atheism

[rinnie]

So there’s something in the universe that god didn’t create? hmmmm

Yep its called Sin. God allows it but never created it. Actually he hates it.

 

[JordanSRT]

Now that I would call an insult. That is insulting us for believing in God and our faith. Saying we are blind. Just because we used our free will and choose to follow Christ and because with our faith we don’t need science to prove anything.

But yes I will turn the other cheek because our loving Lord tells us to. But Jordan this was not in response to what you said, I responded for another obvious reason.

I wasn’t aware this was a closed forum. And, christians came up with the concept of blind faith. I was just using it to make a point.

 

[theistgal]

Ok. I don’t understand why you are mad at me anyway we are on the same side. But I would never insult anyone on purpose. I just disagree with the quotes that he had, and told him its not him its the quotes I just disagree with. I don’t think thats insulting anyone.

I’m not mad at you. I don’t know you well enough to be mad at you.

That’s my point: too many times in these forums people just make blanket statements condemning or insulting entire groups of people simply because those people don’t agree with them about some point of doctrine.

Stereotyping is a sign of laziness. (And no, I’m not saying you are lazy! Just all those other people who stereotype others. )

 

[rinnie]

I wasn’t aware this was a closed forum. And, christians came up with the concept of blind faith. I was just using it to make a point.

Sorry Jordan Blind faith is not what you said though, you said blinded by faith. Big difference!

 

[rinnie]

I’m not mad at you. I don’t know you well enough to be mad at you.

That’s my point: too many times in these forums people just make blanket statements condemning or insulting entire groups of people simply because those people don’t agree with them about some point of doctrine.

Stereotyping is a sign of laziness. (And no, I’m not saying you are lazy! Just all those other people who stereotype others. )

I understand, I do my best to try to make my point and show that I would never try to do that. But there are times that when you disagree its hard to come to a gentle understanding. But usually it works out pretty well for me.

But you have to admit different points in doctrine and denying God. well thats a whole different thing. I mean lets face it. THe point is this.

We want everyone to go to heaven. You cannot do that and deny God. I don’t care who get’s mad at me its a fact. I would rather have some one hate me for telling them the truth then to love me for not telling them the truth. And according to the word of God you must believe. You catch my drift? When’s the last time you heard that one. Im showing my age.

 

[rinnie]

I’m not mad at you. I don’t know you well enough to be mad at you.

That’s my point: too many times in these forums people just make blanket statements condemning or insulting entire groups of people simply because those people don’t agree with them about some point of doctrine.

Stereotyping is a sign of laziness. (And no, I’m not saying you are lazy! Just all those other people who stereotype others. )

Then again stick around, I have been put on a ignore list once or twice.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Glad you stepped into the thread Theistgal.

Rinnie, you would expect God to want people to love him and believe in him right? Not fear hell? I know that the catholic church teaches its okay to obey God out of fear of hell, but that to love him without that fear is superior. But, that God accepts both ways to him.

Some people take time examining things. not everyone was given the “graces” you may have been given. Be patient.

 

[rinnie]

Glad you stepped into the thread Theistgal.

Rinnie, you would expect God to want people to love him and believe in him right? Not fear hell? I know that the catholic church teaches its okay to obey God out of fear of hell, but that to love him without that fear is superior. But, that God accepts both ways to him.

Some people take time examining things. not everyone was given the “graces” you may have been given. Be patient.

But Hey SJ heres the thing. What did St Paul say work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Yes I want them to fear HELL.

HELL YEAH!

I want them to know what everlasting suffering is. And I don’t want them to have it. I know I cannot change their lives I don’t have the Power. But I aint gonna sugar coat it either.

You deny God you are accepting the Devil he won! Case closed!

HELL IS REAL. JESUS CHRIST DIED ON THE CROSS FOR OUR SINS, REPENT AND BE SAVED.

I am not holy roller. I like to live, I have sins, But I Believe. I confess and try to do the best I can. Why Because I accept the teaching. I will never force it on anyone. But I will tell the Truth So help Me God. ANd the truth is this. If you reject the word that is spoken you are getting it. Im sorry It is what it is!

 

[StrawberryJam]

But Hey SJ heres the thing. What did St Paul say work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Yes I want them to fear HELL.

HELL YEAH!

I want them to know what everlasting suffering is. And I don’t want them to have it. I know I cannot change their lives I don’t have the Power. But I aint gonna sugar coat it either.

You deny God you are accepting the Devil he won! Case closed!

HELL IS REAL. JESUS CHRIST DIED ON THE CROSS FOR OUR SINS, REPENT AND BE SAVED.

I am not holy roller. I like to live, I have sins, But I Believe. I confess and try to do the best I can. Why Because I accept the teaching. I will never force it on anyone. But I will tell the Truth So help Me God. ANd the truth is this. If you reject the word that is spoken you are getting it. Im sorry It is what it is!

Okay. I understand about the teaching of hell. Let’s talk about something you like to talk about in your faith, if you don’t mind sharing it with us. I have been to many masses now, and spent time here so you won’t be confusing me if you refer to things in the mass, I don’t think anyway.

 

[rinnie]

Glad you stepped into the thread Theistgal.

Rinnie, you would expect God to want people to love him and believe in him right? Not fear hell? I know that the catholic church teaches its okay to obey God out of fear of hell, but that to love him without that fear is superior. But, that God accepts both ways to him.

Some people take time examining things. not everyone was given the “graces” you may have been given. Be patient.

How much time SJ. Time is short. Don’t take time. Please all of your people who reject God, get moving on it. Please go to him, I want you to have eternal Life. Forgive me But I do.

And I do want you to FEAR HELL. ITs the devil who does not want you to, not me or God.

And you BETTER FEAR GOD. You steal, kill, hurt little kids you better fear God because you are getting it. Don’t think for a minute you can do this and then at the end of your life see God and say OH YOU DO EXIST I am sorry. It don’t work that way.

I want you to be afraid. Whatever it takes to get you into heaven. Hate me I don’t care. Throw me off this site. But I am telling you people the truth so help me God.

 

[rinnie]

Okay. I understand about the teaching of hell. Let’s talk about something you like to talk about in your faith, if you don’t mind sharing it with us. I have been to many masses now, and spent time here so you won’t be confusing me if you refer to things in the mass, I don’t think anyway.

Go for it SJ what do you want me to answer you about mass? I will do my best to answer you.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Go for it SJ what do you want me to answer you about mass? I will do my best to answer you.

I don’t have questions per say, but wondered what it is that you feel most strongly about your faith, I only mentioned the mass because I find that is interesting to me. I know there are many other aspects of the catholic faith that some people feel very strongly about, and that is what they share with others.

Anyway, I am glad you are talking to me about this and we can move past the hell topic just for now. Let’s table it for later. Not saying I am dismissing it mind you, just tabling it for now.

 

[rinnie]

I don’t have questions per say, but wondered what it is that you feel most strongly about your faith, I only mentioned the mass because I find that is interesting to me. I know there are many other aspects of the catholic faith that some people feel very strongly about, and that is what they share with others.

Anyway, I am glad you are talking to me about this and we can move past the hell topic just for now. Let’s table it for later. Not saying I am dismissing it mind you, just tabling it for now.

But honestly SJ why would you want to do that. Table Hell for now? I mean is that not the core of this thread. Heaven and hell. Good and evil. God and the devil. And denial of it all?

We know hell exists. Jesus Christ told is so. We know evil exists just look around. We know good exists again just look around. And we know heaven exist’s because again Jesus told us so. Some people say this is hell. No it aint! How do I know? easy. Hell is total separaton from God. See we receive him every day in the Eucharist, thats not total separation from God. That total unity with God. But heaven is when there will be no evil. Thats why this is not heaven. Evil will be wiped out in heaven.

I mean why not put the cards on the table and tell it like it is. Not the way we think it is. But the way Jesus Christ said it is?

 

[StrawberryJam]

But honestly SJ why would you want to do that. Table Hell for now? I mean is that not the core of this thread. Heaven and hell. Good and evil. God and the devil. And denial of it all?

We know hell exists. Jesus Christ told is so. We know evil exists just look around. We know good exists again just look around. And we know heaven exist’s because again Jesus told us so. Some people say this is hell. No it aint! How do I know? easy. Hell is total separaton from God. See we receive him every day in the Eucharist, thats not total separation from God. That total unity with God. But heaven is when there will be no evil. Thats why this is not heaven. Evil will be wiped out in heaven.

I mean why not put the cards on the table and tell it like it is. Not the way we think it is. But the way Jesus Christ said it is?

Okay Rinnie,

I just tried to find out what drives you. If it is hope that people like me will be in hell, well I guess I got my answer then.

 

[rinnie]

Okay Rinnie,

I just tried to find out what drives you. If it is hope that people like me will be in hell, well I guess I got my answer then.

How could me not wanting to talk about why I love my faith, and refuse to accept that hell exists be hope that people like you will be in hell. That don’t make sense my love. I would never want anyone to go to hell. My reasons for Loving my faith is not the question. It heaven and hell being real and they are.

 

[j1akey]

rinnie:

j1akey:

Well there’s always the story of Job where God allowed Satan to destroy everything he loved just to prove a point.

Yep you just said it he allowed Satan to destroy everything because he did not believe that Job would hold on to his faith and God. But God said you can do what you want just not take away his free will. But God did not create evil but allows it. ANd look a greater good just like I said. Job choose God over evil, and ended up on top. And he also by choosing God no matter what got eternal Life.

OK, I’d like to examine this a bit more in that case. I’m no biblical schollar but this is my arguement on this (considering it ever happened in the first place). Fistly, I’m not sure how allowing Satan to kill off the guys family to prove a point serves any kind of greater good. Second, isn’t allowing someone to be murdered and doing nothing a sin? (And you can’t say the lord works in mysterious ways because that’s a non answer.) Now as far as I know the bible says “Thow shall not kill/murder” or something to that effect? Isn’t allowing a murder to happen just to see what happens in itself a sin?

Basically the guys family died because of a bet as far as I can tell and honestly that seems pretty sinful.

 

[StrawberryJam]

How could me not wanting to talk about why I love my faith, and refuse to accept that hell exists be hope that people like you will be in hell. That don’t make sense my love. I would never want anyone to go to hell. My reasons for Loving my faith is not the question. It heaven and hell being real and they are.

I still dont even know why you love your faith. But, I told you I am very acutely aware about what the catholic church teaches on hell. That is why I said, can we table it?

I wont be one who is a believer for fear of hell. Lets get that straight right now.

 

[rinnie]

OK, I’d like to examine this a bit more in that case. I’m no biblical schollar but this is my arguement on this (considering it ever happened in the first place). Fistly, I’m not sure how allowing Satan to kill off the guys family to prove a point serves any kind of greater good. Second, isn’t allowing someone to be murdered and doing nothing a sin? (And you can’t say the lord works in mysterious ways because that’s a non answer.) Now as far as I know the bible says “Thow shall not kill/murder” or something to that effect? Isn’t allowing a murder to happen just to see what happens in itself a sin?

Basically the guys family died because of a bet as far as I can tell and honestly that seems pretty sinful.

first of all who said satan didn’t sin? Secondly would not understanding that God knows all and although does not create evil allows evil can bring good out of it have to do with God not creating evil? Gotta roll. be back tommorow. You answer my questions, will check back tommorow, and I got an eye opening answer for You.

 

[rinnie]

I still dont even know why you love your faith. But, I told you I am very acutely aware about what the catholic church teaches on hell. That is why I said, can we table it?

I wont be one who is a believer for fear of hell. Lets get that straight right now.

Get back to you tommorow too. I promise.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Get back to you tommorow too. I promise.

Tomorrow, next week. I have lots of time I hope.

LOL! ? Seriously, no rush on my end here. Thanks for continuing to explain your views.

Anyway, you can also PM me if you like Rinnie. I may not see your post, so I will look forward to our next exchange at your most convenient time.

Peace,

Liz