my less knowledgeable Catholic brothers and sisters. I have read their stuff and against accurate teaching from the Catholic Church it is raging trash. Ever heard the analogy of the guy who blows out the other guy’s candle in order to make his seem to shine the brighter?

But anyway, going by their “claims”, it seems safer to be a Protestant with sola scriptura/sola fide.

God Bless,
Rev

Only if one will settle for less than the fullness of Christ and obedience to the Church that He founded. The Church that has paid in her blood for the faithful teachings that every early church believer held as opposed to a pack of men with a new wind of doctrine some 500 years ago.

Safer? You mean more comfortable don’t you? Where is there anywhere in the Word of God where we are promised to be comfortable with the will of God for our lives. I sure can’t see it in the lives of the early church or even the lives of the faithful Catholics in more modern times. Matthew 13:44

Safer? I don’t think so.

Remember this from Luke 12. 47 And that servant who knew the will of his lord, and prepared not himself, and did not according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he that knew not, and did things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. And unto whomsoever much is given, of him much shall be required: and to whom they have committed much, of him they will demand the more.