Armed pro-Trump protesters gather outside Michigan elections chief's home

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ProVobis said:
Yes but it’s a meaningless phrase if one of your governments governs a lot.

Isn’t this why some want to break up the EU for example? Isn’t one government to have to serve better than two?
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Not speaking about the EU, but one of the basics of our federalism was the enumeration of specific and limited powers (Article 1, Section 8), and all the rest reserved to the states and people (10th amendment).
 
But how long can that last? Gold is no longer a global standard, weather affects crops for long periods of time, technology changes affecting communications, etc.

Don’t forget this country itself was founded by a bunch of progressive Freemasons who cared nothing about preserving others properties. Except slavery perhaps.
 
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History is a thing.

Thank the NRA for this myth that any regulation is some sort of Constitutional crisis. I am all for responsible ownership, with the key word being “responsible.” Guns simply do not belong in some situations. Confrontational protests is one of them. Fine, if you want to march an carry signs and guns, fine. If you want to take bullhorns and yell obscenities, that is not a situation where guns need to be present. This could be treated as a limit on right to assembly as well, which also is not absolute. Lay out the plan, and protest. Guns, or anger, but not both.

Even police have strict regulations concerning carrying a firearm, which is why drinking on duty is never acceptable to any degree.
 
The problem with gun control laws is that they only affect law-abiding people.
 
MikeInVA said:
The problem with gun control laws is that they only affect law-abiding people.
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Stephen Paddock was a law-abiding person for 64 years up to September 30th 2017.
October 1st 2017, he was no longer a law-abiding person.
 
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MikeInVA said:
The problem with gun control laws is that they only affect law-abiding people.
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That is rather circular. Everyone is law-abiding when the obey the law, and not when they don’t. No one is immune from breaking the law when mentally and emotionally compromised. Crimes of passion, by definition, are not pre-meditated. That is why alcohol and guns do not mix in a bar. That is why angry mobs yelling at each other, and guns, do not mix. Sensible gun laws should not affect reasonable people too much. I guess if you are running into a bar for the wings to go it might be a five minute issue.

There is a 17 year old kid that brought a gun to a demonstration. Now he is facing murder. Win or lose, it is devastating. That, and there is a dead man. That should count for something here.
 
MikeInVA said:
OK, I still don’t understand what you’re trying to say.
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He was a law-abiding person until he was not.

Should we find a way discover potential threats from gun owners?
Some sort of mandatory pysch eval on a yearly basis?
 
RootKitWarrior said:
He was a law-abiding person until he was not.
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That pretty much describes everyone who commits a crime.
RootKitWarrior said:
Should we find a way discover potential threats from gun owners?
Some sort of mandatory pysch eval on a yearly basis?
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I have no desire to live in such an authoritarian country. Why would anyone want to live where they are considered guilty until proven innocent - even of crimes that have not committed?
 
Most teens stayed home and watched tick _ tock videos or played video games instead of playing mini Charles Bronson.
 
MikeInVA said:
I have no desire to live in such an authoritarian country. Why would anyone want to live where they are considered guilty until proven innocent - even of crimes that have not committed?
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When I worked in the Nuclear Industry, I did refueling outages all over the Country. At each one, before being granted Unescorted Access, we had to undergo a psych eval. And if it had been over a year since your last visit to the same plant, you still had to go thru the psych eval.

Does that consider us guilty until proven innocent?
 
ProVobis said:
But how long can that last? Gold is no longer a global standard, weather affects crops for long periods of time, technology changes affecting communications, etc.
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As long as we are diligent against strong central government tyranny, indefinitely.
ProVobis said:
Don’t forget this country itself was founded by a bunch of progressive Freemasons who cared nothing about preserving others properties. Except slavery perhaps.
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In every instance, the framers put into place the means by which individual rights and the expansion of liberty is possible.
One of the first things Jefferson did as president was end to importation of slaves. In place, the basic principles of the nation, found in the Declaration of Independence.
  • the rights of the individual are antecedent to the existence of government. Government neither creates rights or provides for them.
  • rights come from God / natural law and are inherent to humanity.
  • government exists to protect the rights of the individual.
With these truths in place, America has consistently strived to overcome its worst offenses against these founding principles. Not always successful, often not fast enough, the the founding principles are there.
 
My guess is nothing would have happened. People are more likely to be threatened by one carrying a gun, if it was self-defense, and would not have tried to pull a gun out. Likewise, when a person does not have a gun, especially a big gun, to bolster confidence, then prudence is more likely to prevail. This last reason is why I do not like to carry a gun. I like to rely only on myself without that …er… bolstering.
F_Marturana said:
Most teens stayed home and watched tick _ tock videos or played video games instead of playing mini Charles Bronson.
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And those teens are not awaiting trial.
 
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