Beck: Help us restore traditional American values

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TEPO said:
If the government were to suddenly disappear, what would those addicted to welfare do? Would they just be shocked or what…? I bet they would either band together with guitars in hand and begin selling crafts - or try their butts off individually at improving their lives.

I support care for the poorest of the poor and for the disabled, but there is just no way that even a majority of those on welfare are truly disabled… I dont believe it. There should be a time-cap on welfare.
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I disagree, and point to Somalia as an example.
 
dmelosi said:
The argument I am making is that more and more government dependency leads to people being dependent on government to make their decisions and choose their way of life.

Take away the incentive to do your best and mental growth stops and complacency sets in. Why should anyone take a risk to improve?

That is what this socialistic/marxist decent is doing to our country. It is saying it is ok to not do your best…it is ok to be average.
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Isn’t this what the tea party is saying when they put dim-wits up for elected office. You don’t have to be educated. You don’t have to know what you are talking about. You needn’t know anything about world affairs or how things actually work. All you have to do is say “Im pro-life” and you’ve got my vote. It doesn’t even matter that you never do anything about it. Catch me next time and I’ll be fooled again…and again…and again.
 
Via_Dolorosa said:
Isn’t this what the tea party is saying when they put dim-wits up for elected office. You don’t have to be educated. You don’t have to know what you are talking about. You needn’t know anything about world affairs or how things actually work. All you have to do is say “Im pro-life” and you’ve got my vote. It doesn’t even matter that you never do anything about it. Catch me next time and I’ll be fooled again…and again…and again.
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Instead of just blatantly blasting the tea party, please site specifics. You are falling into the category if you don’t know what to say, you name call.
 
Via_Dolorosa said:
Isn’t this what the tea party is saying when they put dim-wits up for elected office. You don’t have to be educated. You don’t have to know what you are talking about. You needn’t know anything about world affairs or how things actually work. All you have to do is say “Im pro-life” and you’ve got my vote. It doesn’t even matter that you never do anything about it. Catch me next time and I’ll be fooled again…and again…and again.
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This country was built for the scholar and the farmer, not so the scholar could control the farmer. If a farmer votes, what you would consider a “dim wit” into office, it is his right and should be respected. The farmer can run for office himself, and does not have to have an elitist knowledge of world affairs to serve his constituents.
 
Via_Dolorosa said:
Isn’t this what the tea party is saying when they put dim-wits up for elected office. You don’t have to be educated. You don’t have to know what you are talking about. You needn’t know anything about world affairs or how things actually work. All you have to do is say “Im pro-life” and you’ve got my vote. It doesn’t even matter that you never do anything about it. Catch me next time and I’ll be fooled again…and again…and again.
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I think some people choose to look at history as opposed to current world affairs to figure out what works.

I’m not saying that I am a supporter of the tea party, just observing. 🙂
 
bbarrick8383 said:
Ah, so by “them” and original intent, you believe that the government reserves the right to declare war on any state it wishes… but it can not declare war on all of them, thereby declaring war on itself?

That makes sense…:rolleyes:
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Oh, please. What do you expect a validly elected government to do when it faces armed, unjustified rebellion?

It’s idiotic to maintain that the mechanism for a sovereign state’s self-dissolution would be built into that state’s governmental structure. Secession is obviously and self-evidently illegal, and it always has been. Get over it.

There’s a legal and nonviolent (secession could never be achieved nonviolently) way to change our government called amending the Constitution.

If there’s a pressing need to undo some egregious oppression, we can do that. If people in Congress don’t agree, vote their asses out and vote in people who do.

If there aren’t enough citizens who feel they’re being oppressed to accomplish this, then tough noogies. I guess it’s just a few deluded individuals with a persecution complex.

The bottom line is this: Good_News is right. Legitimate policy disagreement doesn’t justify accusing one’s political opponents of being architects of oppression. That’s ideological hysteria.

Besides, even if there are some governmental policies that violate the Constitution - and I agree that there are - “prudence dictates” that only “a long train of abuses and usurpations” that foist “absolute Despotism” upon us can justify armed rebellion.
 
TEPO said:
You disagree with the time-cap? If so, would that be because you see the problem of unemployment as becoming worse…?
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No. I disagree with your scenario if benefits were cut off. I believe we would see rioting as we have seen in Greece if and when benefits are curtailed.

The problem with entitlement breakdown, and its aftereffects, is one of the effects of leading people to believe they can depend on the government to help them. If they didn’t believe that, they might make different decisions throughout their lives.

Suppose you had no “safety net”. Would you set aside money to provide for yourself in case of a downturn? If you were the least bit sensible, you would. On the other hand, the mentality that the government will always be there to rescue you may lead to a different decision.

Among other things, entitlement and welfare programs lure people into a false sense of security. Then, when those programs are affected for whatever reason, they freak out, because they are not prepared for any alternative.

I’m not saying that some assistance is wrong, but dependency is also wrong, and it saps human dignity in the process.
 
Fone_Bone_2001 said:
Oh, please. What do you expect a validly elected government to do when it faces armed, unjustified rebellion?
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I’d have a hard time putting my life on the line for something that was unjustified. People have forgotten that this country was founded with the idea in mind that people are different, and folks with a like minded beliefs could band togethor in different parts of the country and vote with their feet if they wished. We are not designed as humans to be under the umbrella of one ruling government. Centuries of war have proven this.
It’s idiotic to maintain that the mechanism for a sovereign state’s self-dissolution would be built into that state’s governmental structure. Secession is obviously and self-evidently illegal, and it always has been. Get over it.
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Watch your language my friend. It is not idiotic, the state created the government and the state should have power over the government. Secession can be a tool for peace.
There’s a legal and nonviolent (secession could never be achieved nonviolently) way to change our government called amending the Constitution.
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Yes it could. There are many in vermon who would like to secede and become their own socialist state. I’m pretty sure those in Vermont would like to do so peacefully, they would not stand a chance arming themselves. As would Oklahoma, but Oklahoma and Texas and a few other states combined very well do.
If there’s a pressing need to undo some egregious oppression, we can do that. If people in Congress don’t agree, vote their asses out and vote in people who do.
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I see this as becoming more and more of a problem.
If there aren’t enough citizens who feel they’re being oppressed to accomplish this, then tough noogies. I guess it’s just a few deluded individuals with a persecution complex.
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Yea, I guess. 🤷
The bottom line is this: Good_News is right. Legitimate policy disagreement doesn’t justify accusing one’s political opponents of being architects of oppression. That’s ideological hysteria.
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Glad you are the judge of what the bottom line is. I was beginning to think we were different people with different lifestyles and opinions. I guess I just needed someone to tell me how to think.
Besides, even if there are some governmental policies that violate the Constitution - and I agree that there are - “prudence dictates” that only “a long train of abuses and usurpations” that foist “absolute Despotism” upon us can justify armed rebellion.
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And those policies would be? Because I think Good News would fight tooth and nail to disagree with you.
 
When I first heard of the secession movement, I have to admit, I thought it was a crazy idea. But when, time after time, the Federal Government exceeds its Constitutional authority, I can see where, at some point, the States may just say “enough” and leave.

It happens to be their choice. The States created the Federal Government and they can also leave it. It doesn’t necessarily mean “civil war”.

But there are a lot of things to consider before proceeding with such a plan. I haven’t seen any comprehensive plan that addresses the myriad of concerns. Right now, it’s just an idea.
 
I am flabbergasted at the direction the last few posters have gone. Succession? “I used to think it was nuts, but maybe not?” This truly is psycho talk. Now I know why the Southern Poverty Center is so busy these days.
 
bbarrick8383 said:
I’d have a hard time putting my life on the line for something that was unjustified. People have forgotten that this country was founded with the idea in mind that people are different, and folks with a like minded beliefs could band togethor in different parts of the country and vote with their feet if they wished. We are not designed as humans to be under the umbrella of one ruling government. Centuries of war have proven this.

Watch your language my friend. It is not idiotic, the state created the government and the state should have power over the government. Secession can be a tool for peace.

Yes it could. There are many in vermon who would like to secede and become their own socialist state. I’m pretty sure those in Vermont would like to do so peacefully, they would not stand a chance arming themselves. As would Oklahoma, but Oklahoma and Texas and a few other states combined very well do.

So, where do we build the fence? Kansas?
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Via_Dolorosa said:
I am flabbergasted at the direction the last few posters have gone. Succession? “I used to think it was nuts, but maybe not?” This truly is psycho talk. Now I know why the Southern Poverty Center is so busy these days.
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I feel very strongly about seperating myself from a downward spiraling society that accepts killing it’s children as the norm. I’m sorry, but I no longer like my neighbors in this country, and they live hundreds of miles away. But they for some reason have interpreted the constitution and rationalized with themselves this idea that they have control over what I must accept in life.
 
PTL said:
If both party are pro-choice, I would choose the one with small government v.s. big government. We need government, but not big government that controls our lives. Currently the Obama administration is heading toward Marxism. The Church teaches that Marxism is evil. Big government makes people totally depend on the government so they can control each individual completely. The way this government is heading - unlimited spending, waste, deeper in debt, paralyze economy, free hand outs with more national debt, raise of tax, control internet, taking away freedom of speech… All these are big government and pavement for Marxism. It is very scary!
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Hmmm…but I work in “government”…and I get so tired of people talking about waste and unlimited spending. Let see our budget here has been cut at least 4 times in the last several years…and it started out 10% down from the last biennium. My pay as a manager has been frozen for 3 years now and will likely continue to be. I take unpaid days off (furloughs) only to put in those hours in the next week as my contribution to the state (unpaid overtime). So…tell me again about uncontrolled spending and waste…:rolleyes:
 
bbarrick8383 said:
I feel very strongly about seperating myself from a downward spiraling society that accepts killing it’s children as the norm. I’m sorry, but I no longer like my neighbors in this country, and they live hundreds of miles away. But they for some reason have interpreted the constitution and rationalized with themselves this idea that they have control over what I must accept in life.
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So, are you considering a second amendment solution to the problems you are having?
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
Hmmm…but I work in “government”…and I get so tired of people talking about waste and unlimited spending. Let see our budget here has been cut at least 4 times in the last several years…and it started out 10% down from the last biennium. My pay as a manager has been frozen for 3 years now and will likely continue to be. I take unpaid days off (furloughs) only to put in those hours in the next week as my contribution to the state (unpaid overtime). So…tell me again about uncontrolled spending and waste…:rolleyes:
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Can I assume you don’t work for the department of defense?
 
Via_Dolorosa said:
Can I assume you don’t work for the department of defense?
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You would be right…because I work for state government…community colleges and workforce development…which is why I “donate” those hours. It’s just frustrating to hear about state govenment and waste when it isn’t always so…:banghead::banghead:
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
You would be right…because I work for state government…community colleges and workforce development…which is why I “donate” those hours. It’s just frustrating to hear about state govenment and waste when it isn’t always so…:banghead::banghead:
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I hear you.
 
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