Belleville Diocesan priests ask Bp. Braxton to resign

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frommi said:
IF someone inspires hatred in another person, I’m not sure that’s a laudable quality…regardless of who is doing the hating.
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Laudatur Iesus Christus.

It is difficult to generalize this idea during Holy Week.

Pax Christi nobiscum.

John Hiner
 
Hmmmm, seems I’m out of touch with my home diocese. I’m from Sparta, Illinois, which is part of the Diocese of Belleville. I’m currently serving in the military so away from home. I’ll have to ask my mom what she knows about this. I’ve met Father Voss on several occasions. My personal assessment is he isn’t a flaming liberal.

Trouble? If 44 priests signed the letter, and that’s 2/3rds of the priests in the diocese, then that means we only have 66 or so priests in the diocese. When I was growing up we had over 100.
 
Yerusalyim said:
Hmmmm, seems I’m out of touch with my home diocese. I’m from Sparta, Illinois, which is part of the Diocese of Belleville. I’m currently serving in the military so away from home. I’ll have to ask my mom what she knows about this. I’ve met Father Voss on several occasions. My personal assessment is he isn’t a flaming liberal.

Trouble? If 44 priests signed the letter, and that’s 2/3rds of the priests in the diocese, then that means we only have 66 or so priests in the diocese. When I was growing up we had over 100.
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One of the problems of priests that change the way the mass is said is that many that don’t know the norms, don’t realize how much they have changed it.
 
frommi said:
What a questionable thing to say!

IF someone inspires hatred in another person, I’m not sure that’s a laudable quality…regardless of who is doing the hating.
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So when the High Priests hated Christ and plotted His death, it was due to a lack of laudable qualiltes in Christ?

What exactly should Christ have done differently in His Ministry so that the Sanhedrin didn’t hate Him?
 
There’s the question of the money too. I’m sorry, when 44 of your 66 priests want you out, there’s an issue somewhere.
 
Yerusalyim said:
There’s the question of the money too. I’m sorry, when 44 of your 66 priests want you out, there’s an issue somewhere.
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I don’t know anything about Bishop Braxton - this thread seems to imply he is trying to restore orthodoxy. I’ve heard other reports he is very liberal, so who knows.

I would normally agree with your statement. The numbers do seem to convey a convincing story. But, having heard about so many liturgical abuses and extremely liberal priests and sisters in this diocese, I’m not sure your argument holds water. I don’t think we can say the majority is correct in this instance. As my signature line says - “truth is not determined by a majority vote.”

The issue of the money seems to have been addressed by a previous post - a clerical error that the Bishop addressed by paying the money back. I’m assuming that is correct.
 
Yerusalyim said:
There’s the question of the money too. I’m sorry, when 44 of your 66 priests want you out, there’s an issue somewhere.
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I went to a mass in a nearby town within the diocese. I really did not know if I was at a Catholic mass until I looked again at the sign outside when I left.

I reported that to the diocese the next day, they asked me to put in a letter what went on (which I did) and the bishop addressed it with them.

As a former member and one that has visited many of the parishes throughout Southern Illinois, I have to say that Bishop Braxton has his hands full.
 
Like I said, I’m removed from the problem, I’m here in Germany and might make it home once a year or so. But again, if 2/3rds of the priests want his resignation there’s an issue somewhere, either with the bishop, the priests, or more likely both.
 
Yerusalyim said:
Like I said, I’m removed from the problem, I’m here in Germany and might make it home once a year or so. But again, if 2/3rds of the priests want his resignation there’s an issue somewhere, either with the bishop, the priests, or more likely both.
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You may be right, I do not know him as well as most, but from what I do know of him and what I have seen firsthand at some of the other parishes, I tend to think that the Bishop is right on.
 
Elzee said:
. . .

I would normally agree with your statement. The numbers do seem to convey a convincing story. But, having heard about so many liturgical abuses and extremely liberal priests and sisters in this diocese, I’m not sure your argument holds water. I don’t think we can say the majority is correct in this instance. As my signature line says - “truth is not determined by a majority vote.”

. . …
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I remember my history professor asking if could happen that one man was right and all the rest of the world wrong. He pointed out that it could, but the rest would crucify him. 👍
 
I think it was said of Luther by Charles the V. “It is preposterous to imagine that one man could be right and over a thousand years of Christianity be wrong.”

CDL
 
You know, it’s perfectly possible that the priests’ opposition to the Bishop has NOTHING to do with his theology and a lot to do with his leadership style and the money issue. How many defending the Bishop know him personally?
 
Yerusalyim said:
You know, it’s perfectly possible that the priests’ opposition to the Bishop has NOTHING to do with his theology and a lot to do with his leadership style and the money issue. How many defending the Bishop know him personally?
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I know him personally. And as I said in my previous posts…I have been and seen first hand the liturgical abuses in the surrounding parishes.

The priests obviously do not care for his leadership style. I can’t talk to that much. But I really do study and try to learn more about my Catholic faith in my spiritual journey and I know enough to know that some of the priests are way out there.
 
You know, Belleville is not the first diocese in America to deal with a chance in leadership styles/personalities/priorities.

None of those have ever seen a bishop misuse funds on snazzy vestments that were meant for the poor.

None of those have seen a presbyerate take a vote like this.

I know the temptation is to believe that because it is a ‘liberal’ diocese that those hateful ‘liberals’ have risen up and are trying to drive an ‘orthodox’ man out of their midst.

I’m just not sure what is orthodox about misusing church funds.
 
Bishop Braxton used to be the Bishop of the Diocese of Lake Charles in Louisiana. He ordained two of my wife’s cousins, both of which are excellent and orthodox priests. They both spoke very, very highly of the Bishop. He was much loved in that diocese.

My suspicion on the money issue is that the opposition was able to twist some facts and evidence to suit their need for ‘dirt’ on the Bishop to bolster their efforts to have the Bishop ousted. After all, discontent and grumblings would never get a Bishop removed. Only evidence of misdeeds could do that. Besides, the worst they can dig up on this Bishop is misappropriation of funds? That he bought himself vestments?! That’s the best they can do?

When I heard him speak at my wife’s cousin’s ordinations, I was very impressed with his knowledge and assertiveness. Perhaps his reputation of being bold and assertive (some could perceive this as pompousness) is actually quite deserved.

The battle between orthodoxy and liberlism is escalating, I am afraid, since the Motu Proprio last year. I am inclined to believe this issue is just another case of a liberal stronghold trying to oust their Good Shepard for trying to help them see their errors.

Just my 2 cents.
 
frommi said:
You know, Belleville is not the first diocese in America to deal with a chance in leadership styles/personalities/priorities.

None of those have ever seen a bishop misuse funds on snazzy vestments that were meant for the poor.

None of those have seen a presbyerate take a vote like this.

I know the temptation is to believe that because it is a ‘liberal’ diocese that those hateful ‘liberals’ have risen up and are trying to drive an ‘orthodox’ man out of their midst.

I’m just not sure what is orthodox about misusing church funds.
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I live there, I have been to masses at the surrounding diocese. I know first hand of many of the liturgical abuses.

I am guessing you didn’t read any of the previous posts or simply ignoring them for some reason.
 
IronHammer said:
Bishop Braxton used to be the Bishop of the Diocese of Lake Charles in Louisiana. He ordained two of my wife’s cousins, both of which are excellent and orthodox priests. They both spoke very, very highly of the Bishop. He was much loved in that diocese.

My suspicion on the money issue is that the opposition was able to twist some facts and evidence to suit their need for ‘dirt’ on the Bishop to bolster their efforts to have the Bishop ousted. After all, discontent and grumblings would never get a Bishop removed. Only evidence of misdeeds could do that. Besides, the worst they can dig up on this Bishop is misappropriation of funds? That he bought himself vestments?! That’s the best they can do?

When I heard him speak at my wife’s cousin’s ordinations, I was very impressed with his knowledge and assertiveness. Perhaps his reputation of being bold and assertive (some could perceive this as pompousness) is actually quite deserved.

The battle between orthodoxy and liberlism is escalating, I am afraid, since the Motu Proprio last year. I am inclined to believe this issue is just another case of a liberal stronghold trying to oust their Good Shepard for trying to help them see their errors.

Just my 2 cents.
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You are correct. It is really sad, but at a recent talk about what the mass is all about, one of the people in the audience asked the deacon leading the talk why so many nuns were for abortion. He said that 3 of his sisters were nuns and 3 of his wifes sisters were nuns and they ALL believed that abortion was a womens choice and the church had it wrong. The attidude that it is “those hatefull liberal priests” as stated in a previous post, sure seems to help escalate getting away from true church teachings.
 
from a previous post…

I know the temptation is to believe that because it is a ‘liberal’ diocese that those hateful ‘liberals’ have risen up and are trying to drive an ‘orthodox’ man out of their midst.
I’m just not sure what is orthodox about misusing church funds.
dmelosi said:
I live there, I have been to masses at the surrounding diocese. I know first hand of many of the liturgical abuses.

I am guessing you didn’t read any of the previous posts or simply ignoring them for some reason.
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Those who read the thread about the diocese of Saginaw might be able to suggest what that “some reason” is.🤷
 
I say, as long as he is Orthodox and the worst they can get on him is that he bought vestments from the wrong fund but replaced the money when he realized his error, “praise God for Bishop Braxton. I hope he is able to convert or run out the liberals who are trying to destroy him.”

CDL
 
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