Assurance of Salvation

[fbl9]

You are so right. We (Catholics) get pulled into this argument using the bible alone as our source evidence. And perhaps that is OK but eventually it boils down to Authority. If we can not be successful in this issue we will win none other. All the converts I have met, including me, eventually decided because of this issue- Authority .

Don’t forget re-verts like me. And that pesky fact that i ran up against too many things in scritpure that were catholic teachings

 

[David_Castlen]

Don’t forget re-verts like me. And that pesky fact that i ran up against too many things in scritpure that were catholic teachings

I do not mean to be a "smart-aleck, but all teaching in the bible is Catholic.

 

[fhansen]

… all teaching in the bible is Catholic.

Right-we’re not suggesting that the bible is even remotely at odds with Catholic teaching/Tradition. We’re maintaining that many of the various interpretations out there are at odds with both Scripture and Catholic Tradition, the two of which agree.

 

[David_Castlen]

Right-we’re not suggesting that the bible is even remotely at odds with Catholic teaching/Tradition. We’re maintaining that many of the various interpretations out there are at odds with both Scripture and Catholic Tradition, the two of which agree.

This is not a retorical question; I really want to know: Would it be wrong to say that in essence Scripture is (capitial T) Tradition? I understand that there are distinctively three sources of revelatioin; however, don’t they are imminate from (capital T) Tradition.

I think I am going off- subject and perhaps this should (out of respect for the rest of the participants) be addressed either privately or on another blog. Sorry

 

[fhansen]

This is not a retorical question; I really want to know: Would it be wrong to say that in essence Scripture is (capitial T) Tradition? I understand that there are distinctively three sources of revelatioin; however, don’t they are imminate from (capital T) Tradition.

I think I am going off- subject and perhaps this should (out of respect for the rest of the participants) be addressed either privately or on another blog. Sorry

I think it would be correct to say that Scripture is simply written Tradition. They both derive from the same source in any case-revelation-particularly the revelation of Jesus Christ of course.

 

[David_Castlen]

I think it would be correct to say that Scripture is simply written Tradition. They both derive from the same source in any case-revelation-particularly the revelation of Jesus Christ of course.

Thanks fhansen

 

[jcrichton]

This is not a retorical question; I really want to know: Would it be wrong to say that in essence Scripture is (capitial T) Tradition? I understand that there are distinctively three sources of revelatioin; however, don’t they are imminate from (capital T) Tradition.

I think I am going off- subject and perhaps this should (out of respect for the rest of the participants) be addressed either privately or on another blog. Sorry

…here’s St. Paul’s admonishions to the Thessalonians:

13 But we must always thank God for you, brothers whom the Lord loves, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the Spirit who makes us holy and by faith in the truth. 14 Through our gospel he called you to this so that you should claim as your own the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Stand firm, then, brothers, and keep the traditions that we taught you, whether by word of mouth or by letter. 16 May our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who has given us his love and, through his grace, such ceaseless encouragement and such sure hope, 17 encourage you and strengthen you in every good word and deed. (2 Thessalonians 2:13-17)

20 At the same time, we must recognise that the interpretation of scriptural prophecy is never a matter for the individual. 21 For no prophecy ever came from human initiative. When people spoke for God it was the Holy Spirit that moved them. (2 St. Peter 1:20-21)

16 He makes this point too in his letters as a whole wherever he touches on these things. In all his letters there are of course some passages which are hard to understand, and these are the ones that uneducated and unbalanced people distort, in the same way as they distort the rest of scripture–to their own destruction. (2 St. Peter 3:16)

…even as the Church was taking shape the Apostles understood that the Word of God was Inspired by the Holy Spirit and that both the Oral and Written form was Sacred Tradition.

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[Abu]

Scripture is inspired; Sacred Tradition is protected from error for by the assistance of the Holy Spirit, the Church, “the pillar and bulwark of the truth” (1Tim 3:15) is guaranteed against error in Her exposition of Tradition. Hence, Scripture must always be read and interpreted ‘in the Church’, not outside or against the Church; and Tradition must always be expounded in conformity with Scripture and never contrary to it.”
[See *Apologetics and Catholic Doctrine, Archbishop M Sheehan, revised Fr Peter Joseph, 2001, St Austin Press, p 150-251].

Vatican II’s Dei Verbum is precise:
“Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture make up a single sacred deposit of the Word of God, entrusted to the Church. (#10).

“By means of the same Tradition…the Sacred Scriptures themselves are more deeply understood and constantly made operative in the Church.” (#8).

 

[OldProf]

The persistent self-created quandary displayed is so blatantly self-deceiving because

1. The clarity on the loss of salvation by St Paul is ignored and the fable is concocted that Abu is pitted against St John because St Paul is irrefutable, and St John is misinterpreted by a fallible individual.

Guilty. I’m fallible. Do I ignore Paul? No, only in your imagination. You would never have said that if you knew me. So, you got that wrong. What else do you have wrong? Are the Scriptures important? You had better believe it. I know I do. Acts 17:11 says, “Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessalonica; they received the word with all eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so.” ESV. The Bereans are noble BECAUSE of their Scriptural diligence and they give us an excellent example follow. Scriptural authority – seems to be pretty important. So we take what the Scriptures say about our subject here, assurance, and we can know we have eternal life as he says in 1 John 5:13. A blessing to be sure. I won’t do St John the disrespect of correcting him on that.

1. The Sacred Scriptures are known only because Christ’s Catholic Church gave them to us as the Church is “the pillar and bulwark of the truth (1 Tim 3:16).” Only She can interpret the Sacred Scriptures – no self–interpretation can challenge Her.

The Scriptures do not have all that Christ taught us: “There are also many other things that Jesus did, but if these were to be described individually, I do not think the whole world would contain the books that would be written.” (Jn 21:25).

Yes, Christian believers, those indwelled by the Holy Spirit (John 14:23), Christ’s Church certainly did preserve the Bible and help us know what books are in the Bible. And St John in John 21:25 does tell us that Jesus’ ministry here was so wonderful, incredible and miraculous, that his own account reflects only a small portion of that ministry. In context, it is like a cup dipped in the ocean – that’s the context of John 21:25. Abu, are you engaging me on the authority of the church? Isn’t this thread about the assurance of salvation?

Would you deny St John, and St Paul too?
St. Paul says also, “through the Church the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places (Eph 3:10).” The Church teaches even the angels! This is with the authority of Christ! We are redeemed by Christ’s Passion and Death (heaven was opened); we are not saved until we co-operate with Him.

“Work out your own salvation in fear and trembling.” (Phil 2:12).

St Paul is very clear: “I fill up in my flesh what is still lacking in regard to Christ’s afflictions, for the sake of His Body which is the Church.” (Col. 1:24). What is lacking in Christ’s suffering is precisely what only we can do – take up our cross and suffer, repent and ask forgiveness, following the dictates of our conscience.

I won’t deny OR ignore them. You bet we should strive to love and honor our Lord. But if we sin, and we will, that doesn’t mean we go from being a sheep of Jesus (justified) to being a goat (state of sin, not grace) and headed for hell. If that were the case, we would not have the free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23, full context is 6:15-23). Maybe you want to correct Paul here? Abu to Paul: “St Paul, with all due respect, it’s really the free gift of the possibility of eternal life. Jesus did his part and we have to do ours and never commit a mortal sin which will send us to hell.” Admittedly I’m putting words in your mouth, Abu. How would you tell Paul that it is really only the possibility of eternal life?

To be continued…OldProf

 

[OldProf]

Continued…

Jesus redeemed us (opened Heaven), we have to play our part. If anyone was to be saved your way it would have been Paul! But he clearly showed the error of that: “But I chastise my body, and bring it into subjection lest perhaps, when I have preached to others, I myself should become a castaway.” (1Cor 9:27). And again: “Wherefore he who thinks that he stands, let him take heed lest he fall.” (1 Cor 10:12). Yet again, “And we exhort you not to receive the grace of God in vain.” (2 Cor 6:1).

What we do know from Scripture is the sheep NEVER perish. The sheep CAN lose rewards and even sin unto death. But we know that Jesus will not say to them, “I never knew you.” I’m looking at the context of the verses you’ve given. These are NOT about losing salvation. For those interested followers of this thread, go to biblegateway and look at the context.

Christians need to examine themselves, recognize the wonders of the free gift of eternal life, make righteous choices and repent of the unrighteous (sinful) ones – bottom line, we are to do good works. Why? Not to win heaven, which comes with eternal life, but to bring Jesus Christ the glory. Won’t a sheep follow and love his master? A “Christian” who lives for self and not doing the will of God is no Christian at all. Jesus will tell him, “I never knew you; depart from me you workers of lawlessness.” Matt 7:23 ESV They were never one of Jesus’ flock.

“It is not those who say to Me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the person who does the will of My Father in heaven.” (Mt 7:21).
When asked “What must I do to have eternal life?” Jesus answered, “Keep the commandments.” (Mt 19:16-17).

Can ANYONE keep the commandments? If you could, then Jesus would be unnecessary. You would be perfect and wouldn’t need a Savior. When a Christian sins, is he doing the will of the Father? No, but we do know Christians sin, yet Christian sinners end up in heaven. Thus, if a sinner is justified before God, he has the righteousness of Christ and becomes a testimony of the truth that salvation is of the Lord (Rom 8:30-those whom he justified he also glorified-past tense in the Greek indicates a done deal, Heb 5:9-his sheep obey, 12:2-God is author and finisher). Great news! The sheep go to heaven! O blessed assurance!

1. Christ wrote nothing but Christ gave us His Church and endowed Her with His Authority to teach His name – it is quite impossible for Her to each error for if She did Christ would not be Almighty God. The Spirit of Truth does not speak against Christ’s Church!
2. That Catholic Church founded by Christ precisely to teach His truths in His Name has told us what writings by Her members form the Word of the God – the Bible.
3. Any perceived contradictions with what She teaches and Her Sacred Scriptures teach are NOT contradictions but fallible perceptions in fallible minds.

Peter is the first Apostle to raise a person from the dead (Acts 9:36-4 1). Peter first received the revelation to admit Gentiles into the Church (Acts 10:9-16), and commanded that the first Gentile converts be baptized (Acts 10:44-48).

St. Clement died about 80 A.D., some 20 years before the last Apostle, St. John, died. Although St. John was still alive in Ephesus, which was much closer to Corinth than was Rome, the Corinthians appealed to the Bishop of Rome because he had the “keys” of authority. Pope Clement wrote to the Church at Corinth: “You, there who laid the foundation of the rebellion, submit to the presbyters and be chastened to repentance, bending your knees in a spirit of humility.” (First Letter To The Corinthians, 57, 1; Jurgens, p. 12.)

Clearly you want to change the subject to the church, which is a BIG subject worthy of examination. I choose to stick to the subject thread – assurance of salvation.

The RCC tells me in their documents that a person can be justified, which means they can become a sheep of Jesus, be in the “state of grace”, and then they can commit a mortal sin which puts them in a “state of sin” which means they have lost their salvation (spiritual death). That makes eternal life a questionable term (it is used a lot, but what exactly does it mean?), cannot give any solid basis for the assurance of salvation, and provides a distinct problem with St Paul’s clear teaching that, “All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.” 2 Tim 3:16-17 ESV. What do the Scriptures say about the assurance of salvation?

“For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.” 1 Cor 14:33 KJV. I think that is the case, so let’s nail down what Scripture teaches about the assurance of salvation. That is my goal – what subject is more worthy than salvation? If my understanding is incorrect, I want to know. Then if someone like Oumashta asks me, as she chews on popcorn , I can demonstrate what God’s Word says.

Sincerely, OldProf

 

[fhansen]

Regarding the topic of the OP, all of this simply means one thing-God alone rescues us, but as Augustine said, He won’t violate our wills to do so. He didn’t force Adam & Eve to obey-and He won’t force us to obey now. We can turn to him, follow for awhile, and, like rocky ground where the seed doesn’t take hold, we can turn away again.

The very purpose of this life-of this whole messy world where good and evil are actually known, and revelation and grace are added to the mix, is so that our wills will be involved-that’s the wild card, not God; He desires that we’ll turn from the pigsty like the Prodigal and run to the open arms of the Father. But we don’t have to-and we can always return to the pigsty-and people do. We don’t have to finally reverse the decision, within ourselves. that Adam & Eve made to reject the wisdom and authority and goodness of God.

And until we finally persevere, we won’t know for certain that we were one of the ones who would finally persevere.

 

[Jerry-Jet]

There is no assurance for those in a state of mortal sin. That is why St. Paul inspired by the Holy Spirit who is God said “WORK out your salvation with FEAR and TREMBLING.”

The appeal of assurance is that one doesn’t have to do what St. Paul told them to do. they don’t have to "work out their salvation with fear and trembling.

Jesus Christ did not suffer on the cross so worthless DEPRAVED sheep would have His brand on them and enter heaven UNHOLY!

He suffered and died so that they might be transformed into holiness and abide with Him on a CONTINUAL basis.

Salvation isn’t about the brand of conversion that discretely stops at that point.

It is about a CONTINUAL journey to holiness and perfection.

That journey can not be accomplished by works of man or by “works of the law” but it IS surely accomplished by a soul CONTINUING to LET God work grace in him.

Mortal sin ENDS that continuation. Repentance restarts it.

Dying UNREPENTENT in a stat of mortal sin means Hell!

Doesn’t that make you “fear and tremble” as St. Paul says?

It sure does make me “fear and tremble”!

But that is only PART of the truth.

The other side of the coin is that God gives us many graces through the sacraments that do help us on that CONTINUAL journey towards holiness and perfection.

God does ALL: the saving through grace–as we do all the COOPERATING with Him through the act of our FREE WILL!

Now while Catholics don’t have ASSURANCE like the once saved always saved CLAIN to have–they do have a moral certainty that as long as they continue in the state of grace–they have no need to FEAR.

In other words Catholics in a state of grace BOTH Fear losing salvation on the one hand–by on the other hand KNOW that God provides them with grace through the sacraments–AS well as prayer that will result in them going to heaven.

Catholics believe in the Divine Mercy of God.

Catholics belie in the Good sheperd that goes to find the one lost sheep. Catholics believe Jesus when He says in John that the devil cannot “SNATCH” them out of His hand.

But Catholics also know that Jesus WILL let His followers LEAVE Him if that is what they want.

And it IS possible for that to happen.

The followers of Jesus who LEFT Him in John 6:66 are the spiritual fathers of Protestants who have heard and know the truth of the Eucharist–KNOW that it really IS Jesus’ body and blood–and yet still REFUSE to believe!

They don’t DISCERN the body being there in the sacrament as St. Paul says that one must and heap condemnation on themselves.

But they aren’t the only ones–there are many Catholics who support abortion and approach the sacrament in a state of MORTAL sin and committ SACRILEDGE.

And I challenge ANY Protestant to GO to a Catholic church–listen to a few homilies–I tell you I hear about Jesus’ mercy much more than His justice!

Try it! Go and See!

 

[teeboy]

No one can be sure that they are saved.

Even if one dies spiritually or is raised, he can’t be sure he is saved.

I think of the Hail Mary: “pray for us sinners, now, and at the hour of hour death”. Staying in the Grace of God as a mortal is a lifelong ordeal.

The best way to stay in grace is to “act”. Personal prayer is an act; going to mass is an act, contrition requires acts.

 

[Abu]

OldProf #130
we do know Christians sin, yet Christian sinners end up in heaven

You’ve destroyed your assumption of “assurance of salvation” many times over, by totally disregarding Christ when He founded only His Church with St Peter as His Supreme Vicar.

You don’t have His sacrament of Reconciliation which Christ instituted in His Church for the very purpose of forgiving sin, but chose to ridicule Christ when, after He confirmed “I and the Father are one.” (Jn 10:30), He commanded: “As the father has sent Me, so I am sending you….For those whose sins you forgive, they are forgiven; for those whose sins you retain, they are retained.” (Jn 20: 21-23).

What a farce if we don’t need to seriously heed Christ’s commands and His great love!

Not only that, but his Church recognises and teaches the possibility of salvation for even those not knowing His Church:
Pope St Clement knew that non-Catholics could be saved from the beginning, for he wrote in about 95 A.D. to the Church in Corinth: “Those who repented for their sins, appeased God in praying and received salvation, even though they were aliens to God.” Catholic Apologetics Today, 1986, Fr William G Most, p 145]."

 

[fbl9]

Continued…

What we do know from Scripture is the sheep NEVER perish. The sheep CAN lose rewards and even sin unto death. But we know that Jesus will not say to them, “I never knew you.” I’m looking at the context of the verses you’ve given. These are NOT about losing salvation. For those interested followers of this thread, go to biblegateway and look at the context.

 

[OldProf]

This highlights some differences in our beliefs-and what I consider an over-confidence in ones faith, and an under-confidence in the role free will plays-to an even greater degree. IMO, the Mormon in your example may be closer to God and heaven, due to the way he’s lived his life, than the one who claims to have a superior faith (the Mormon also believes his faith to be superior, BTW). None of us have a perfect grasp on the nature and will of God; the fact that anyone humbles themselves before a Reality greater than themselves, acknowledging that said Reality is the font of goodness and love, and lives his life accordingly, speaks volumes for his faith and love-and therefore his just standing- and this in no way is meant to sanction the many ways we consider Mormonism to be off-based.

clip…

fhansen, I didn’t get to this earlier, but want to comment on it. You don’t mention Hemingway. As an outspoken atheist and self-murderer, we don’t really think he died in a state of grace, do we?

As I make my next argument, please take the time to check my verse references.

Now to the Mormon UVA professor. We’re talking about a good man, by the standards of society, but a sinner according to Paul (clearly from Rom 3:9-31, see ESV at biblegateway). What does this man have going for him? He is a man who doesn’t seek the truth (Jer 29:13; Matt 7:7-8; John 8:31-32; Heb 11:6), who believes in a false god (Mormons have a pantheon of gods in their eternal progression, once men but they attain godhead and become gods of planets. Men and women actually have the potential of becoming gods. President Lorenzo Snow said, “As god once was, man is. As God is, man may become.” They have this one god who fathers Jesus, which means Jesus is a created being, and he has a brother, Lucifer – yes, same one in the Bible – and Jesus is born because Adam, his father (can you believe it???), impregnates Mary through physical sex (the Adam-God doctrine taught by Brigham Young, part of a very controversial history) with her to have Jesus born as a human, and on and on, false teaching one after another. And 3 more Mormon “scriptures” to add even more inaccuracy and self-contradictions.) which is idolatry as stated, and a man who fully depends on his own good works (Titus 3:5) to earn his salvation. So you think he may be a sheep of Jesus, drawn by the Father (John 6:37-40; John 10-Jew and Gentile believers become the sheep)?

John the Baptist said, “He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:36 KJV. The “Son” this man believes in doesn’t even exist. It is Scriptural that the wrath of God abides on this UVA emeritus professor of engineering and local Mormon leader.

I had the good sense to be obedient to God’s commands and “earnestly contend” (Jude 3) with him about truth and faith in one and only one true God, manifested in three persons, with Christ as Creator/Sustainer, Lord and Savior. Plenty of KJV verses (the KJV Bible is one of their sacred Scriptures) to demonstrate that. Sadly his false assurance held sway and he never had any desire study what the Bible clearly taught. I haven’t seen him in over 10 years.

Why do Mormons review the Bible with skepticism? Their Article of Faith #8 says, “We Believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.” First of all, they think that early on the Roman Catholic Church damaged the Bible manuscripts (see 1 Nephi 13:26-28). Second, they only rely on the interpretation of their prophets and apostles. The Encyclopedia of Mormonism is online and has an article, “Scripture, Interpretation Within Scripture.” Yes, they do say that Scripture interprets Scripture, however, this statement clarifies their authority, “The additional scriptures that Latter-day Saints accept-the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price-also cite and interpret the Bible. In fact, many of the clearest explications of doctrine arise from modern revelations or restored scripture.”

So, dealing with these people, with this level of false teaching, my plan was to pray and act. I had to develop a relationship, understand as well as I could their “doctrinal truths,” and then, with the common ground of the KJV Bible, provide a biblical framework. I’m convinced by Scripture and prayer that we are to engage and challenge false teachers, and it is biblical authority that commands and equips us to do just that. What would you have me do, fhansen? Nothing? Leave them alone? Does that bring glory to God to simply let them go unchallenged in their evangelistic crusades to spread their errors about Jesus Christ?

Sincerely, OldProf

 

[OldProf]

Regarding the topic of the OP, all of this simply means one thing-God alone rescues us, but as Augustine said, He won’t violate our wills to do so. He didn’t force Adam & Eve to obey-and He won’t force us to obey now. We can turn to him, follow for awhile, and, like rocky ground where the seed doesn’t take hold, we can turn away again.

The very purpose of this life-of this whole messy world where good and evil are actually known, and revelation and grace are added to the mix, is so that our wills will be involved-that’s the wild card, not God; He desires that we’ll turn from the pigsty like the Prodigal and run to the open arms of the Father. But we don’t have to-and we can always return to the pigsty-and people do. We don’t have to finally reverse the decision, within ourselves. that Adam & Eve made to reject the wisdom and authority and goodness of God.

And until we finally persevere, we won’t know for certain that we were one of the ones who would finally persevere.

Well, to belabor the point, the natural man neither seeks God or does anything righteous (Rom 3:9-27). How is it they have ANY ability to do what you say? If they are dead in trespasses and sin (Eph 2:1), how do the dead have this ability? If God by grace gives them faith (Eph 2:8-9), then yes, they can please God (Heb 11:6) and receive free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23). Do they have eternal life, or just the possibility of eternal life?

Please answer.

Sincerely, OldProf

 

[OldProf]

No one can be sure that they are saved.

Even if one dies spiritually or is raised, he can’t be sure he is saved.

I think of the Hail Mary: “pray for us sinners, now, and at the hour of hour death”. Staying in the Grace of God as a mortal is a lifelong ordeal.

The best way to stay in grace is to “act”. Personal prayer is an act; going to mass is an act, contrition requires acts.

teeboy, I believe action in the form of good works that bring God the Glory is an evidence that a person is a Christian. I stated that earlier. When one has faith as a gift from God (Eph 2:8-10), then they have passed from death to life (John 5:24), have received the free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23), and the become a sheep of Jesus who will never perish (John 6:37-40, John 10:28). St John says we can know we have eternal life (1 John 5:13). Why do you say we can’t have assurance?

Sincerely, OldProf

 

[fhansen]

I had the good sense to be obedient to God’s commands and “earnestly contend” (Jude 3) with him about truth and faith in one and only one true God, manifested in three persons, with Christ as Creator/Sustainer, Lord and Savior. Plenty of KJV verses (the KJV Bible is one of their sacred Scriptures) to demonstrate that. Sadly his false assurance held sway and he never had any desire study what the Bible clearly taught. I haven’t seen him in over 10 years.

This is purely subjective. You believe your sense was good, so did the Mormon. And the bible isn’t clear at all about the Trinity. That is a Traditional teaching and undertaking of the Church.

So, dealing with these people, with this level of false teaching, my plan was to pray and act. I had to develop a relationship, understand as well as I could their “doctrinal truths,” and then, with the common ground of the KJV Bible, provide a biblical framework. I’m convinced by Scripture and prayer that we are to engage and challenge false teachers, and it is biblical authority that commands and equips us to do just that. What would you have me do, fhansen? Nothing? Leave them alone? Does that bring glory to God to simply let them go unchallenged in their evangelistic crusades to spread their errors about Jesus Christ?

I don’t expect you to leave them alone-but I expect that you might overlook some dumb theology of theirs and see what’s really happening inside-faith to the degree they can with the understanding that they have.

 

[fhansen]

Well, to belabor the point, the natural man neither seeks God or does anything righteous (Rom 3:9-27). How is it they have ANY ability to do what you say? If they are dead in trespasses and sin (Eph 2:1), how do the dead have this ability? If God by grace gives them faith (Eph 2:8-9), then yes, they can please God (Heb 11:6) and receive free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23). Do they have eternal life, or just the possibility of eternal life?

Please answer.

Sincerely, OldProf

Possibility of eternal life-that’s all any of us have except that it becomes a very high probability as we prove ourselves to be good soil. We can’t do it without grace and yet grace can be resisted.