Being both Protestant and Catholic?

[VeryBlessed]

One thing the OP’s Protestant-Catholic friend may not understand is becoming Catholic is a very much bigger step than jumping from one Protestant denomination to another. It is more than a simple shift in viewpoint on some or even many of the theological points under dispute. You can certainly be Protestant and yet be very Catholic in your beliefs, but, that is not at all the same as actually becoming a Catholic.

I hope to never lose sight of the expansive ground of truth that Catholics and many Protestants share in common. There is much we can do to encourage a person to grow in true faith in Christ, even if they will never make the big (and difficult and sometimes costly) jump and become Catholic.

I spent 10 years with a mission agency reaching out to non-Christian parts of the world. That experience makes me want to roll my eyes when the Catholic-Protestant bickering gets too great. I find myself wishing we could pursue those with no concept of Christianity as passionately as we discuss the differences between ourselves as Catholics and Protestants. The real problem (which dwarfs the Catholic Protestant split) is belief systems that lead people nowhere near historic Christian beliefs.

 

[JonNC]

With all due respect, I can consider myself a citizen of Ruritania all I like but it doesn’t really matter if the government of Ruritania determines otherwise, does it?

A resident of North Carolina calls oneself a Carolinian. Does that mean a resident of South Carolina cannot?

 

[JonNC]

An excellent post!

 

[JonNC]

And I believe otherwise as does the Catholic Church who considers your orders invalid. I am Catholic so I go by Catholic teaching. There is no sense in arguing it as it comes down to personal feelings that someone believes something, regardless of what Wikipedia says.

Then we disagree, and that’s fine.

Since you are using it as an adjective I would hope all Catholics are evangelical

Here we agree.

 

[kainosktisis]

Unfortunate regarding others who might receive him, I was looking up Catholic Churches in my area. I found one belonging to the Synodal Catholic Diocese of the Southeast. Looking at their website on the specific church, it appears to welcome all as an “inclusive” church & administer the sacraments to anybody who’d receive them. This church doesn’t belong to my Diocese. I’d heard of other churches like this, but this was a first for me for a Catholic church.

 

[Welshrabbit]

Since you two are discussing my posts, I’m going to reply.

I can do whatever I want on this forum. I can tell someone to leave me alone, that I’m not interested in their opinion, and that I find them irritating. Whether or not they respect that and actually leave me alone is another story.

My original reply was not meant to be a deeply thought out religious argument. It is BLATANTLY obvious that the friend in OP’s scenario is not a religious scholar and is not “learned.” I was giving OP a simple argument that he could pass on to his friend to ponder: that for 1500 years there were no Protestants, ergo (almost) everyone in the Christian world was Catholic.

I was not looking to be “challenged” as I was typing from my phone while in the gym and not interested in a debate. If JonNC wanted to offer his advice to the OP, he could have done so but he chose to lecture me about why I was “wrong.”

I watched in awe as JonNC posted from around 3:30 pm yesterday my time to around 10:30 pm my time yesterday. I only posted once last night as I was putting my son to bed, which was a mistake. His behavior is obsessive and quite frankly, weird. I find it off-putting and just plain rude that he (a non-Catholic) would spend that much time on a Catholic forum lecturing Catholics about their faith.

He is of course, free to do as he pleases.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Welshrabbit, while I too find some posts by non-Catholics to be frustrating or not on point, JonNC did note that you are in the Non-Catholic Religions forum. In Non-Catholic Religions, people who aren’t Catholics are generally allowed to express themselves in a civil manner. This often includes non-Catholics challenging Catholics on any statements Catholics make about a non-Catholic religion. You are of course free to refute, debate etc or tell the non-Catholic that you don’t want to discuss it with him (when I do this I usually mute the thread and/or put the poster on ignore so I am less tempted to keep reading or try to have the last word). But you cannot be un-civil yourself or you risk drawing flags and moderator disciplinary action. In your last couple posts you have been a little rude to JonNC, who is allowed to be here as he isn’t breaking any forum rules and is in the Non-Catholic Religions forum rather than disrupting Catholic discussion threads with non-Catholic views. You might want to be careful about staying civil.

 

[halogirl]

It’s so obvious when you put it like that but nobody ever tells you that irl. Especially not in non denom circles. The emphasis is on your own personal relationship with God and therefore which church you belong to ( as long as it professes Jesus as saving Lord, teaches the Bible and upholds trinitarian teaching ) is seen as only important insofar as it provides fellowship and worship. The only sacrament I have ever seen talked about is baptism and they don’t even call it a sacrament. I got cross when in the process of converting and a Church of England friend said ‘it’s harder for a Catholic to be a Christian’.

 

[sunandstars]

Thank you everyone for your replies.
I see now that my own understanding is the correct one, and that my friend has a long way to go. I have sent him many books including the CCC.

I especially like the cat at the door post. That is spot on!

I go to a Latin Mass Parish, but would go to a NO parish if I had to. I’m not a sedevacantist, FFSP, or SSPX. I’m not part of a fringe movement.

I’ve pretty much dropped it. It’s not my job to convince him. That’s God’s job. I can only facilitate his reception when he is closer to being ready. But at this point, I have to say he’s very far away.

Thanks!

 

[Minks]

@VeryBlessed “I spent 10 years with a mission agency reaching out to non-Christian parts of the world.”

Please consider a separate thread regarding what we can do in this realm, even though we remain in our own communities, as most of us interact with non-Christians every day. Some people have a talent for converting, while others have a talent for turning people off.

Unfortunately, after more than 70 years of trying, I know I’m in this latter category, even though I was the type of girl who never got into mischief. On the other hand, my sister, who was ALWAYS into mischief, converted a boy in her junior high school, and his mother, and a couple of years later, a girl and her mother.

The essence of mission work is seldom mentioned here. I think we could all benefit from your insight.

 

[MichaelP3]

I don’t understand your point. One is either in communion with the bishop of Rome, or they’re not- and if they’re not, then they’re not Catholic. If you claim to be a Christian and are not a Catholic, then you are a protestant. There’s no arguing this.

Actually A LOT of arguing “this”. I truly hope you got past that ignorance when I read the subsequent posts referring to this very post.

Kind Regards

 

[steve-b]

I have a friend who has told me for years that he wants to become Catholic.

He is an Evangelical, non denominational type Christian that was baptized by his Presbyterian minister father in a river alone. It was recorded anywhere.

He has a previous marriage.

I’ve told him to go to a church and speak to a priest. He claims he cannot because of health problems.

I found a priest that would instruct him and consider reception with me as his sponsor with conditional baptism.

We began talking, over email about tenets of the Faith. During a side discussion, I brought up the teaching about “no salvation without the Church”.
It didn’t go down well, even though I explained it in the clearest of terms. He wouldn’t understand that it does NOT necessarily mean Protestants go to hell.

Then I used the term “one, true Church”. And that got the same response.
He became very defensive of Protestantism, very arrogant about his knowledge of the CChurch, and accused me of being in a fringe movement, that he had never heard of either of those terms…blady, blaady, blah.

Then he said, that he had no intention of separating himself from Protestantism, Butt hat he only wanted the Catholic “added on bits”.

He seems to think that he can be both and was scandalized by me telling him he had to put aside the Protestantism, and take up Catholicism. That Catholicism is not a denomination.

He doesn’t accept Apostolic Succession , or the need to confess to a priest. That’s as far as we got, because everything stopped in it’s tracks at “one, true Church”.

Then the whole project fell apart. He has said some very mean things to me, and still maintains I am the one who knows nothing about the Church.

He says he will find someone else to receive him.

So I guess my question is this:

Is he right? Can one be both Protestant and Catholic at the same time?

Simple answer, No

One who is not Catholic, and can’t accept the Catholic faith in its entirety, can’t really say honestly, they want to come into the Church.

And​

They can’t profess the creed honestly. When one professes "I believe in the One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church." that would be a lie. Nor can or does that mean, one can redefine terms on their terms.

sunandstars:

It doesn’t make any sense to me.

I’d say one thing, and he would refute it. He came to me about being Catholic, but seemed to want to convert me to Protestantism, rather than the other way around.
It left me pretty shake .

We are obliged to give people information when the opportunity presents itself and do it with charity. There is zero pressure in scripture or tradition, to convince anyone of anything. Conversion comes via God’s grace. Grace is either working in a person or it isn’t.

 

[Taxx]

Well Jesus said when 2 or more are gathered to geather in my name . I will be in their presence.
I thought this actually worked until I discovered if a person is not spirituality activated some version of being born again. Then it didn’t actually apply. Then it becomes an intellectual doctrine conversation.
As saint Paul said to the Ephesians. Acts 19
Into what were you baptised into?
Any thoughts?

 

[tgGodsway]

I was raised Catholic and at 21 years old came under the power of the Holy Spirit at Holy Rosary Catholic Church in 1981. I melted to the floor right in the middle of the Eucharist, as the priest had his back turned away. Broken and amazed at what just happened, I called out to Jesus who I just met for the very first time. It was a life altering encounter I will never forget.

But because of a friend who invited me to what everybody around here calls a “protestant” Church, I eventually left the Catholic Church to become a protestant. But the only thing was, this word (protestant) was never used in people’s vocabulary in the many years I’ve been away from the Catholic Church.

I didn’t really put things together until I found this forum. I learned right here there is a great divide between Catholics and Protestants. But the comparison is not fair. We Christians are not protesting anyone, at least not in my home church.

I know there was a time when we did, but today, not really. But for sure, Catholics are protesting protestants, not only on this site but also on Catholic radio.

I think a better term to describe the body of Christ should be a biblical one: What would it be like if we all called ourselves followers of Christ, believers, something like that? We all could unify over these words. Imposing Catholic OR protestant draws a line in the sand between both sides that shouldn’t be. But for sure, this is my opinion only, I’m sure others may disagree.