Are you a liberal? Are you sure?

[Jay74]

Interesting. Can be found at: dennisprager.com/areyouliberal.html

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Are You a Liberal?

It is my belief that about half of the Americans who call themselves liberal do not hold the great majority of positions held by mainstream liberal institutions such as the New York Times editorial page, People for the American Way, and the liberal wing of the Democratic Party. So here is a test of this thesis to be given to anyone who believes he or she is a liberal. If you feel I have omitted a liberal position or have unfairly characterized any of them here, please email me. This is still a work in progress.

Thank you,
Dennis Prager

You say you are a liberal.

Do you believe the following?

1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
3. Murderers should never be put to death.
4. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
5. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
6. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.
7. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.
8. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.
9. Marriage should be redefined from male-female to any two people.
10. A married couple should not have more of a right to adopt a child than two men or two women.
11. The Boy Scouts should not be allowed to use parks or any other public places and should be prohibited from using churches and synagogues for their meetings.
12. The present high tax rates are good.
13. Speech codes on college campuses are good and American values are bad.
14. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.
15. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as a world court.
16. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men’s sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
17. No abortions can be labeled immoral.
18. Restaurants should be prohibited by law from allowing customers to choose between a smoking and a non-smoking section.
19. High schools should make condoms available to students and teach them how to use them.
20. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong – a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
21. Racism and poverty – not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values – are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
22. It is wrong and unconstitutional for students to be told, “God bless you” at their graduation.
23. No culture is morally superior to any other.

Those are all liberal positions. How many of them do you hold?

 

[Snicker]

Are You a Liberal?

You say you are a liberal.

Do you believe the following?

1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
3. Murderers should never be put to death.
4. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
5. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
6. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.
7. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.
8. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.
9. Marriage should be redefined from male-female to any two people.
10. A married couple should not have more of a right to adopt a child than two men or two women.
11. The Boy Scouts should not be allowed to use parks or any other public places and should be prohibited from using churches and synagogues for their meetings.
12. The present high tax rates are good
13. Speech codes on college campuses are good and American values are bad.
14. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent
15. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as a world court.
16. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men’s sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
17. No abortions can be labeled immoral.
18. Restaurants should be prohibited by law from allowing customers to choose between a smoking and a non-smoking section.
19. High schools should make condoms available to students and teach them how to use them.
20. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong – a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
21. Racism and poverty – not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values – are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
22. It is wrong and unconstitutional for students to be told, “God bless you” at their graduation.
23. No culture is morally superior to any other.

Those are all liberal positions. How many of them do you hold?

I hold 8 out of the 23 posted. I never claimed to be a liberal anyway.

 

[gilliam]

I’ve always found the reactions to this quiz interesting:

Are you a Neocon? Take the Quiz

 

[Philip_P]

It depends where you set the bar. On the fuill scale of American political opinion, I’m a centrist who tacks a bit to the left. On the scale of the CA Forums, I’m a liberal.

Either way, the fact that I don’t hate the government, that in fact I believe it to be a powerful tool for advancing the common good rather than an evil to be tolerated or destroyed, puts me firmly on the left side of the fence. I could certainly imagine myself voting for a Republican candidate for president in the future, but I could never imagine calling myself a conservative.

 

[gilliam]

Philip P:

It depends where you set the bar. On the fuill scale of American political opinion, I’m a centrist who tacks a bit to the left. On the scale of the CA Forums, I’m a liberal.

Either way, the fact that I don’t hate the government, that in fact I believe it to be a powerful tool for advancing the common good rather than an evil to be tolerated or destroyed, puts me firmly on the left side of the fence. I could certainly imagine myself voting for a Republican candidate for president in the future, but I could never imagine calling myself a conservative.

take the quiz: Are you a Neocon? Take the Quiz

 

[JMJ_Pinoy]

Jay74:

Interesting. Can be found at: dennisprager.com/areyouliberal.html

---

Are You a Liberal?

It is my belief that about half of the Americans who call themselves liberal do not hold the great majority of positions held by mainstream liberal institutions such as the New York Times editorial page, People for the American Way, and the liberal wing of the Democratic Party. So here is a test of this thesis to be given to anyone who believes he or she is a liberal. If you feel I have omitted a liberal position or have unfairly characterized any of them here, please email me. This is still a work in progress.

Thank you,
Dennis Prager

You say you are a liberal.

Do you believe the following?

1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
3. Murderers should never be put to death.
4. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
5. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
6. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.
7. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools.
8. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party.
9. Marriage should be redefined from male-female to any two people.
10. A married couple should not have more of a right to adopt a child than two men or two women.
11. The Boy Scouts should not be allowed to use parks or any other public places and should be prohibited from using churches and synagogues for their meetings.
12. The present high tax rates are good.
13. Speech codes on college campuses are good and American values are bad.
14. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.
15. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as a world court.
16. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men’s sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
17. No abortions can be labeled immoral.
18. Restaurants should be prohibited by law from allowing customers to choose between a smoking and a non-smoking section.
19. High schools should make condoms available to students and teach them how to use them.
20. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong – a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
21. Racism and poverty – not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values – are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
22. It is wrong and unconstitutional for students to be told, “God bless you” at their graduation.
23. No culture is morally superior to any other.

Those are all liberal positions. How many of them do you hold?

I hold none of them. That’s probably because I’m a conservative.

 

[Naphali]

I am a self professed bleeding heart liberal on many issues – but not all

Do you believe the following? (I’ll Bold what I agree with and Italicize my additions)

**1. Standards for admissions to universities, fire departments, etc. should be lowered for people of color.
2. Bilingual education for children of immigrants, rather than immersion in English, is good for them and for America.
3. Murderers should never be put to death.
**4. During the Cold War, America should have adopted a nuclear arms freeze.
5. Colleges should not allow ROTC programs.
*6. It was wrong to wage war against Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War. **I do believe it was wrong to wage war on him AGAIN when he hadn’t done anything wrong since, the Gulf War was about Kuwait – the current war is about well, anything but peace – **
*7. Poor parents should not be allowed to have vouchers to send their children to private schools. – It’s not about poor/wealthy – it’s about making schools better, I homeschool and I don’t want my taxes back – I want other people’s kids to be SMART
**8. It is good that trial lawyers and teachers unions are the two biggest contributors to the Democratic Party. So long as it’s good that big business and heavy polluters keep giving money to the Reps.
**9. Marriage should be redefined from male-female to any two people. I do belive that there should be LEGAL protection for gay people – but not marriage, because I believe that’s mixing church and state
*10. A married couple should not have more of a right to adopt a child than two men or two women. I’m torn on this – if there’s a child in foster care that has no other options then I think they should be allowed to adopt – but not be given equal footing – although in many cases the birth mother can choose the adoptive parents and she should be allowed to choose whomever she wants. *
*11. The Boy Scouts should not be allowed to use parks or any other public places and should be prohibited from using churches and synagogues for their meetings. Boy scouts can EITHER use state property and allow everyone in OR church property and contine to have their own guidelines –
*12. The present high tax rates are good. Heck mine are going down – why? aren’t we in debt up to our eyeballs??
**13. Speech codes on college campuses are good and American values are bad. – American values ARE bad – have you watched MTV lately? Reality TV – it’s crud – **
14. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.
15. The United Nations is a moral force for good in the world, and therefore America should be subservient to it and such international institutions as a world court. – here we’re really talking about striking a “preemptive war” where there was no war brewing – we were WRONG –
16. It is good that colleges have dropped hundreds of men’s sports teams in order to meet gender-based quotas.
17. No abortions can be labeled immoral.
18. Restaurants should be prohibited by law from allowing customers to choose between a smoking and a non-smoking section.
**19. High schools should make condoms available to students and teach them how to use them. – Please, please – but don’t just do that, teach kids about abstinence, the pill’s real effects, how easy it is to catch a disease and how when you sleep with someone you have given them a part of yourself that you should be saving for ONE person – and in highschool, you probably havn’t met them yet – **
20. Racial profiling for terrorists is wrong – a white American grandmother should as likely be searched as a Saudi young male.
21. Racism and poverty – not a lack of fathers and a crisis of values – are the primary causes of violent crime in the inner city.
22. It is wrong and unconstitutional for students to be told, “God bless you” at their graduation.
23. No culture is morally superior to any other.

This is all worded to make someone like me sound bad – but I still believe firmly in at least some form of many of those statements – so see, I’m liberal – and Catholic, you CAN be both – oooo

 

[MikeWM]

Hmm.

1. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.

Err… don’t we all believe this? They are human beings, right? Aren’t they equivalent per se? If anything, their actions might be what differentiates them in our minds, but the people themselves…



Mike

 

[Jay74]

MikeWM:

Hmm.

1. The Israelis and Palestinians are morally equivalent.

Err… don’t we all believe this? They are human beings, right? Aren’t they equivalent per se? If anything, their actions might be what differentiates them in our minds, but the people themselves…



Mike

It’s talking about their behavior when it says morally. Of course they are equal in value as individual humans, but their societal behavior is not morally equivalent.

 

[MikeWM]

Jay74:

It’s talking about their behavior when it says morally. Of course they are equal in value as individual humans, but their societal behavior is not morally equivalent.

Ah. So I have to judge a person based on the behaviour of a society they are a member of, often by accident of birth, not on their individual values? Doesn’t sound very Catholic.

Mike

 

[WanderAimlessly]

:bigyikes: 0 out of 23 three here :bigyikes:

And I score a Realist on the NeoCon quiz. Of course, to a liberal, everything Right of Marx is a NeoCon.

PF

 

[Steve_Andersen]

Jay74:

Interesting. Can be found at: dennisprager.com/areyouliberal.html

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Are You a Liberal?

It is my belief that about half of the Americans who call themselves liberal do not hold the great majority of positions held by mainstream liberal institutions such as the New York Times editorial page, People for the American Way, and the liberal wing of the Democratic Party. So here is a test of this thesis …

so he is assuming that
(a) the positions, as he states them are the positions of the institutions listed
(b) that you have to agree with the institutions listed to consider yourself a Liberal and
(c) even given a & b that there is no room for dissent or diversity of opinion in a school of thought.

Seems nothing more than an exercise in smugness

This seems to me to be a more comprehensive definition of liberalism

a product of the enlightnment, championing the individual against totalitarianism….not too bad a philosophy

PS I agree with 4 of the 23 on that horrible list

 

[Jay74]

MikeWM:

Ah. So I have to judge a person based on the behaviour of a society they are a member of, often by accident of birth, not on their individual values? Doesn’t sound very Catholic.

Mike

you’re wilfully misreading what was said. Of course an individual is judged by their behavior. A palestinian who is good is judged as so. that does not change the fact that there is more societal support for terrorism from palestinian society that israeli society.

Not too many israelis are committing suiciding terrorism in Palestinian school cafeterias.

 

[David_Paul]

Steve Andersen:

This seems to me to be a more comprehensive definition of liberalism
a product of the enlightnment, championing the individual against totalitarianism….not too bad a philosophy

But that is not the history of liberalism in the 20th century. From Lenin to Ortega, there was not one totalitarian socialist who was not praised by the left. For a short time, during the German-Soviet nonaggression pact, leftists were even on the side of Nazi Germany (the CIO called strikes to prevent munitions from going to the UK to fight the battle of Britain).

Even today we have members of the progressive caucus praising Fidel Castro.

Not all liberals, of course, went along with this. Hubert Humphrey didn’t. Neither did JFK, RFK, Sam Nunn, Daniel Patrick Moynihan and others. But many in the FDR and Truman administrations did. Elizabeth Bentley exposed over 100 of them. Venona exposed another 200+. Vice President Henry Wallace and other New Dealers visited the Kolyma concentration camp complex in 1944 and praised it. There was a brief hiatus in the 1950s, but by the 60s the apologists for totalitarianism were back in force. Robert Scheer, when he worked for Ramparts, praised Kim Il Sung. Today he works for the LA Times. And he isn’t alone. The New Left, the red diaper babies, won in the end. By Carter, they ran the Democratic party.

George Irbe on the subject:

The 20th century will be remembered for the totalitarian monsters of various stripes who conceived, planned and executed programs of selective mass extermination of humans. I think that all Leftists, without exception, including the meekest of democratic socialists, have been implicated - knowingly or in consciously cultivated ignorance – as apologists for, or accomplices and abettors to the crimes of the totalitarians . . .

continued here

 

[MikeWM]

Jay74:

you’re wilfully misreading what was said.

Thanks. Your charity is much appreciated

Of course an individual is judged by their behavior. A palestinian who is good is judged as so. that does not change the fact that there is more societal support for terrorism from palestinian society that israeli society.

Not too many israelis are committing suiciding terrorism in Palestinian school cafeterias.

Then at the very least this silly list should have said ‘actions of the society’ or similar. A person is a person, independent of the society they happen to be born into.

Mike

 

[Jay74]

MikeWM:

Thanks. Your charity is much appreciated

You’re right. That remark came across as less charitable than I meant for it to.

I offer no excuse, just my sincerest apology. I’m sorry, MikeWM.

 

[MikeWM]

Jay74:

You’re right. That remark came across as less charitable than I meant for it to.

I offer no excuse, just my sincerest apology. I’m sorry, MikeWM.

Thanks, and no worries

I see your perspective too, I just think the whole thing was badly worded. Then again, the whole article seemed a bit of silliness in the first place, so…

Mike

 

[Jay74]

MikeWM:

Thanks, and no worries

I see your perspective too, I just think the whole thing was badly worded. Then again, the whole article seemed a bit of silliness in the first place, so…

Mike

It may have been badly worded, but I think he meant something similar to “are the Jews and Nazis morally equivalent?” Of course the individuals are equally human and valuable, but the societies weren’t.

Anyways, I found it interesting food for thought.

 

[Richardols]

Jay74:

you’re wilfully misreading what was said. Of course an individual is judged by their behavior. A palestinian who is good is judged as so. that does not change the fact that there is more societal support for terrorism from palestinian society that israeli society.

Not too many israelis are committing suiciding terrorism in Palestinian school cafeterias.

You are bringing terrorism into the discussion. Why? Even Prager didn’t phrase his remark in terms of support for terrorism.

 

[Richardols]

Steve Andersen:

so he is assuming that
(a) the positions, as he states them are the positions of the institutions listed
(b) that you have to agree with the institutions listed to consider yourself a Liberal and
(c) even given a & b that there is no room for dissent or diversity of opinion in a school of thought.

Seems nothing more than an exercise in smugness

Exactly. I’m sure that a different quiz could be constructed asking about how conservative a person is, framing the questions in it to make the conservative positions appear to be those of a Brownshirt or a Blackshirt.

a product of the enlightenment, championing the individual against totalitarianism….not too bad a philosophy

I’m with you there!