Bishop Athanasius Schneider: ‘We are in the fourth great crisis of the Church’

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MacBP said:
I think, overall, we should be careful about giving people motives where there are none. Seeing one person receives on the tongue versus the hand tell you absolutely nothing about the internal disposition of the people that are receiving.
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The only analogy I can offer is from the standpoint of being a coin collector. Every serious one knows that by simply touching the coin it may diminish the value of the coin substantially. Whether you know about it or not doesn’t change that fact. Particles always come (or “rub”) off and if a trained eye can see it, that’s good enough for me. One can appreciate a rare coin by not touching it; in fact that’s the best way to show respect for its intrinsic value. And it’s not even sacred.
 
Seraphignatius said:
Well, as a Catholic I don’t consider that the worst case scenario, because I don’t acknowledge even the theoretical possibility. Gods church is here and she will be till the consummation of the world.
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If Jesus said the Church would never teach error and then it began to teach error, that would mean Jesus was wrong or that we’re not in the true Church. To me, everything is on the line.

I suppose the Catholic Church would always be here, but I think Judaism, Islam, Hindu, Buddhism, etc will also be here til the end too. That doesnt really lend to its authenticity.
 
Thorns said:
If Jesus said the Church would never teach error and then it began to teach error, that would mean Jesus was wrong or that we’re not in the true Church. To me, everything is on the line.

I suppose the Catholic Church would always be here, but I think Judaism, Islam, Hindu, Buddhism, etc will also be here til the end too. That doesnt really lend to its authenticity.
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Ordinary Synods aren’t protected by the Charism of Infallibility. It could teach error just like the pope could in a homily, but I personally don’t think it will.
 
Seraphignatius said:
Ordinary Synods aren’t protected by the Charism of Infallibility. It could teach error just like the pope could in a homily, but I personally don’t think it will.
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Does anyone know how the two Synods will relate to each other?

I mean, is the first one to discuss and decide the general, high level questions, then the second one to determine the details?
 
Re new paganism

Just jumping in here. The new paganism is really just a resurgence of the old paganism (belief in nature, rather than nature’s God; emphasis on us in relation to Earth rather than as adopted children of God, made in His image).

I have not read this, but just from the title, it may be an illustration of paganistic influence. I found this on the reading list at a Dominican site in WI (where none of the sisters wears the habit anymore).
Rupp, Joyce.
The Cosmic Dance. Poetry and poetic prose inviting a reader to reflection.
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They also still provide this link, among others:
NETWORK www.networklobby.org
The National Catholic Social Justice Lobby educates, lobbies and organizes to influence the formation of federal legislation to promote economic and social justice.
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The more I learn abut my faith, the more obvious it is that there is a lot of evangelization work to be done!

Peace,
Mimi
 
Mark121359 said:
Megan7, You might be interested in his appearance on EWTN Live with Fr. Mitch Pacwa a little while back. It’s well worth watching if you get the chance. He sure does make one powerful case here!..youtube.com/watch?v=QbAZezVk5Gk

P.S. Thanks for your reference for his book! 👍

Peace, Mark
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Thank you Mark, I appreciate it. I will watch this. I LOVE this Holy Bishop. God bless you.

Peace :highprayer:
 
Thorns said:
If Jesus said the Church would never teach error and then it began to teach error, that would mean Jesus was wrong or that we’re not in the true Church. To me, everything is on the line.
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And this is precisely why there is now talk in certain quarters of a possible schism. We cannot, however, deny the doctrine of indefectibility. The Church, even if only a remnant, will always be visible on earth and teach truth.
 
It’s not just the comments of Cardinal Baldisseri, but also those of Bishop Galantino, and others including even Pope Francis, that have given the last year or so a bit of a Twilight Zone feel to them. It’s hard to imagine nothing changing after the October Synod, and that’s what concerns me.
 
Tigg said:
May we have a source for this please?
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The charism of infalibility, insofar as I am aware, only applies to the lawful bishops of the Church as a whole assembled in an ecumenical council and to the Pope when he is speaking Ex Cathedra. Do you have any reason to believe an ordinary synod is infallible? It is authoritative sure, but so is ones local ordinary. If you do have reason to believe it is infallible why do you fear it might teach error? Clearly it couldn’t if it were.
 
Seamus_L said:
It’s not just the comments of Cardinal Baldisseri, but also those of Bishop Galantino, and others including even Pope Francis, that have given the last year or so a bit of a Twilight Zone feel to them. It’s hard to imagine nothing changing after the October Synod, and that’s what concerns me.
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If nothing is going to change then what is the synod for? I’m sure they will look to change some practices, but hopefully only in ways that make sense in light doctrine.
 
McCall1981 said:
Does anyone know how the two Synods will relate to each other?

I mean, is the first one to discuss and decide the general, high level questions, then the second one to determine the details?
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I found this, but I don’t think it says much:

news.va/en/news/ordinary-council-meets-ahead-of-extraordinary-gene

also what does this mean?
The new synodal methodology that will be followed during the proceedings of the Extraordinary General Meeting was also presented during the meeting.
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Seamus_L said:
It’s not just the comments of Cardinal Baldisseri, but also those of Bishop Galantino, and others including even Pope Francis, that have given the last year or so a bit of a Twilight Zone feel to them. It’s hard to imagine nothing changing after the October Synod, and that’s what concerns me.
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I have a feeling that it won’t end well either.
 
Seraphignatius said:
The charism of infalibility, insofar as I am aware, only applies to the lawful bishops of the Church as a whole assembled in an ecumenical council and to the Pope when he is speaking Ex Cathedra. Do you have any reason to believe an ordinary synod is infallible? It is authoritative sure, but so is ones local ordinary. If you do have reason to believe it is infallible why do you fear it might teach error? Clearly it couldn’t if it were.
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I’m not disagreeing with your post, I’m only trying to understand the legalese. The link I have that might have clarified things, no longer works.
 
ProVobis said:
I have a feeling that it won’t end well either.
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I don’t think anyone expects it to end well, but there is a big difference between it ending with some poor pastoral decisions, versus ending with a schism-inducing doctrinal catastrophe.
 
McCall1981 said:
I don’t think anyone expects it to end well, but there is a big difference between it ending with some poor pastoral decisions, versus ending with a schism-inducing doctrinal catastrophe.
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Why couldn’t it end well? Who’s to say that they won’t have the synod and then just say that their current teaching is correct and will stand?
 
NextElement said:
Why couldn’t it end well? Who’s to say that they won’t have the synod and then just say that their current teaching is correct and will stand?
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Well, yes, that could happen and that would be great, I just don’t think it’s very likely given all the things that have been said (though I hope I’m wrong and you’re right ;)).
 
ProVobis said:
The only analogy I can offer is from the standpoint of being a coin collector. Every serious one knows that by simply touching the coin it may diminish the value of the coin substantially. Whether you know about it or not doesn’t change that fact. Particles always come (or “rub”) off and if a trained eye can see it, that’s good enough for me. One can appreciate a rare coin by not touching it; in fact that’s the best way to show respect for its intrinsic value. And it’s not even sacred.
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I had always thought that was due to acid… Regardless, it’s an excellent analogy. Thank you for that. I absolutely do not want to denigrate the practice of receiving on the tongue. It’s a beautiful practice, and I would absolutely encourage anyone to receive on the tongue.
 
MacBP said:
I had always thought that was due to acid… Regardless, it’s an excellent analogy. Thank you for that. I absolutely do not want to denigrate the practice of receiving on the tongue. It’s a beautiful practice, and I would absolutely encourage anyone to receive on the tongue.
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👍
Somewhere in cyberspace there is a youtube video illustrating the placing of unconsecrated hosts on a black velvet cloth. (Getting back to your macroscopic crumbs.) :eek: Also as Bsp Schneider points out in the video Mark posted many things have been permitted in the Church that later have been determined to be damaging.
 
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