Are you a Christian or a Catholic

[SeanTom]

Er-em…

Catholicism is NOT a denomination (one would never call the trunk a ‘branch’)

OK, Thank you, and I do like your word picture. But Websters Dictionary, a book that defines most words so that most people will understand their meanings, defines “denomination” as:

“A religious organization uniting local congregations in a single legal and administrative body”.

Organization: “Characterized by complete conformity to the standards and requirements of an organization”

But I agree, Catholicism is the so called “trunk”, or main stay of all Christianity produced by the seeds sown by God, the creator of all living things.

AMEN

 

[FidesSpesCarita]

Er-em…

Catholicism is NOT a denomination (one would never call the trunk a ‘branch’)

I love this statement!!! Thanks Apryl, I am definitely going to steal this from you

FSC

 

[SeanTom]

What I’m really asking is this: Can one be saved and forgiven and receive eternal life having heard the gospel and not believing what it says?

If one is aware of the teaching of Jesus, but does not believe in them, I would say one is asking for trouble. That has the same effect of turning one’s back on Jesus. You have to believe in Jesus if you are to gain entry into His Kingdom.

But their are occasions where some people never heard of Jesus and His teachings. In this case, God will be the final judge. We are not responsible for what we are not aware of. But if we are just a little aware of Jesus, it is our obligation to strengthen our faith by learning all we can about what Jesus requires of us to attain His Kingdom, and we must then follow His teachings…

 

[IAGladfelter]

I wish more Catholics would start referring to themselves as “Catholic Christians.” So many of the ignorant protestants think they’re the only “Christians” and that “Catholic” is a different religion. If more of us would say, "Catholic Christians, " maybe we could enlighten a large segment of society.

All Roman Catholics are Christians, period; but not all Christians are Roman Catholics.

Lets not appear to even seem to be considering the Evangelical/Fundamentalist/Pentecostal fiction that they and they alone are Christians, and the Roman Catholic Church, its "Sister Churches, “Daughter Churches” like the PNCC, for instance, and the Protestant Ecclesial Communities are not Christians. That is outrageous.

Blessings,
Irl

 

[Apryl]

I love this statement!!! Thanks Apryl, I am definitely going to steal this from you

No! You can’t!!

I stole it from some one else

I usually don’t even say it to others… but here, on CAF??? I figure I’ll start within and get it to spread.

 

[ron77nyc]

All Roman Catholics are Christians, period;

Here’s my question again. If you are a Roman Catholic who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? If you are a baptized Protestant who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? Isn’t faith in Jesus necessary in order to call yourself a Christian?

 

[SeanTom]

Here’s my question again. If you are a Roman Catholic who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? If you are a baptized Protestant who does not believe in Jesus are you still a Christian? Isn’t faith in Jesus necessary in order to call yourself a Christian?

You answered your own question, and your answer is correct.

 

[geminiangel6670]

Thank you, and we have had the conversation about respecting each others religious beliefs. It seems to have settled down a bit. Some of the literature that he reads though is ridiculous. The latest one was from Jack Van Impe and it talked about Obama being the Anti-Christ. I thought about asking him if he was really buying into that, but decided to just let it go. Converting my husband to Catholicism isn’t my goal, and telling him about visions of the Virgin Mary certainly won’t help because there’s that whole “Catholics worship idols” thing I don’t even want to start.

I find it amazing that some people think that Catholics aren’t Christian because we “practice traditions, and worship idols, and changed the 10 Commandments”, and whatever else, but yet the really crazy stuff out there being preached by Fundamentalist Christians is considered Christian?

 

[geminiangel6670]

geminiangel6670, I can relate to your situation completely. I was in your husband’s shoes for forty years of marriage. I married a cradle Catholic, like yourself, and never, ever understood the Catholic faith, or why Catholics do what they do at Mass. I was “born again” at a relatively young age and was brought up to believe “once saved, always saved.” … In no particular order, I would recommend Scott Hahn’s conversion c.d., Patrick Madrid’s compilation of conversion stories titled “Surprised by Truth” (all volumes), and any literature which lays out the history and tradition of the Catholic Church. Depending on how open-minded your husband is it may take quite a long time, if ever, for him to entertain such suggestions. I was simply ignorant (not stupid) regarding Catholicism—that is, lacking information and knowledge. All my previously held misconceptions were dissolved once, as they say, I learned the “truth.” As an aside, I had to admit to myself that the concept of “once saved, always saved” just made no sense whatsoever. I will pray that God will soften your husband’s heart. My cradle Catholic wife now, unwittingly, gives me the greatest compliment by calling me “too Catholic.” Wouldn’t it be wonderful if some day you can give your husband the same compliment?

Thank you for sharing your story with me and thank you for your prayers. My husband is not very open-minded about other religions, although generic Christian seems to be okay with him. We have a daughter, almost 3, and I know that there is a long road ahead of us as far as that goes too. I take her to Catholic mass with me, mostly because the 3 to 4 hours at the Baptist Church is too much for her at this age. I’ve agreed to let her go to the school that is part of my husband’s church though when she is old enough. I plan to send her for religious education too, to receive her 1st holy communion, reconciliation and all that. I just hope that it doesn’t confuse her, but she’s pretty smart even at 2, so I just plan to talk to her about it A LOT! I suppose if the Baptist school starts to brainwash her I’ll have to take her out, but I will just pray that it doesn’t come to that and not worry about it now. I don’t want my husband to try to convert me, so likewise, I’m not trying to convert him. I just think he needs to see that there are many different “Christian” religions, including Catholicism, and that he needs to be more tolerant. Thank you for the referral for the surprised by Truth volumes, I will definitely look for those.

 

[geminiangel6670]

First of all: I pray for you (and your husband). That has to be a tough challenge. …Just pray. Pray a lot. Pray together. Pray for each other: for patience, understanding, temperment… and pray for each other to get into heaven to that you can share eternity together.

I don’t have an OUNCE of advice. I can just pray, and suggest you do the same. Wish I had more.

Praying is GREAT advice, thank you, and I do pray, all the time! I know that more than anything that is what keeps me going. I even say prayers of thanks that my husband found God, even if he doing the trippy “super-christian” thing right now. I know that sooner or later it has to settle down, and he will see that the most important thing is Jesus and what he sacrified for us.

 

[white_sheep]

Catholicism and Christianity are the same thing. Just because some schismatics are still similar enough to us to be technically referred to as Christians changes nothing.

 

[Morgan2375]

As I’m sure you know Jesus Christ established the church. It was St. Augustine of Hippo who first called the church Catholic just a few hundred years after Christ established it.

So as the church established by Christ, Catholic can’t be a church denomination, rather it is the base from which the denominations came into being.

Just as money isn’t a denomination but different coins or bills are so too Catholic isn’t a denomination but Baptist,Evangelical, Pentecostal, Methodist, Presbyterian, Lutheran, and even non-denominational churches are.

 

[Apryl]

I don’t want my husband to try to convert me, so likewise, I’m not trying to convert him. I just think he needs to see that there are many different “Christian” religions, including Catholicism, and that he needs to be more tolerant. .

I still think you should try to convert him

Imagine getting to eternity, and he’s not there

Seriously: if you REALLY believe the Catholic Church to be the Truth, why wouldn’t you want that for every one you love or care about?

 

[Canto]

As I’m sure you know Jesus Christ established the church. It was St. Augustine of Hippo who first called the church Catholic just a few hundred years after Christ established it.

So as the church established by Christ, Catholic can’t be a church denomination, rather it is the base from which the denominations came into being.

Just as money isn’t a denomination but different coins or bills are so too Catholic isn’t a denomination but Baptist,Evangelical, Pentecostal, Methodist, Presbyterian, Lutheran, and even non-denominational churches are.

Good point, but the first recorded use of the word Catholic was by St Ignatius at Antioch, where we were first called Christians. It is implied in his writings that the term was already in use. St Ignatius was a disciple of St John.

“Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church.” - Letter to the Smyrnaeans, written within 100 years of Christ’s passion.

 

[Matthew_P_Muehl]

As I’m sure you know Jesus Christ established the church. It was St. Augustine of Hippo who first called the church Catholic just a few hundred years after Christ established it.

So as the church established by Christ, Catholic can’t be a church denomination, rather it is the base from which the denominations came into being.

Just as money isn’t a denomination but different coins or bills are so too Catholic isn’t a denomination but Baptist,Evangelical, Pentecostal, Methodist, Presbyterian, Lutheran, and even non-denominational churches are.

Hello Morgan… I like to look at it this way, all the protestant denominations are like a big pile of tooth picks where as the catholic church is a big solid block of wood.

Matt

 

[Morgan2375]

Matt, I like that analogy!

In my early years I’ve fallen prey to thinking Catholic was just another denomination too. Your analogy is very helpful, thanks.

 

[Morgan2375]

Good point, but the first recorded use of the word Catholic was by St Ignatius at Antioch, where we were first called Christians. It is implied in his writings that the term was already in use. St Ignatius was a disciple of St John.

“Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church.” - Letter to the Smyrnaeans, written within 100 years of Christ’s passion.

Canto, thank you, I knew it didn’t sound right when I wrote it but I wrote in haste. Sorry.

It was St. Ignatius about 70 years after the resurrection of Christ. He used the term “Katolikos” which was from the same variation of Greek used by St. Paul in his epistles.

 

[dnlyle53]

A great book to offer the baptist husband who will not consider the Catholic Church is "Born Fundamentalist, Born again Catholic’. This is written by a baptist minister, son of baptist seminary instructor parents, who through the scriptures was drawn like Scott Hahn to the ‘Truth’ of the Catholic interpretation of the scriptures, and hence to the truth that Jesus taught the Apostles, and of which we all learn in our Catholic Faith. Ask your husband if he desires to be like the Pharasees and Scribes, they knew what they knew and they would have none of the truth of Jesus. Jesus founded his one church on Peter, and the Apostles, and the truth of the growth of christianity is historical. If you are not for the truth, then you must be for a lie (who is the father of all lies?); Jesus said, either you are with me and you help to gather, or you are not and you help to scatter. The protestant reformation has scattered many away from the faith, the sacraments, from baptism, reconciliation, eucharist. I was for 30 years a Methodist, my wife a cradle Catholic, she prayed for me but never pushed, and now since I have learned the truth, I am sometimes very angry with the protestant lack of teaching all christian truthes. The first time I read John 6 with the knowledge of Catholicism I was literally shocked to think this had been withheld from me. Be gentle with your husband, complement him on his tenacity of belief, coax him to take a baby step toward you and to trust you. The Truth will set him free and it will be a light bulb moment when he gets it. Pray to the Holy Spirit for his deliverance from evil.

 

[Apryl]

Hello Morgan… I like to look at it this way, all the protestant denominations are like a big pile of tooth picks where as the catholic church is a big solid block of wood.

And there is another for me to add to the ‘I stole it’ pile!

 

[geminiangel6670]

I am sometimes very angry with the protestant lack of teaching all christian truthes. The first time I read John 6 with the knowledge of Catholicism I was literally shocked to think this had been withheld from me. Be gentle with your husband, complement him on his tenacity of belief, coax him to take a baby step toward you and to trust you. The Truth will set him free and it will be a light bulb moment when he gets it. Pray to the Holy Spirit for his deliverance from evil.

I’ve really been thinking and praying about what I posted previously, about not wanting to convert my husband. I guess, I don’t want to be disrespectful to him, but I do pray that he “gets it”.

I was speaking with my mother-in-law this morning, who is very active in the Baptist church, and it was so frustrating. It started with a conversation about the book The Shack, she was telling me it was New Age, that it teaches God is in everything. I told her I kind of agreed with that, and she said it wasn’t biblical to believe that. The conversation turned to what other people and religions believe, and of course the “good works won’t get you into heaven” came up. She said we aren’t saved by our good works, we do good works because we are saved. I told her I agreed, if someone says they’re a Christian, but then treats people like ****, they are hypocrites. I told her, “Jesus said to love your brother, to love one another as God has loved us”. Then she told me, “well, when the Bible says to love your brother, it means other Christians, we’re supposed to love other Christians”. I told her but we are all God’s children, and left it at that. I wanted to bring up that Jesus was talking to the sinners while he was here on earth, but I didn’t want to disrespect her because I could tell it would turn into an argument, and she would not be swayed.

Everything with my husband and his parents religion is making me stronger in my Catholic Faith and reading these posts and forums has been a real blessing.