Background checks in Boston Archdiocese!

[Kevin_Walker]

Scott_Lafrance:

I can agree with your conclusion, even if I disagree with the premise that it is built on. Allowing men who struggle with the vice of homosexual attraction to be priests is akin to inviting recovering alcoholics to be bartenders. The main issue I have is that homosexuality is any worse of an evil than anything else that offends God, such as fornication, adultery, murder, stealing, bearing false witness, or worst of the worst, blasphamy.

I believe you are minimilizing the nature of homosexuality and have commited a ‘category mistake’ by comparing homosexuality with adultery, murder, stealing, bearing false witness, blasphemy, etc…

Homosexuality is , in and of itself, a mental health disorder.

Even a chaste homosexual is still irrational by their very nature of being a homosexual; homosexuals are incapable of clarity of thought and emotional stability - why do you think the federal government won’t allow them access to sensitive agencies or departments? To avoid a fiasco such as the Catholic Church is now enjoying because of its tolerance towards homosexuals who infiltrated the Priesthood.

 

[Kevin_Walker]

Scout:

Well, Kevin, I’m sure in your self-righteous, homophobic mind they are the same. But here in the real world intelligent people can see the difference.

Scout

Well, Scout, in your heterophobic defense of homosexuality, the emotionally stable and clear thinking can see right through all the fallacies of your argument that pedophilia is not a subset of homosexuality (in light of the fact that no heterosexual male will ever have sex with another male regardless of age, which is purely a homosexual act).

 

[puzzleannie]

Psychological testing would be great if a)these tests had a proven track record of identifying personality and psychological disorders and b)the people designing, administering, interpreting and making recommendations based on the tests were someone other than psychologists, the same people whose national professional organization decades ago ceased to define homosexuality as a disorder, and are on their way, under strong lobbying from the gay activists including and especialy NAMBLA, to reclassifying pedophilia in the same way, as a life-style choice rather than as a grave disorder.

most seminaries already have psychological testing in place, and they use it to weed out candidates judged to be “homophobic” or too orthodox.

 

[fix]

puzzleannie:

Psychological testing would be great if a)these tests had a proven track record of identifying personality and psychological disorders and b)the people designing, administering, interpreting and making recommendations based on the tests were someone other than psychologists, the same people whose national professional organization decades ago ceased to define homosexuality as a disorder, and are on their way, under strong lobbying from the gay activists including and especialy NAMBLA, to reclassifying pedophilia in the same way, as a life-style choice rather than as a grave disorder.

most seminaries already have psychological testing in place, and they use it to weed out candidates judged to be “homophobic” or too orthodox.

amen

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

fix:

amen

I agree. Most people who want to be in positions of authority know how to beat these tests anyway. It isn’t hard, I can take these tests to have them show whatever I want them to show. I’ve taken the MMPI several times and was able to contour the outcome to what I wanted it to say. Sociopaths are even better at it, that is why they are so hard to identify, they can mimic just about anything.

 

[gilliam]

OH YES THEY ARE!

do you have any studies to back up this claim?

 

[Scout]

Kevin Walker:

Well, Scout, in your heterophobic defense of homosexuality, the emotionally stable and clear thinking can see right through all the fallacies of your argument that pedophilia is not a subset of homosexuality (in light of the fact that no heterosexual male will ever have sex with another male regardless of age, which is purely a homosexual act).

“heterophobic”? What the heck does that mean?

All I’m saying is that not all homosexuals are potential pedophiles. It’s not the same disorder. Is this so hard to understand? Don’t make blanket statements about a group of people that you really know nothing about. By your account, all lesbians would be potential child-abusers of girls, too. And what about bi-sexuals? Should they just not be allowed to be around children at all? There’s no logic in your argument. Perhaps we should just lock all of them in prison and not let them around anybody.

Scout :tiphat:

 

[Kevin_Walker]

Scott_Lafrance:

I agree. Most people who want to be in positions of authority know how to beat these tests anyway. It isn’t hard, I can take these tests to have them show whatever I want them to show. I’ve taken the MMPI several times and was able to contour the outcome to what I wanted it to say. Sociopaths are even better at it, that is why they are so hard to identify, they can mimic just about anything.

It is true that you can ‘beat’ a single psych test like the Minnesota Multi-phasic Personality Inventory or the Wais Adult Intelligent Scale; but you cannot beat a battery of several or more exams. No single psych test is all encompassing, so you give a battery of tests which cover the full psychological spectrum, and that is hard to beat!

I have a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts, and have taken several psych exams in the course of occupations (my C.I.A. psych test was five hours long + an interview with a clinical psychologist), and those tests are very probing, you are not going to beat them.

 

[Scott_Lafrance]

Kevin Walker:

It is true that you can ‘beat’ a single psych test like the Minnesota Multi-phasic Personality Inventory or the Wais Adult Intelligent Scale; but you cannot beat a battery of several or more exams. No single psych test is all encompassing, so you give a battery of tests which cover the full psychological spectrum, and that is hard to beat!

I have a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts, and have taken several psych exams in the course of occupations (my C.I.A. psych test was five hours long + an interview with a clinical psychologist), and those tests are very probing, you are not going to beat them.

I am sure you’ll agree that the Catholic Church is no going to screen every potential seminarian like we screen potential CIA employees.

 

[Kevin_Walker]

puzzleannie:

most seminaries already have psychological testing in place, and they use it to weed out candidates judged to be “homophobic” or too orthodox.

What a shame, they weeded out the wrong archetype. Also, a generalized psych test, like they give to job applicants down in Florida, are weak and absolutely not all encompassing.

Just like the Federal Government does for its security clearances, you give a ‘battery’ of several psych tests or more, plus an interview with a clinical psychologist and no one is going to beat that procedure, it will weed out the undesirables.

 

[Kevin_Walker]

Scott_Lafrance:

I am sure you’ll agree that the Catholic Church is no going to screen every potential seminarian like we screen potential CIA employees.

So the Catholic Church would rather tolerate a sex abuse scandal once every new generation than use psych exams to help ensure the quality of its Priesthood?

 

[Kevin_Walker]

“heterophobic”? What the heck does that mean?

And what exactly does “homophobic” mean A fear of homo sapiens? Since ‘homo’ is supposed to be a perjorative term for homosexual.

You see, I have just as many neologisms as the homosexual activists and their liberal lackeys.

 

[4_marks]

“The Archdiocese of Boston is running annual criminal background checks on more than 60-thousand priests, employees and volunteers to prevent sexual abuse.”

“Boston Archdiocese checks Background”

wlbz2.com/home/article.asp?id=20313

Well, its a start in the right direction. But I feel they should include psychological tests, like they do for Top Secret security clearances, to screen out all homosexuals who insipidly try to infiltrate back into the Church.

A battery of psychological tests have been given to all who present themselves as potential seminarians in the Archdiocese of Boston for many years. CORI clearances and background checks have also been administered regularly for at least fifteen years.

 

[katherine2]

puzzleannie:

Psychological testing would be great if a)these tests had a proven track record of identifying personality and psychological disorders…

most seminaries already have psychological testing in place, and they use it to weed out candidates judged to be “homophobic” or too orthodox.

Half right. Actually, this is the reason so many conservatives oppose these tests. All the test which supposedly test for homosexuality rarely detect a gay many with no discomfort over his orientation but frequently do give a “false positive” for a certain type of rigid, introverted personality type that are disporportianly self proclaimed “orthodox”.

the people designing, administering, interpreting and making recommendations based on the tests were someone other than psychologists, the same people whose national professional organization decades ago ceased to define homosexuality as a disorder, and are on their way, under strong lobbying from the gay activists including and especialy NAMBLA, to reclassifying pedophilia in the same way, as a life-style choice rather than as a grave disorder.

Do you have the smallest iota of evidence that a NAMBLA representative ever has had even a single lobbying meeting with any official of the APA or did you just that up out of whole cloth? Is honesty even a small part of your position?

 

[Kevin_Walker]

4 marks:

A battery of psychological tests have been given to all who present themselves as potential seminarians in the Archdiocese of Boston for many years. CORI clearances and background checks have also been administered regularly for at least fifteen years.

A CORI check is given to just about anybody nowadays, especially school teachers. And I am not aware of a ‘battery’ of psych tests given to potential Seminarian candidates, at least not to my pals who are now studying at St. John’s Seminary in Brighton.

A criminal background check is not going to discover a homosexual or any other deviant personality or emotional state, unless that person has commited a homosexual related crime (pedophilia, bondage parties, self-mutilation, suicide attempt, transvestitism, masturbating in public, public nudity, pyromania, etc.) which would alert the Church that there was something ‘up’ with this candidate.

Don’t dismiss a ‘battery’ of psych exams and an interview too lightly, they are not a simple procedure and usually takes one to two days to complete. This can easily be done with all the other procedures used to process the prospective candidate.

 

[Scout]

Kevin Walker:

I have a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts, and have taken several psych exams in the course of occupations (my C.I.A. psych test was five hours long + an interview with a clinical psychologist), and those tests are very probing, you are not going to beat them.

Well, that examples the arrogance in your posts. I couldn’t figure out why you kept spewing out psychological terms and quoting textbooks-now I know why. You couldn’t think of your own opinions, so you had to borrow someone else’s.

Scout :tiphat:

 

[Scout]

Kevin Walker:

I have a BA in Psychology from the University of Massachusetts, and have taken several psych exams in the course of occupations (my C.I.A. psych test was five hours long + an interview with a clinical psychologist), and those tests are very probing, you are not going to beat them.

Well, that examples the arrogance in your posts. I couldn’t figure out why you kept spewing out psychological terms and quoting textbooks-now I know why. You couldn’t think of your own opinions, so you had to borrow someone else’s.

Scout :tiphat:

 

[HagiaSophia]

Scout:

Well, that examples the arrogance in your posts. I couldn’t figure out why you kept spewing out psychological terms and quoting textbooks-now I know why. You couldn’t think of your own opinions, so you had to borrow someone else’s.

Scout :tiphat:

When talking about psychological testing, I find it hardly surprising that a poster would use psychological terminology Better to quote an authority correctly than just post inanely.

 

[Scout]

HagiaSophia:

When talking about psychological testing, I find it hardly surprising that a poster would use psychological terminology Better to quote an authority correctly than just post inanely.

Actually, the psychological rhetoric has been flowing all throughout the thread, not just in discussing psychological testing.

And I don’t think I’ve been posting inanley at all. I think my comments have made perfect sense. If someone doesn’t agree with them, that’s fine. They have to live with their own opinions, and I have to live with mine.

Scout :tiphat:

 

[4_marks]

Kevin Walker:

A CORI check is given to just about anybody nowadays, especially school teachers. And I am not aware of a ‘battery’ of psych tests given to potential Seminarian candidates, at least not to my pals who are now studying at St. John’s Seminary in Brighton.

A criminal background check is not going to discover a homosexual or any other deviant personality or emotional state, unless that person has commited a homosexual related crime (pedophilia, bondage parties, self-mutilation, suicide attempt, transvestitism, masturbating in public, public nudity, pyromania, etc.) which would alert the Church that there was something ‘up’ with this candidate.

Don’t dismiss a ‘battery’ of psych exams and an interview too lightly, they are not a simple procedure and usually takes one to two days to complete. This can easily be done with all the other procedures used to process the prospective candidate.

All of my classmates and I underwent a thorough psychological evaluation replete with all testing before admission into the seminary. The Archdiocese of Boston did not shirk its responsibilities in this regard as some may want to suggest.

Pedophiles and other sexual deviants are often attracted to environments where their desires can be acted upon. The problem is that, instead of addressing these miscreants and perpetrators right off the bat, and turning them over to the proper civil authorities, those who were their superiors ignored the seriousness of these problems for fear of causing scandal. This was and is not acceptable. Now, the Archdiocese and the Church as a whole, is paying the price.

As I see it, the root problem is not so much one of individual sexual preference as it is a of the lack of the virtue of discipline, and the willfull choice not to co-operate with God’s sanctifying grace. It takes both discipline and sanctifying grace to enter into and sustain a celibate lifestyle.