Are We Still Praying For the Conversion of Russia?

[At_Trent]

Why can’t we compromise and pray for Alaska ? It’s just across the creek from Russia, used to be Russia, and the Eskimos have Russian ancestors.

And it’ll be better for the whales

 

[Like]

WOW! What an insulting forum, i’ll back off, but i’m very sorry if i offended anyone with my bull---- and I’m 70 years old , a Deacon, and was LayDirector of a CYO where i raiserd 56 children , sorry about the shouting but i was writting from the Vatican press. and next time you encounter a jerk like me, get the moderater to bounce me.

Aloha Jack, I believe maurin is right about a couple of things. I do owe you an apology for responding to your post the way I did! It was uncalled for, PLEASE accept my apology!

And you are NOT a jerk & no one should ask to have you banned, you only stated your opinion. I too am 70 & my opinion is the opposite as yours, but I need to learn how to debate & not criticise. At least the way I did.
God bless!

 

[Hesychios]

I still have hopes of elevating this discussion a little bit.

If I remember correctly, the first apparition was in or about 1917AD, is that correct?

What year was the request for prayers for Russia made, and who was present at that time?

 

[maurin]

But alas, Hesychios, mocking is so much easier. It requires no actual substance.

 

[Hunter53]

I still have hopes of elevating this discussion a little bit.

If I remember correctly, the first apparition was in or about 1917AD, is that correct?

What year was the request for prayers for Russia made, and who was present at that time?

Yes the first apparition was on May 13th 1917. Are we talking about the prayers after a low mass? If we are then they do not really go with Fatima because they are for the church in Russia, requested first by Pope Leo and again by Pius XI in 1934.

 

[Monty61]

, and more recently a large portion of Russian people are now opposed to abortion (Russia was the first country to legalize abortion in 1920 or so, and it is still legal there as in most Christian countries, but this is another good sign.) It sounds as if the Russian gov’t is more open to religion than ours!

My comment here is a little off topic, but related to the above post. Recently I read a book called “America Alone” by Mark Steyn. In it he has an excellent discussion of demographics and how changing populations will affect the future, with respect to Western Civilization vs. Islam.

In discussing Russia, Steyn point out that about 70% of all pregnancies in Russia end in abortion. There is also quite an AIDS outbreak going on there as well. The point he makes is that the non-Muslim population in Russia is not sustaining itself, and that in our lifetime, the majority of the Russian military will be made up of Muslims from the “-stan” members of the federation, in control of what is left of the former Soviet nuclear arsenal.

While I don’t doubt that John Paul II sincerely complied with Our Lady’s request, in any case Russia still needs a lot of prayers said for it.

 

[jackangelo1]

Whoa, I’m 78 years, and like to just say i had a chip on my shoulder. I was a member of Catholicitycrosstalk, where most members are PHDs, Master Degree, Authors, Theologist ,real brain! s and me with no education but reading , made an interesting discussion group. Every word I said was investigated for content.Here is some information ,useful.I hope? the Magizine, “The Fatima Crusade"The Repubblica Online, The book, “The Devils final Battle” Web sites; “ANF@ANF.ORG” " fatima-e-news@thefatimacenter.com” “fatimachallenge.com” I think these are dangerous times ,especially with this President and the Sociualist Congress.?We must all pray,

 

[jackangelo1]

Whoa, I’m 78 years, and like to just say i had a chip on my shoulder. I was a member of Catholicitycrosstalk, where most members are PHDs, Master Degree, Authors, Theologist ,real brain! s and me with no education but reading , made an interesting discussion group. Every word I said was investigated for content.Here is some information ,useful.I hope? the Magizine, “The Fatima Crusade"The Repubblica Online, The book, “The Devils final Battle” Web sites; “ANF@ANF.ORG” " fatima-e-news@thefatimacenter.com” “fatimachallenge.com” I think these are dangerous times ,especially with this President and the Sociualist Congress.?We must all pray,

“on the way back to the forum” the information and experience one gathers through 78 years is sometimes hard to remember.So pardon me if I cannot remember all information to satisfy the group!

 

[Ridgerunner]

WOW! What an insulting forum, i’ll back off, but i’m very sorry if i offended anyone with my bull---- and I’m 70 years old , a Deacon, and was LayDirector of a CYO where i raiserd 56 children , sorry about the shouting but i was writting from the Vatican press. and next time you encounter a jerk like me, get the moderater to bounce me.

Easy there, pardner. I’ve been cut up by experts on here, but I didn’t die. It’s just part of it. You’ll get used to getting critiqued here and there. Now and then, somebody will actually praise or affirm your post. Don’t let it bother you. It’s just part of being on a blog, I guess.

And nobody thinks you’re a jerk, except to the extent all human beings are jerks. (And we kind of are, you know.)

 

[otjm]

Why can’t we compromise and pray for Alaska ? It’s just across the creek from Russia, used to be Russia, and the Eskimos have Russian ancestors.

And it’ll be better for the whales

Didn’t you mean polar bears? And one must not forget the caribou…

 

[otjm]

Aloha Jack, I believe maurin is right about a couple of things. I do owe you an apology for responding to your post the way I did! It was uncalled for, PLEASE accept my apology!

And you are NOT a jerk & no one should ask to have you banned, you only stated your opinion. I too am 70 & my opinion is the opposite as yours, but I need to learn how to debate & not criticise. At least the way I did.
God bless!

Um, so you are sying you are unlike???

 

[Like]

Um, so you are sying you are unlike???

Please explain.

 

[Biedrik]

One thing that confuses me about these claims that Russia has not been properly consecrated, is that it seems to me, that Russia is part of the world. If the whole world is consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, then how on earth is it not consecrated? I find it unlikely that Mary would be so picky about this. Russia is just as consecrated whether it is consecrated on its own or with this entire planet. Is Mary really so concerned with the exact wording? As someone said, this just sounds like magic. If one asks Mary for something through the Rosary, do you really think she’ll say no because you messed up the wording or got the order of the mysteries wrong? I doubt it. And so I doubt she would be so nitpicky about this.

 

[Pregustator]

Well, interesting questions. There are different schools of thought with regard to that topic.

One school of thought is that the consecration of Russia was accomplished by Pope John Paul II, that the Soviet Union subsequently collapsed, and the matter is closed. Sr. Lucy, the Fatima seer, expressed her opinion before she died that the consecrations had been correctly done by John Paul.

Another is that none of the popes of the 20th century, including John Paul II, correctly performed the requested consecration, and that the world remains in peril of some chastisement which Russia will heap upon the world. Those in this camp tend to be traditionalist Catholics who believe that Sr. Lucy was somehow manipulated into a false assertion of the authenticity of John Paul’s consecration.

Still another is that Fatima is a false apparition, and that the consecration of Russia is, therefore, a non-issue.

Needless to say, Russia is not a Catholic country. And if, as a Catholic, you believe that all the peoples of the earth should form one flock under one shepherd, then yes, pray for Russia’s conversion. But not just Russia. How about the good ol’ USA? Or the United Kingdom? Or China? Or every other country in the world except Vatican City, for that matter.

As far as the Leonine Prayers, they’re typically recited only after a celebration of the Extraordinary Form of Mass by traditionalist Catholics. For the most part, however, they’ve fallen out of vogue.

 

[otjm]

Please explain.

It was humor. You were comparing your age to his…

 

[otjm]

Well, interesting questions. There are different schools of thought with regard to that topic.

One school of thought is that the consecration of Russia was accomplished by Pope John Paul II, that the Soviet Union subsequently collapsed, and the matter is closed. Sr. Lucy, the Fatima seer, expressed her opinion before she died that the consecrations had been correctly done by John Paul.

Another is that none of the popes of the 20th century, including John Paul II, correctly performed the requested consecration, and that the world remains in peril of some chastisement which Russia will heap upon the world. Those in this camp tend to be traditionalist Catholics who believe that Sr. Lucy was somehow manipulated into a false assertion of the authenticity of John Paul’s consecration.

Still another is that Fatima is a false apparition, and that the consecration of Russia is, therefore, a non-issue.

Needless to say, Russia is not a Catholic country. And if, as a Catholic, you believe that all the peoples of the earth should form one flock under one shepherd, then yes, pray for Russia’s conversion. But not just Russia. How about the good ol’ USA? Or the United Kingdom? Or China? Or every other country in the world except Vatican City, for that matter.

As far as the Leonine Prayers, they’re typically recited only after a celebration of the Extraordinary Form of Mass by traditionalist Catholics. For the most part, however, they’ve fallen out of vogue.

You are right; it is not Catholic; it is primarily Orthodox, who remain is schism with the Catholic Church. Benedict has been working on it slowly and gradually seems to be making more headway than John Paul - but much of that had to do with centuries old politics.

 

[jackangelo1]

Remember one thing concerning MARY wanting Russia Consecrated to Her Heart, maybe she knew Lenin had evil intensions??Did She know the future?? Should we pay more attention to the truth of the 3rd secret??I wish everyone would take more interest on this thread till we find the truth , I like to ask questions untill the truth is told. IN 1918 ,The Lady of Fatima told the chidren when to warn the people of coming events, so we waited ! in 1960 the 3rd secret was revealed, BUT not all of it. errors lies were committed ,till Pop John Paul was shot, and still the truth was held back. The words of the Pope Benedict;“Pedophillia is in the 3rd secret of Fatima”( may 12 2010) "Fatima had foreseen it "(pedophillia crisis) .This is why after reading “Good-Bye Good-Men " I fought for the truth from our leaders. This is a Profound,but true Statemen ! ALL Popes,Cardinals ,bishops , from back to the 50s have Lied to all people, decieved us about the homosexual pedophilist abusing,molesting Thousands of children. and THEY are still members of the Catholic Hierarchy. I wrote this in an earlier thread, and I wish,for Gods sake that all members and leaders of Catholic Forums would help. " The Pope and his bishops MUST OBEY cANON lAW #912,#915 #1329, # 1398 and Follow Church Doctrine by Excomunicating all bishops,priets,Polititions and Laity who AID,ABET,and Counsel abortion and\or homosexuality”? They must CUT the Diseased sheep from the flock ,to SAVE the good sheep. WHY ,you ask is that imporant?? Here in Buffalo,ny the bishop has Closed 77 Parishes. ? The Pope must Remove these evils from Roman Catholicism.

 

[Hesychios]

Needless to say, Russia is not a Catholic country. And if, as a Catholic, you believe that all the peoples of the earth should form one flock under one shepherd, then yes, pray for Russia’s conversion. But not just Russia. How about the good ol’ USA? Or the United Kingdom? Or China? Or every other country in the world except Vatican City, for that matter.

OK, perhaps.

But what is Mary asking for (if indeed she is)?

Russia has been a Christian country since the tenth century, and devoted to Mary the entire time. Of course it is a predominantly Orthodox country.

But in all these years, even centuries, the BVM never made a request like this to anyone, until the twentieth century.

So what errors has Russia been spreading in all those centuries? The country has been from it’s earliest days expanding into the east, and proselytising among the native pagan, Buddhist and Muslim tribes all across Siberia. In the 18th century they reached Alaska and Mongolia, in the 19th century Japan and China. BTW, Orthodoxy was even spreading into Poland and Finland from Russia.

Not a peep from the Blessed Virgin, although she was reported in visions many times.

Then came the Bolshevik revolution, and the nation stops promoting and spreading Christianity altogether, it persecutes the Orthodox church, and all churches including the Catholic church within it’s borders. The Holy synod declines from 150 bishops to four (about fifteen or perhaps twenty escape the country with the Whites), it was an age of martyrs and passion bearers.

Russia is spreading atheism, the Blessed Virgin speaks out.

 

[At_Trent]

But alas, Hesychios, mocking is so much easier. It requires no actual substance.

Why maurin, I’m appalled !

In this age of reason and rationalism is quite acceptable to deny the accounts of thousands who witnessed a miracle.

 

[jackangelo1]

Maybe the BVM and I look at the world differently than most. the BVM knew what communism was all about, another thing I remmber from the news and people from WWII, General Patton waiting at Berlin (under orders) for the Russians to split the spoils of victory, asked his Commander if he could take his 600 tanks through Berlin ( defeat Marxism) and then through Stalingrad (defeat Communism)He told everyone that Communism was going to be a big problem. ,would you believe , They cut off his gas supply ,and latter had him killed? dont look at Other Countries, Communism gave us Cuban blockade , Vietnam, Korea,Chinese Communism, and unfortunetly America has many communist in the U.S. Congress. and Comrade obama? PRAY to our MOTHE!