Biden to lead delegation for new pope's installation

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JMJSHJ said:
When he was a Cardinal he signed a document that indicated that Catholic politicians who support abortion through legislative means should be denied communion. Would you have a problem with that if VP Biden were told that upon arriving in Rome?
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Why would I, if it came from an authoritative man of the Church?
 
oldcelt said:
I feel certain that VP Biden will do a more than adequate job representing the people of the United States. This is about secular diplomacy and respect…remember…all the non-Catholics who will be representing their respective nations are technically heretics.
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Oh yes I’m sure he’ll sit there and smile just fine.

It’s the least he could do after failing so miserably in every other aspect of proclaiming the faith.

Peace be with him, honestly, I pray for him. He is an older man. And he is a smart man. He should know better.
 
Presurmksdimnds said:
It’s not about who is without ANY sin.

It’s about who actually agrees with Catholic teaching, and on every level, Biden does not.

It’s a shame, and an embarrassment, that he is our example of what an American Catholic is.

Actually, now that I think about it further, with as many cafeteria Catholics as we have I suppose he is the most realistic example of an American Catholic.

Even more embarrassing. :o
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Bingo. We aren’t talking some venial little thing.
 
livnlern said:
He’s setting a very bad example for the young Catholics in our country. They can see what he does and think it’s okay to disagree with church teachings and do whatever you feel is right.
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I think you are giving Biden too much credit, or not giving our young people enough credit. Todays youth grew up in an America where Bill Clinton questioned the meaning of “is” to defend an extramarital affair and where George W. marched into Baghdad without a single chemical weapon to be found. Even our beloved Paul Ryan is a joke of a moral teacher, abandoning the innocent unborn children of victims of rape and incest on national television during the VP debate. No American youth - Catholic or otherwise - looks to modern politicians as moral examples to emulate.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Does the new Holy Father need help understanding sins? I assume he’s fully capable of advising anyone.
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If the Holy Father is perusing Catholic Answers for suggestions I don’t think he would be the Holy Father. This is a discussion amongst people on a forum. All views are represented. All suggestions are speculative when it comes to “the Holy Father should” and “the Holy Father shouldn’t.”

You are right and true discussing the “he without sin cast the first stone” but what about “go and sin no more?”

We are talking about a very public person. A person who outright denies the truth of certain aspects of Catholicism in his actions and words. He has multiple and numerous occasions of encounters with Jesus Christ…Our God…in the Eucharist…and he hasn’t changed yet.

I would love to see if he is denied the Eucharist just like “non-Catholics”, “divorcees,” etc…etc, will he change, will he have a true conversion?

That is what I am praying for a conversion for Biden. Whether it be through a chance meeting with the new Holy Father or excommunication.

If you see someone going down the wrong side of the road about to die in a horrendous crash will you stop it or ignore it. I personally would attempt to stop it. Especially if that wrong direction will lead them to Gehenna.
 
SonSearcher said:
If the Holy Father is perusing Catholic Answers for suggestions I don’t think he would be the Holy Father. This is a discussion amongst people on a forum. All views are represented. All suggestions are speculative when it comes to “the Holy Father should” and “the Holy Father shouldn’t.”

You are right and true discussing the “he without sin cast the first stone” but what about “go and sin no more?”

We are talking about a very public person. A person who outright denies the truth of certain aspects of Catholicism in his actions and words. He has multiple and numerous occasions of encounters with Jesus Christ…Our God…in the Eucharist…and he hasn’t changed yet.

I would love to see if he is denied the Eucharist just like “non-Catholics”, “divorcees,” etc…etc, will he change, will he have a true conversion?

That is what I am praying for a conversion for Biden. Whether it be through a chance meeting with the new Holy Father or excommunication.

If you see someone going down the wrong side of the road about to die in a horrendous crash will you stop it or ignore it. I personally would attempt to stop it. Especially if that wrong direction will lead them to Gehenna.
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But isn’t the first instruction on ‘fraternal correction’ to approach your ‘brother’, just you and him?

It seems some desire an public humiliation, and ex-communication. That’s what some of the speculation appears to be. I don’t think we’ll see that from the Holy Father. I would suppose it would be private instruction, and what ever else the authoritative man of the Church would decide necessary; as it should be.

I would hope all worthy to receive communion, according to the men of the Church instructed to have a man, including all of us, to prove ourselves worthy in the scriptures.
 
Fogwalker said:
I think you are giving Biden too much credit, or not giving our young people enough credit. Todays youth grew up in an America where Bill Clinton questioned the meaning of “is” to defend an extramarital affair and where George W. marched into Baghdad without a single chemical weapon to be found. Even our beloved Paul Ryan is a joke of a moral teacher, abandoning the innocent unborn children of victims of rape and incest on national television during the VP debate. No American youth - Catholic or otherwise - looks to modern politicians as moral examples to emulate.
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I agree with your post. If people expect politicians to be shining examples of moral fidelity, history shows us that, they will always be sorely disappointed.
 
The_Curt_Jester said:
I think that Pope Francis should take the opportunity to publicly excommunicate Biden as soon as he meets the American delegation. Biden, after all, should have been excommunicated long ago.
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So if the Holy Father has this opportunity coming up to make an example of Biden and doesn’t do it, would you have less trust in the Pope to govern our Church? Or would you follow our Holy Father’s example of restraint and patience?
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
But isn’t the first instruction on ‘fraternal correction’ to approach your ‘brother’, just you and him?

It seems some desire an public humiliation, and ex-communication. That’s what some of the speculation appears to be. I don’t think we’ll see that from the Holy Father. I would suppose it would be private instruction, and what ever else the authoritative man of the Church would decide necessary; as it should be.
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I agree that the Holy Father should choose a private intervention or else you could have scandal in the other direction. But at some point the communicant won’t receive the Eucharist (whether he goes up and is denied, or he remains seated during the communion), it will be public regardless.
 
Fogwalker said:
So if the Holy Father has this opportunity coming up to make an example of Biden and doesn’t do it, would you have less trust in the Pope to govern our Church? Or would you follow our Holy Father’s example of restraint and patience?
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Good questions.

For me, it seems wrong to desire to see a public humiliation, and ex-communication, of someone over their sins. Would any of us want that kind of correction for ourselves?

Do unto others…
 
BigBlueCane said:
Thank you.

I mean really…have we gotten to a point where we attack other catholics as not being catholic enough? In that case why was Paul Ryan offered up as a replacement when he proposed a budget that the bishops said was immoral?

Its simple. Biden is the 2nd highest executive in the US and he’s Catholic…end of story.
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When they hold heterodox views they should be called out on them so they can hopefully repent and mend their ways.
 
SonSearcher said:
I agree that the Holy Father should choose a private intervention or else you could have scandal in the other direction. But at some point the communicant won’t receive the Eucharist (whether he goes up and is denied, or he remains seated during the communion), it will be public regardless.
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We’d miss it if we were paying attention to the Mass as we should…
 
BigBlueCane said:
I apologize if I came off as upset it just bothers me when catholics attack other catholics as not being catholic enough. **We should be proud that a catholic is VP of the United States no matter if he is Pro-Choice. Again Paul Ryan produced and supports a budget that the Catholic Bishops have said is immoral. ** While I disagree with most of what he believes in I’m not going to attack the man as not being catholic enough. If he had won the election and were the VP I’d be proud to have our country send our Catholic VP to represent us.

That’s all I’m trying to say…and again sorry if I came off strong it wasn’t my attention…just my hot latin blood. 😃
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Why should we be proud when his heterodox views on LIFE of all things are leading others into the same sin. He is not an example to be proud of, same as Pelosi who both support the murder of the unborn. And I’m really sad to see someone think that the budget ( ironically we haven’t even had a budget pass the whole time Obama has been in office) put up as if it’s morally comparable to the murder of children. :confused:
 
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