Asking all priests: Why not talk about the hard issues at Mass?

[undead_rat]

Since then I have yet to hear a priest actually preach at the pulpit against the hard issues like abortion, pre-marital sex, contraception, and homosexual behavior.
Why aren’t these grave sins ever preached against during Mass?

You did not mention the most serious sin of all, the building of an arsenal of nuclear weapons which has the potential to destroy all human life in the northern hemisphere. Our Teacher noted that two commandments were the most important: to love and trust in our Creator and to love our neighbors. Our deployment of ICBMs and SLBMs grossly violates these commandments.

I have never heard an Episcopal priest advocate for unilateral nuclear disarmament even though this idea is part of the platform of the Episcopal Church.

https://episcopalarchives.org/cgi-bin/acts/acts_resolution-complete.pl?resolution=2009-D060

 

[PeterT]

PeterT:

Does the priests at your church often talk about sexual morality during their homilies

No. The priests at my church are much more interested in the poor and suffering in our community. For example, the Syrian migrant family that we have all worked to house and settle into our community; or the work we do with the St Vincent de Paul society for the homeless and those with mental health and addiction problems.

I find CAF to be in many ways a mile away from Catholics in the real world. I have met some wonderful people here. But the fascination with sexual morals as the only subject that counts … not getting it.

That’s great what your church does. It really is. My church has an active St. Vincent de Paul Society too that assist the poor of our area. But what you wrote isn’t the topic of this thread. As mentioned already by others, it doesn’t really take any courage on a priest’s part to talk about helping the poor and disenfranchised of our society in his homily.

What takes courage is talking about topics that are unpopular in our society, like abortion, pre-marital sex, and contraception. Many priests rarely even talk about topics that the society at-large knows is wrong yet the behavior is widespread (even among Catholics) like cheating, stealing, lying and greed.

Again, this thread is about why many priests don’t discuss the HARD issues facing us (not that there are other worthy issues to discuss during a homily like immigration, homelessness, taking care of the sick and needy).

 

[fide]

“You did not mention the most serious sin of all, the building of an arsenal of nuclear weapons which has the potential to destroy all human life in the northern hemisphere. Our Teacher noted that two commandments were the most important: to love and trust in our Creator and to love our neighbors.”

At what point would you advocate stopping, laying down your arms, and submitting to either enslavement under or annihilation by ruthless dictators?

The Catechism:

Legitimate defense
2263 The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. “The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one’s own life; and the killing of the aggressor… The one is intended, the other is not.”<St. Thomas Aquinas, STh II-II, 64, 7, corp. art>
2264 Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one’s own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow:
If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful… Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one’s own life than of another’s.<St. Thomas Aquinas, STh II-II, 64, 7, corp. art>
2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility.

And applied to nations:

2308 All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war.
However, “as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed.”<GS 79 # 4>
2309 The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
• there must be serious prospects of success;
• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. The power of modem means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.
  These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the “just war” doctrine.
  The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good.

 

[IsaiahSpirit]

Where you aware, analogous to a honed ‘camera guided’ trajectory slow acting multiple war head device, targeting the least; perceived by so many as ‘not useful’ or ‘not relevant enough’ or ‘not necessary’
that every 84 days, 10,080,000‬, close to or above TEN MILLION human beings are cruelly ‘eliminated’ world wide? Where is the Godly compassionate exhortation to be effective in all venues of society to help change laws and practices? yes, some do.(the population of Los Angeles county is about ten million.)
What about the peer pressures in education & other venues; becoming more authorized by legislation & adjudications against God given freedom of conscience & expression. What about the increase in laws forcing young and other impressionable to be taught playing at heart strings teachings justifying sins against The Laws of Nature?
All of these disordered things, given complacency by not helping to change laws & practices, with compassionate truth; only give self pleasure by intellectual ‘rightness’ to be complacent; with the ‘air of acceptability’ hurting the inner peace of so many of good will, who need an informed conscience. Jesus Christ said, Peace I give, not as the world gives, I give. Trying to form a ‘calmness’ by; (instead of creative compassionate asserting the needs of those around you); by fear of the feigned congeniality of ‘political correctness’ or the peer pressure to ‘shhh’ is not the Peace that Jesus Christ gives. This type of false ‘calmness’ masks so many have lack of inner peace; and this maintains the ‘air of acceptability or powerlessness’ which only enables the status quo of evil, or lets it grow worse.
Every venue, every level, every application of our society desperately need, ‘Seeds of The Word,’ in diligent prudent apropos ways of our historical time.
Heartfelt, prayers & well wishes.
Peace.

 

[undead_rat]

Nuclear armed ICBMs are not defensive weapons; they are retaliatory, and that is an important difference. A city wall or an anti-missile system would be defensive. The Church has condemned the MAD protocol as a “negative peace,” and has also condemned the vast arsenals of nuclear armed ICBMs.

However, almost no Christian churches have had the fortitude to take the unpopular step of advocating for unilateral nuclear disarmament. (A bunch of gut-less wonders, in my opinion.)
This is the real “hard issue” that is facing us, but as the title to this thread implies, no one wants to talk about it.

 

[IsaiahSpirit]

There are those advocating disarmament. But the ongoing mass murder is happening now.
This is not an extremely important relevant ‘real’ issue that deserves the effort that John Paul ii directed?
" Life, truth, love: words full of stimulating suggestions for human efforts in the world. They are rooted in the message of Jesus Christ, who is the Way, the Truth and the Life, but they are also impressed upon the hearts and yearnings of every man and woman."
" 3. The evidence shows with increasing clarity how policies and laws opposed to life are causing societies to decline, not only morally but demographically and economically. The Encyclical’s message can therefore be presented not only as true and authentic guidelines for moral rebirth, but also as a reference-point for civil salvation."
“The civil and moral conscience cannot accept this false inevitability, any more than the idea that war or interethnic extermination is inevitable.”
“No effort should be spared to eliminate legalized crime or at least to limit the damage caused by these laws, but with the vivid awareness of the radical duty to respect every human being’s right to life from conception until natural death, including the life of the lowliest and the least gifted.”
“Through joint educational activity in families and schools, efforts should be made so that these services become a “sign” and a message. Just as the community needs places of worship, it should sense the need to organize, especially at the diocesan level, educational and operational services to support human life, services that will be the fruit of charity and a sign of vitality.”
excerpts from: " ADDRESS OF THE HOLY FATHER JOHN PAUL II AT THE COMMEMORATION OF THE FIFTH ANNIVERSARY
OF THE ENCYCLICAL “EVANGELIUM VITAE”

Monday, 14 February 2000

 

[fide]

Undead_rat:

“Nuclear armed ICBMs are not defensive weapons; they are retaliatory, and that is an important difference. A city wall or an anti-missile system would be defensive. The Church has condemned the MAD protocol as a “negative peace,” and has also condemned the vast arsenals of nuclear armed ICBMs.”

Of course nuclear armed ICBMs are defensive. They are defensive precisely because they are retaliatory. The certain knowledge of, the threat of, lethal retaliation against an aggressor is a “wall” and “an anti-missile system” - and a defensive asset for a nation. If a thief - who preys on weakness and vulnerability - knows or strongly suspects that an elderly man leaving an ATM and walking alone down a dark street has a weapon on him and knows how to use it, will he not think long and hard and weigh the risks before making a move against the man?

Most thieves will tell you they would not take the chance, when there are many foolish people having no self-defense at all that they can easily and safely rob or abuse at will. Similarly, mass shootings happen almost always in “gun free” zones. Crime, at all levels, is enabled by imprudence.

 

[fide]

Any economic system (or ideology) that is separated from Truth - Jesus Christ - is already on the sure path to failure.

 

[undead_rat]

Of course nuclear armed ICBMs are defensive.

Sorry to disagree, but “retaliatory” (as you admit that these are) is different, and retaliation is condemned by YHWH’s Law. ICBMs do not defend against an attack. They only threaten retaliation if an attack occurs, and this protocol has been condemned by the Church as a “negative peace.”

Nuclear disarmament now a ‘moral imperative’ as Pope Francis rejects deterrence | America Magazine

 

[IsaiahSpirit]

Nuclear disarmament has always been a moral imperative.
But it should never occlude other active atrocities of mass destruction of human life.
Ambiguity with the urgent need of raising awareness keeps the status quo of this evil, or lets it grow worse. We have a participation in Christ moral imperative to be compassionately assertively proactive.

---

One’s own Godly work in prayer, words, and actions in all aspects of building a Godly culture of life & charity; helps increase a participation in Christ. John Paul ii taught & directed to form a sustained vast sign of life and charity in every part of The Church and society. (ref. "ADDRESS OF THE HOLY FATHER JOHN PAUL II, AT THE COMMEMORATION OF THE FIFTH ANNIVERSARY OF THE ENCYCLICAL “EVANGELIUM VITAE” Monday, 14 February 2000~). This included living up to diligently expressing a change in laws & practices to live up to Creeds that express Creator given inalienable self-evident truths in The Laws of Nature by Nature’s God as a form of asserting Benevolent Justice & Peace given by The Sovereignty of Jesus Christ. (ref. QUAS PRIMAS
, ENCYCLICAL OF POPE PIUS XI, ON THE FEAST OF CHRIST THE KING). Also, “In Pope Leo XIII’s time such a concept of the Church’s right and duty was far from being commonly admitted. Indeed, a two-fold approach prevailed: one directed to this world and this life, to which faith ought to remain extraneous; the other directed towards a purely other-worldly salvation, which neither enlightens nor directs existence on earth. The Pope’s approach in publishing Rerum novarum gave the Church “citizenship status” as it were, amid the changing realities of public life, and this standing would be more fully confirmed later on. In effect, to teach and to spread her social doctrine pertains to the Church’s evangelizing mission and is an essential part of the Christian message, since this doctrine points out the direct consequences of that message in the life of society and situates daily work and struggles for justice in the context of bearing witness to Christ the Saviour.” from “JOHN PAUL II
HOLY FATHER, « CENTESIMUS ANNUS » ENCYCLICAL LETTER TO HIS VENERABLE BROTHER BISHOPS, IN THE EPISCOPATE, THE PRIESTS AND DEACONS, FAMILIES OF MEN AND WOMEN RELIGIOUS, ALL THE CHRISTIAN FAITHFUL AND TO ALL MEN AND WOMEN OF GOOD WILL ON THE HUNDRETH ANNIVERSARY OF RERUM NOVARUM.”

 

[YourNameHere]

If any of you lacks wisdom, you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you.
James 1:5

 

[IsaiahSpirit]

Does this have wisdom:
(doesn’t good growth discernment of truth always known objectively to God, means letting Grace of Christ by His Power grow in humility?)
How can we obtain the Blessed Assurance, that God seeking Simon-Peter, Saul who became Paul, John The Apostle & many others? Well, I love take up your cross daily, renounce everything, seek ye first The Kingdom of God and all these things shall be added to you as well; and so many more. How can we sense cooperating with Grace? Peace grows in ‘inner disposition’ as the personal will, moves towards God’s Perfect Will. Evidenced by sincere heartfelt concern for others with a self giving attitude in thinking, praying, speaking, and action. Humility by nature gives greater sense of lessening ‘self aggrandizement’ for feelings of self worth within one’s ‘inner disposition’ giving impetus for motivations in thinking, praying, speaking, and action as partly ‘look at me & my ways’ mixed with ‘look at God & God’s Ways.’ A growth in a self-giving Godly ‘inner disposition’ can be discerned; and growth develops due diligence in cooperating with Jesus Christ seeking us. A growth in humility. Peace.

 

[fide]

Fortunately, the Church also recognizes that the entity that must make binding prudential decisions concerning the defense and preservation of a nation is the governing authority of that nation - and this is not the USCCB for America, nor the Vatican, nor the Pope. These ecclesial authorities do have the responsibility of clarifying as much as they can, the full situation in the light of Catholic moral principles - but the Church does not have the authority to presume to know what prudential decisions are best in the real situations and circumstances facing a given nation at a given time.

The Catechism:

2308 All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war.
However, “as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed.”<GS 79 # 4>

2309 The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
• there must be serious prospects of success;
• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. The power of modem means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.
  These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the “just war” doctrine.
  The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good.

 

[undead_rat]

• but the Church does not have the authority to presume to know what prudential decisions are best in the real situations and circumstances facing a given nation at a given time,

It is not a given that the USA’s nuclear arms contribute in any way to the safety of its citizens. The US government looks out for itself and its international power, not the basic long-term welfare of its citizens. We should have learned this from our government’s decision to go to war in Vietnam, a decision which benefited the citizens of neither country. Now the government’s propaganda is that the USA’s nuclear weapons serve to keep its citizens safe. That is the lie of the century, and it needs to be called out. The MAD protocol is inherently unstable. Eventually it will fail, and we will all pay the price.

As Pope Francis says, the MAD protocol is a fundamental contradiction of Christian values. We should rid ourselves of this evil. Our nuclear weapons forces do not keep us safe. Rather they just serve to make the USA a target for that historically friendly nation which has so much to fear from our deadly arsenal.

 

[Patagonia1]

So what would you have the US do? Completely disarm our nukes tomorrow? Think of the consequences of that action. Countries like China, Russia, Iran, and Pakistan would become the unhindered nuclear powers of the world.

You’re right, in that nuclear disarmament is the long term goal. I truly pray that it happens. But it will never happen unless every single country commits to disarming at the exact same time and actually follows through — an infinitely unlikely reality before the Second Coming of Christ in my opinion. He who owns the last nuke controls the world. Nuclear science cannot be unlearned.

Pandora’s box was going to be opened in WWII no matter what. Either the US was going to open it, or Germany, or Russia. Thank God that it was the US who got to it first.

 

[praytell]

At the parish I attend, we hear about the hard issues every now and then. The priests are not afraid to speak up when appropriate. As others have said, though, the homily is not intended to be a moment for soapboxing. It is intended to be a conversation from God to you through the readings via the preacher (priest or deacon).
I have heard some very poignant homilies that have blended the readings and hard issues well, and I have heard some ham-fisted attempts that have detracted from the liturgy of the Eucharist. There have been priests who have nicely framed the teachings of the Church into hot button topics and there have been some that I was disappointed to hear that Father felt this way.
It really is a double edged sword.
I would say though, if you are a man who is adamant about the low quality of the homilies you are hearing, there is a permanent diaconate that is waiting for you to help the cause.

 

[fide]

Well, if you know better than anyone in authority, become an authority. Run for office. Convince everyone of your understanding.

The world is racing toward the logical end of craziness - it is no surprise that you doubt the rationality of the world’s solutions to its problems. You would be crazy along with them if you did not. It is not rational to presume to know better than God, yet that irrationality is the foundation of the secular, godless City of Man. God is allowing us to see the inevitable end of the road that godlessness is on. If you look far enough into the future, you can see “it ain’t pretty.” The vocation of the Church is not to micromanage the secular (godless) world as it races toward destruction - it is to live and to preach and to teach the proper alternative, which is the culture of life, of goodness, of truth: the City of God.

The Church is sent to be light in the darkness - but she seems preoccupied with many other things.

 

[fide]

Pandora’s box was going to be opened in WWII no matter what. Either the US was going to open it, or Germany, or Russia. Thank God that it was the US who got to it first.

Yes, and many do thank God for that. He has blessed the U.S. greatly - and “to whom much is given, much is required.” Have we - the Church in the U.S. - seen and rightly responded to His gifts, and His graces, and the burden and the responsibility of all He has given us?

Or are we dozing like the apostles in the Garden, as Jesus prayed in agony, as the Cross drew nearer.

 

[undead_rat]

And the Russians look upon their own arsenal of ICBMs exactly in the same way that we here in the USA do: to prevent their country’s enslavement by another.

The Russian Orthodox Church may stop blessing nuclear weapons

Blessed be the bombs.

futurism.com

It’s all just so ridiculous: the USA will be enslaved by Russia if we disarm our nukes and visa-versa. What’s doesn’t seem to be understood is that a global nuclear war is predicted by holy scripture and that our only chance of avoiding this unprecedented catastrophe would be by following our Teacher’s holy instructions to love YHWH and to love our neighbors. We could do this as a nation if we all wanted to. But none of the religious here seem to think that this disarmament is a good idea.

 

[Patagonia1]

Again, what is your solution? And what do you think will happen if the US disarms?