Baptism

[Harpazo]

Well you cant do it therefore i stick to my beliefs.

Show us where the Bible tells us to use cars to get around or computers to store information instead of papyrus?

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[Mickey]

Show us where the Bible tells us to use cars to get around or computers to store information instead of papyrus?

 

[Rocket_Man]

Moses’ leading his people through the Red Sea is seen as an Old Testament foreshadowing of Christian baptism. The following New Testament passage clearly points to this: “For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, and all ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them, and that rock was Christ.” (1 Corinthians 10:1-4) It is worthwhile to note that “all were baptized” through Moses’ leadership in crossing over the Red Sea. He did not leave the infants or children on the shores of Egypt to become prey to the angry armies of Pharaoh because they were not old enough to believe in the promise of the Old Covenant. Rather, entrusted to the arms of their parents’ faith, they were carried through the “baptism of Moses.”
goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith7067

Please explain what the author meant by “baptized” when he added the word “cloud” along with the word “sea”.

And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;"

 

[rev_kevin]

You seem to be hung up on the idea that the infant needs to have faith prior to being baptized in order for God to give grace through the baptism. That’s not how God works. We need God’s grace in order to even HAVE faith! Remember, even our faith is not of ourselves. It is a gift of God. Eph. 2:8.

Thankfully God bestows the grace we need when we are not even capable of having faith ourselves. Need more examples?

The paralytic in Matt. 9:2 and Mark 2:3-5. The faith of those who brought in the paralytic cured the paralytic’s sins. This is an example of the forgiveness of sins based on another’s faith, just like infant baptism.

The servant in Matt. 8:5-13. The servant is healed based upon the centurion’s faith. This is another example of healing based on another’s faith. If Jesus can heal us based on someone else’s faith, then He can baptize us based on someone else’s faith as well.

The demon possessed child in Mark 9:22-25. Jesus exorcises the child’s unclean spirit based on the father’s faith. This healing is again based on another’s faith.

In 1 Cor. 7:14 Paul states that children are sanctified by God through the belief of only one of their parents. This goes back as far as Exodus 12:24-28, where the Passover was based on the parent’s faith. If they did not kill and eat the lamb, their first-born child died. And the same concept is expressed in Joshua 5:2-7, wherein God punished Israel because the people had not circumcised their children. This was based on the parent’s faith.

Parents play a critical role in their child’s salvation. They cooperate with God by bringing their children unto Him and he supplies the grace through baptism that they need to eventually become hearers and doers of the Word.

Point well taken
But they have to do with healing not baptism.
1 Cor. 7:14 the children of such a marriage have a godly influence and are set apart until they are old enough to make their own decision for Christ.

 

[Mickey]

Please explain what the author meant by baptized when he added the word “cloud” along with the word “sea”.

And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;"

Under the conduct of Moses, they received baptism in figure, by passing under the cloud, and through the sea; and they partook of the body and blood of Christ in figure, by eating of the manna, (called here a spiritual food because it was a figure of the true bread which comes down from heaven,) and drinking the water, miraculously brought out of the rock, called here a spiritual rock, because it was also a figure of Christ.
drbo.org/chapter/53010.htm

 

[rev_kevin]

Show us where the Bible tells us to use cars to get around or computers to store information instead of papyrus?

In Christ,
Andrew

Sorry but this makes no sence. Its called progress. It there was progress back then also Adam and Eve didn’t have chariots and I see nothing that says they wrote on papyrus.

 

[Harpazo]

Sorry but this makes no sence. Its called progress. It there was progress back then also Adam and Eve didn’t have chariots and I see nothing that says they wrote on papyrus.

So you see how silly it is to posit demands for proof-texting on the Bible with things completely foreign to it, i.e. “believer’s baptism.”

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[Harpazo]

Point well taken
But they have to do with healing not baptism.
1 Cor. 7:14 the children of such a marriage have a godly influence and are set apart until they are old enough to make their own decision for Christ.

Where is this in the Bible: “old enough to make their own decision for Christ”? If you believe that, why isn’t it in the Bible? How do you even know what to call the Bible? It doesn’t contain the word “Bible” within its pages.

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[Rocket_Man]

The paralytic in Matt. 9:2 and Mark 2:3-5. The faith of those who brought in the paralytic cured the paralytic’s sins. This is an example of the forgiveness of sins based on another’s faith, just like infant baptism.

 

[Dokimas]

: “For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea, and all ate the same spiritual food, and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them, and that rock was Christ.” (1 Corinthians 10:1-4) goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith7067

And I thought Peter was the rock. Now it all makes sense when you realize Jesus is the Rock and correct beliefs about Jesus is the foundation upon which Jesus will build His own church. Thanks, Mickey.

 

[Dokimas]

Where is this in the Bible: “old enough to make their own decision for Christ”? If you believe that, why isn’t it in the Bible? How do you even know what to call the Bible? It doesn’t contain the word “Bible” within its pages.

In Christ,
Andrew

Where it says ‘repent and be baptized.’ Babies can’t repent.

 

[jmcrae]

Please explain what the author meant by “baptized” when he added the word “cloud” along with the word “sea”.

And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;"

It means that they entered into the Mosaic Covenant at that time (which was later ratified with the Ten Commandments).

 

[Dokimas]

Show us where the Bible tells us to use cars to get around or computers to store information instead of papyrus?

In Christ,
Andrew

We can’t read the words you wrote because they are not in Koine Greek.

 

[jmcrae]

Where it says ‘repent and be baptized.’ Babies can’t repent.

Neither can adults who have never committed any personal sins, and yet, they still need to be baptized. Obviously, if you have no sins, you can’t repent, so you don’t need to. God requires of us only what is possible. And there is no way that God is requiring us to, first, go commit a sin, so that you can repent, so that you can then be baptized and be saved from Hell. That would make absolutely no sense at all.

 

[Dokimas]

In my household is my wife and I. If our children lived with us there’d be my wife, daughter #1 and her husband, daughter #2 (30 yrs old) and me. Not one infant in this household. I thinking that the Philippian jailer didn’t have any young ones in his household. Makes more sense than other ideas I’ve read.

 

[Harpazo]

Where it says ‘repent and be baptized.’ Babies can’t repent.

Nope, it says no such thing. You’re reading into something that is not there, which is why it’s necessary to have the Church to guide you from cherry-picking what suits you at any particular moment.

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[Rocket_Man]

It means that they entered into the Mosaic Covenant at that time (which was later ratified with the Ten Commandments).

Did the author intend you to use the scripture as a picture for justifying infant baptism?

 

[Harpazo]

We can’t read the words you wrote because they are not in Koine Greek.

Are you talking about post on page 7? It’s Koine Greek as far as I know. You can check if you don’t believe it.

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[Harpazo]

Did the author intend you to use the scripture as a picture for justifying infant baptism?

Did the authors intend for Holy Scripture to be used as a picture for justifying limitless division at the whim of someone’s “interpretation?” It makes no sense to divorce Holy Scripture from the Church. Otherwise, you become schizophrenic.

In Christ,
Andrew

 

[jmcrae]

In my household is my wife and I. If our children lived with us there’d be my wife, daughter #1 and her husband, daughter #2 (30 yrs old) and me. Not one infant in this household. I thinking that the Philippian jailer didn’t have any young ones in his household. Makes more sense than other ideas I’ve read.

Sorry to state the obvious, but they didn’t live in modern times, back then.

People back then didn’t use birth control, and women didn’t remain single when they were adults - they got married, and had kids - lots and lots of kids. “A quiver full of sons” the Bible says. 12 boys, plus how ever many girls you get while getting the boys. Plus, they had their household servants. Think of every machine you have in your house, and realize that back then, that work would have been done by a servant (answering machine = the butler; washing machine = the scullery maid; dishwasher = the kitchen maid; the telephone = the messenger boy) - realize that each of those servants also has a spouse and children, who are also considered to be members of your household.