Being open to a third child

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catholichusband

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Looking for advice and thoughts the following.
My wife and I are both around 40 and have two children 6&3. We also both have very successful (yet demanding) careers so finances are not an issue but our two children are very energetic and active. They also have different sleep patterns (one wakes early, other stays up late)… so they do take a lot of our energy!
After the birth of each child we used NFP to allow for some spacing. I have a deep desire to be open to another baby (I think it is time to end the NFP restriction… and just allow God’s will to happen whatever it may be.) My wife however is reluctant and worse avoids talking about it.
I understand reasons why she may be concerned. There is a lot that drains both of our respective energy. A c-section would likely be required again (2 previous) and there is some history of miscarriage in the family.
It saddens me that my wife seems to fear a potential pregnancy, even though we have been blessed with many blessings. Appreciate any (name removed by moderator)ut from women especially on how I can be more supportive and encouraging to enable both of us to be more open to God’s will.
 
This is deeply personal.

First, I would say you need to get over your sadness that your wife fears pregnancy. Pregnancy an enormous burden, draining and scary. You being sad is irrelevant.

You are finally out of the diapers stage and the insanely restrictive car seats. It’s really difficult to try to want that all again.

Lastly, ask her what she fears, needs and wants. She may genuinely not be able to handle another child. It’s a real possibility.
 
This might not answer your question because I’m a man and all of my 3 children were adopted, so pregnancy wasn’t part of our experience, and 2 of them were mostly potty trained when they came on board, but I did want to comment on what I would call the logistics of a third child.

First I’ll say that our third child is a joy and a blessing, and we are 100% glad that we decided to go for that third child.

When we had two children, we assumed that adding a third would only marginally increase our workload. This is true for certain tasks like making meals and doing laundry; most of the effort consists in initiating the task, and it’s no trouble to serve another bowl or put another outfit in the washing machine.

Other aspects of parenting, however, do not scale so well. For example, getting 3 kids to after-school or weekend activities at 3 different locations on 3 different schedules is a lot harder than 2. At-home squabbles amongst the kids also have an interesting scaling characteristic. Between 2 children, there exists 1 relationship that will at times go wrong. With 3 children, there 3 pairwise relationships with different triggers, and if any 2 are not getting along, it impacts the third.

My point is simply to plan on the parental workload increasing significantly. If you are or your wife is already operating near 100% workload/0% free time, this is something to think about and plan for, in addition to the other concerns you mentioned. Your mileage may vary. In our case, having a third child worked out all right.
 
“Lastly, ask her what she fears, needs and wants. She may genuinely not be able to handle another child. It’s a real possibility.”

This is part of the issue she limits discussion on this when I bring it up so it is hard to address the issues when they are not really talked about. In terms of being able to handle a third child, I acknowledge that our bandwidth can seem stretched… but I believe that it is because both of us may have priorities in the wrong areas. For example our jobs both require some work from home evenings and weekends and we could both transition to less demanding jobs as financially we do not need this difference in pay. … But she seems really resistant to the idea to adjust priorities to help with relieving some of the mental and time pressure.
 
Dacinom said:
To the original poster, have you discussed this with your wife? Pregnancy CAN cause anxiety. Does she need reassurance from you? Did she have complications? Perhaps she needs help at home?

See if there are needs you can help with. Also invite her to prayer. Reassure her that she’s a good mother! Many issues come into play here. Praying for you.
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Complications: Our first pregnancy ended in miscarriage for the 2nd and third pregnancies she needed regular progesterone injections almost throughout her pregnancy (apparently very low levels) and this was likely the reason for the first miscarriage. If the same is assumed to occur again then this involves trips to clinic 2X/week - adding a significant constraint to her schedule. She also tends to need more sleep normally and being pregnant and subsequent nursing impacts this further… and I think this is a key contributor to her fear. With two past c-sections - she would likely face a third.

Help at home - we have grandparents that help with childcare and some chores. My wife can be meticulous and sometimes complains when something is not done perfectly - which in turn makes it difficult to either help or get help because the truth is she is awesome and it is difficult for anyone to do anything as well as she does!

Prayer - yes we should do that more. Our jobs are such that we are expected to be on top of everything all day long. It is hard to transition from ‘being in control’ to engaging in heart felt prayer where control is by its nature given up. I think this is especially difficult for my wife.

Thank-you for your reply and prayers. Really appreciate it.
 
It’s not that his overall sadness is irrelevant but being sad because someone finds a difficult thing difficult that is irrelevant.

He can be sad about not having more children. That’s 100% fine. Being sad his wife is struggling…fine. But being sad about her finding pregnancy hard is like being sad she requires sleep.
 
catholichusband said:
“Lastly, ask her what she fears, needs and wants. She may genuinely not be able to handle another child. It’s a real possibility.”

This is part of the issue she limits discussion on this when I bring it up so it is hard to address the issues when they are not really talked about. In terms of being able to handle a third child, I acknowledge that our bandwidth can seem stretched… but I believe that it is because both of us may have priorities in the wrong areas. For example our jobs both require some work from home evenings and weekends and we could both transition to less demanding jobs as financially we do not need this difference in pay. … But she seems really resistant to the idea to adjust priorities to help with relieving some of the mental and time pressure.
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If both of you have demanding jobs why don’t you take the steps to remedy that for yourself? You have two children already. Having to work in the very limited time that they get to see you isn’t good for them.

Perhaps if you change your wife may actually believe you are serious.
 
I’ll be really honest…it leaves a seriously bad taste in my mouth when I hear about a husband who wants more kids and wants his wife to have more but she isn’t totally on board.

I would let it go. Pray for her and let it go.
For some women…pregnancy, child birth and rearing just does not come easy. Complicated pregnancies, miscarriges, C-sections, depression, nursing, trying to figure out NFP while postpartum…it’s a lot. To the point where she just can’t imagine doing it again, and again, and again, and again. And even for a husband who has a front row seat…I feel a lot of men just don’t get it.

I know women who do it…they have miscarriges, infant loss, back to back pregnancies, serious complications…and they keep going back for more and God bless them for it.

But not all women are like that and I wish that was better respected by men and by the Catholic community at large…and I’m being dead serious when I say that.

I would be seriously hurt and wounded if my husband was wishing and pressing for another child before I was ready…especially if he was consulting with people to figure out how to change my mind. To me, that is controlling and not showing me support or love. I’d be angry and hurt.

Maybe you both need to rework your lifestyles or maybe you just need to respect the fact that she is not ready and may never be ready.
 
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catholichusband said:
It saddens me that my wife seems to fear a potential pregnancy, even though we have been blessed with many blessings
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It saddens me that I’ll never have a pony of my very own, but -yet- somehow I manage to find a way to be happy with the life I have…
 
I’m sorry you are feeling this way. I’ve had 4 c-sections. Recovery has been pretty terrible and worse each time due to scar tissue. You cannot really know what you are asking of her. She should be allowed to feel however she wants about it as long as you are following church teaching. My husband found out about our fourth when he found me staring into the mirror crying what were not happy tears with a pregnancy test in hand.

If I found out that my husband was online asking for help convincing me to want another c-section, it would hurt me pretty bad. I know that if or when we are in that situation he will be there to love me through all my feelings about the child we will both love.

Apologies if I’ve misread the situation. Just love her.
 
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That is a little harsh.

As a wife, it saddens me that we did not actively try to have more children when I was in that stage of life. Demanding career, physical concerns, they were all very valid. The validity of those reasons made sticking to the conservative NFP rules into a habit. Wish now we’d have had an oops or two.

It is okay to be sad about no more children. It is more than okay, it is human.
 
TheLittleLady said:
That is a little harsh.
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Perhaps it is - on the other hand, I’m not the one who wants help in convincing his wife to undergo a pregnancy that will require her to have ongoing medical intervention with a delivery that would require abdominal surgery in order to have another newborn to care for just after getting her current youngest out of toddler stage.
 
Been there and did that with my third. That was exactly how my husband figured out we were pregnant.

I was sobbing. It was horrible and I almost never recovered from it.

It’s been 4 years since that day and I’ve only just started to warm to the idea of a 4th.

But, I never had a c section…that would probably stop me in my tracks.
 
Hugs. This is one we struggle with, too. Except in our case, I feel like someone is missing from our family… and DH is the one who’s swamped with I-want-to-sleep, I-don’t-want-an-infant, I’m-stressed-about-work, what-about-college, etc. And I’m like, “I don’t care about having an infant. I want this person who doesn’t exist to exist, so they can grow up and be an adult and do what they’re supposed to do.”

I spent three years trying to bully him. (“WE NEED A BABY.”) I spent three years waiting for God to magically change his mind. (“LA LA LA, IT’S IN YOUR HANDS, GOD-- I’LL BE OVER HERE, THX.”) Now I’m spending the next three years paying attention to the family that’s right under my nose, and trying to be the wife and mom I’m supposed to be, rather than obsessing over being the champion of someone who doesn’t exist yet— working on the same theory that, just as I can’t convince DH to take me on a European vacation with an empty bank account, I can’t convince DH to expand our family if his home life is unsatisfactory.

Good luck on figuring things out. And congratulations on the family you do have.
 
Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
You are finally out of the diapers stage and the insanely restrictive car seats. It’s really difficult to try to want that all again.
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This is where I am right now. I have two kids — 5 & 2. With both kids, age 2 was when I finally got back to a sense of normalcy after all the sleep deprivation, diaper changes, and just non-stop mothering that comes along with having a child younger than 2. We’re in a really good place right now. The little one is in preschool three days a week, and the older one is in school five days. Everyone sleeps all night. I feel like I have a very manageable balance of mothering, family time, work, and sleep. I really want another baby, but right now I really just cannot fathom beginning the process all over again. I’m sad that we’re being strict with NFP right now, but I know it’s the right decision. Maybe in a year or two, I’ll feel like trying again. But right now I really need to regroup and take care of myself, as I’m of no use to anyone if I’m completely burned out.

My husband has graciously put the ball in my court, as he knows I take the brunt of everything since I’m the one who has to be pregnant, give birth, and do most of the childcare. I’m very thankful to him for that.
 
@(name removed by moderator) I don’t disagree with anything you’re saying here. I’ll just point out that responsible family planning is a virtue and is encouraged by the Church. It’s easy to look back, when you’re not currently in the midst of pregnancy symptoms, sleep deprivation, the terrible two’s etc. and say you wish you’d had more kids. Everyone has a different level of stamina to withstand the requirements of raising children. That’s why the Church allows each married couple to prayerfully discern the size of their families — first considering their obligations to God, then their spouse, then the children already born, then the community. Openness to procreation doesn’t require actively trying to get pregnant (as long as they use NFP and not contraception). There’s nothing wrong with being honest with oneself and saying, “I can’t handle this right now.”
 
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In my family, I was the one who wanted more. Our son has special needs and my husband has a very demanding job, though, and we are very stressed. His birth was also very traumatic, yet I felt like someone was missing.

We talked about it a lot when my son was around two, and he wasn’t comfortable with it. Our son’s needs really take a toll on the financial and mental health of our family. So I stopped asking and just waited and prayed. I’m now pregnant with our second.

I think it’s a bit different when it’s the husband who wants more- as helpful as a husband may be, he cannot do any of the work of being pregnant, delivering a baby, or breastfeeding. This is not to say that a woman should not pray and discern with her husband, but being pregnant is really very difficult sometimes- physically, emotionally, mentally, in every way. OP, if your wife has to visit the doctor twice a week to maintain a pregnancy on top of that, it’s a lot to ask. Add in the fact that you’re 40, and she may have concerns about her age and related risks and complications. It’s certainly okay to be sad about the thought of not having another baby- but really, try to understand her fears see that they are quite real and legitimate.

Pray that God allows you both to see what is right for your family, which may or may not be another child. And let it be for awhile.
 
I get it. My point is that the OP’s wife has legitimate concerns that are not likely to be assuaged by being told she’ll have serious regrets thirty years down the road if she doesn’t hop to it and get pregnant again right now. Yes, it’s possible she’ll regret not having more, as you do. But there are plenty of people who have only one or two children and have no regrets about it. There are also people who say that while they love all of their children and each of them is a blessing, there was a time when having a child put a great deal of strain on their marriage and the rest of the family, and that, at the very least, the timing of a particular child could have been better. That’s why the Church allows NFP and prayerful discernment of family size. Worrying that you MIGHT regret not having more children at some arbitrary point in the future is not a good reason to try to have a child when there are legitimate reasons to avoid pregnancy for a time.
 
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The truth of the matter is that people do need to discern. I know a mom who wanted 4 kids and her kids really, really suffered in their younger years. Her oldest was ADHD/ODD and didn’t listen to a thing. Her second was very good. Her 3rd was nonverbal until 4 and she had a baby in the mix. By the time her 2nd was 3 that child was changing diapers and parenting the baby. She knew how to mix a bottle and would put the baby down for a nap. At THREE.

Now, at 8, this child seems exhausted. Loves school and hates being home. Will take every chance to avoid coming home. The 1st continues to have issues. #3 and #4 are still really reliant on #2 will get their needs met by their sibling and doesn’t seem to have any huge love for the parents. Parents try hard and do spend time–when they can get a second from #1.

Having more children doesn’t always end in disaster like this, but the fact is if you can only deal with 2 children it is far better to meet their needs than be unable to.

No is a complete sentence.

Wanting more children as an adult is all well and good but when you’ve just washed poop out of underwear for the 3rd time and still have a dirty diaper it’s very, very reasonable to say “not right now” to a baby.

When you’re working and can’t even spend time with the kid’s God’s already given you. It’s very reasonable to say “not right now” to a baby.

When you need another year to recover and get a full night’s sleep it’s very reasonable to say “not right now” to a baby. Sleep is vital. Not only for people who are driving but because cancer rates, heart disease rates, etc are astronomically higher in those who are chronically sleep deprived. Sleep science is beginning to show how lack of sleep is an enormous predictor in many chronic illnesses. So when we see those “father of 5 under 7 drops dead of an ‘unpreventable’ heart attack” it really may have been avoided if he’d gotten good sleep.
 
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