boy did the pope call that one.

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Has he ever shown you the keys?😃

Princess Diana was an amazing person who used her position to do immense good in the world. She drew the world’s attention to the AIDS crisis, to the plight of the poor, to the scourge of landmines. Her personal life was not perfect, but how many of us could stand the level of scrutiny she had? She was an excellent mother.

There will be pope after pope. A Princess Diana comes along only once.
Well, the whole Shy Di vs pope thing is ridiculous, but I do have to point out one obvious flaw in your share of the argument.

Pope after pope. Princess after princess. 😃
 
This is a good point, OP. Too many people center their lives around money or their profession. Too many Chief Executives build their company around cutting every corner for a quick buck. It’s when you lose your ethics, your business morals, that surely bad things come. If the people would just listen to the wise men… Muhammad even had an economic system under Shari’a law that made asking for interest a punishable offense.

We need to refocus ourselves and our economy. Refocus from unethical practices to make the quick buck.
f

OK. And since I’m sure you know that Christians are to be examples to others and that you wouldn’t expect others to do somethign that you aren’t willing to do yourself, you start. Refuse to accept any interest on your savings. šŸ˜‰
 
Nope, you are mistaken about your own Catholic Beliefs. According to the RCC, they are the authority to forgive sins and also to excommunicate. Also, through apostolic succession, every pope has that authority and he passes the authority to forgive down to the priests.

Utterly ridiculous of course in my mind Christ would give such power to any sin tainted person, especially Peter, the arrogant, power grasping one.

Seems I know more about RCC dogma than you do.
Yep! You sure seem to know a lot of things. But you fail to put them into proper use.:nope:

(Look, see! You’re banned… with only 50+ posts???):eek:

Peace but Truth is morer important.šŸ™‚
 
The financial meltdown and recession we’ve had is primarily due to the silly notion that everyone is cut out to own a home, should, and will own a home. De-regulating the housing/mortgage industries opened up the gates of hell where lenders were giving loans that were absurd to people who could never really afford them. Dumb buyers purchased homes at ultra low ARM mortgages thinking somehow that ā€œadjustableā€ really meant ā€œpermanent.ā€ Deadbeats who had previously defaulted on loans and who had lousy credit histories were given big $$$ to buy a home and every Tom, Dick, and Harry went along for the ride. It boiled down to stupidity, pure greed, deregulation with socialist intentions, and finally a mass exodus of people who couldn’t make their payments walking away in foreclosure. Banks couldn’t handle the mass foreclosures and ate it, wouldn’t lend out to small businesses, businesses cut back, profits from the big corporations plummeted, stocks tumbled, people were out of work and it was like dominoes. It all started with the foolish idea that everyone deserves to own a home and the liberal agenda of trying to level a playing field loan-wise for people who have lousy credit histories. I hope we’ve learned from the idiocy that took place in the mortgage/banking industries!
 
The financial meltdown and recession we’ve had is primarily due to the silly notion that everyone is cut out to own a home, should, and will own a home. De-regulating the housing/mortgage industries opened up the gates of hell where lenders were giving loans that were absurd to people who could never really afford them. Dumb buyers purchased homes at ultra low ARM mortgages thinking somehow that ā€œadjustableā€ really meant ā€œpermanent.ā€ Deadbeats who had previously defaulted on loans and who had lousy credit histories were given big $$$ to buy a home and every Tom, Dick, and Harry went along for the ride. It boiled down to stupidity, pure greed, deregulation with socialist intentions, and finally a mass exodus of people who couldn’t make their payments walking away in foreclosure. Banks couldn’t handle the mass foreclosures and ate it, wouldn’t lend out to small businesses, businesses cut back, profits from the big corporations plummeted, stocks tumbled, people were out of work and it was like dominoes. It all started with the foolish idea that everyone deserves to own a home and the liberal agenda of trying to level a playing field loan-wise for people who have lousy credit histories. I hope we’ve learned from the idiocy that took place in the mortgage/banking industries!
I agree with alot of what you are saying, and I think you see alot of my point. Pure greed was the big thing. While I must say to alot of People who never had a chance to have a home were inocent also. They believed what the people told them, especially realtors, why rent buy, of course, they got a sale. And some of these people were good people, and saw it as their last hope of the dream of owning a home. I feel sorry for them.

But its the people who knew, deep iniside and really didn’t care. The loan officer got credit to make that loan, a bonus for him, the realtor got commission. etc. They knew all along these people were going to fail, and could care less. They felt hey, no big deal we sell the same house in 2 years, more commission. Not all of them, there are good ones too, who tried to tell people, don;t get me wrong. But the greedy ones are who I am talking about.

But what they forgot to tell them is what our parents told us, THis is what your payment will be in 5 years, and what if the ecomomy does not pick up. what about taxes, car insurance, gas, elec. cable. There were alot of sitting ducks out there too, who were good people, that just were not real smart. Or beat up so bad in life that really saw a chance to succeed.

While I took a fixed mortgage, because I was used to the bottom to fall out. And look how long var. stayed low. I would have been better off for a number of years to do it.

But my point was and still is we quit caring about eachother, all we thought of was number one, and now we are all paying the price. And will for a long time.

But it us who maybe did not prey on the inocent feel for them, and pray for them have our faith to suffer with them, because we are all paying the price rather we made money or not.

But again my point, we will make it, we have our faith and a clear conscience. But the greed of others made us all suffer.

And I agree with your Kalt many many are inocent. But it goes back to the ones who wanted that money, and got it. Like the Pope said it just isn’t going to work.

Its because we put the Almighty Dollar above the Almighty lord. It wll come back and bite you every time.
 
I believe everyone deserves to own their own home.
But i know not every one is going to be able to own their own home.
You are right, its sad but true, And what is worse is now our kids may never own a home.

It was all keep up with the Jones, well now we all became the Jones and we are all in the same boat. The sinking one.

BUt unfortunately the rich will still have their money, because this is their world, we will get by. But we are the rich, because we have our house build on Rock. And like Jesus our world is the next. So we will help eachother, pray for eachother and struggle with eachother. And we will have Love, and see that we were the rich after all.

We will finally learn Money can’t buy me Love!!
 
The financial meltdown and recession we’ve had is primarily due to the silly notion that everyone is cut out to own a home, should, and will own a home. De-regulating the housing/mortgage industries opened up the gates of hell where lenders were giving loans that were absurd to people who could never really afford them. Dumb buyers purchased homes at ultra low ARM mortgages thinking somehow that ā€œadjustableā€ really meant ā€œpermanent.ā€ Deadbeats who had previously defaulted on loans and who had lousy credit histories were given big $$$ to buy a home and every Tom, Dick, and Harry went along for the ride. It boiled down to stupidity, pure greed, deregulation with socialist intentions, and finally a mass exodus of people who couldn’t make their payments walking away in foreclosure. Banks couldn’t handle the mass foreclosures and ate it, wouldn’t lend out to small businesses, businesses cut back, profits from the big corporations plummeted, stocks tumbled, people were out of work and it was like dominoes. It all started with the foolish idea that everyone deserves to own a home and the liberal agenda of trying to level a playing field loan-wise for people who have lousy credit histories. I hope we’ve learned from the idiocy that took place in the mortgage/banking industries!
People believed that they could buy a house, even though they had no money to pay for it.

Some thought that they could sell it, thinking that the prices were going to always go up, taking the profit to put into a house they could keep. These were the speculators, and they weren’t just people in the real estate business. Many were everyday people hoping to make some money. They took a risk and lost.

Some were so used to being given things, that being given a mortgage and a house didn’t seem ridiculous. We’re talking about people who were given food cards, school clothes, school supplies, health care, housing or housing assistance, free education, free bus passes, etc. Was it really a huge stretch to think that someone was letting them buy a house, too? And that somehow someone would take care of everything for them, including the mortgage? And we saw some of that during the last presidential election - people thinking that their mortgages would be paid for them if Obama was elected.
 
You are right, its sad but true, And what is worse is now our kids may never own a home.

It was all keep up with the Jones, well now we all became the Jones and we are all in the same boat. The sinking one.

BUt unfortunately the rich will still have their money, because this is their world, we will get by. But we are the rich, because we have our house build on Rock. And like Jesus our world is the next. So we will help eachother, pray for eachother and struggle with eachother. And we will have Love, and see that we were the rich after all.

We will finally learn Money can’t buy me Love!!
Some people thought they were being smart about their money. Their houses were appreciating in value at unprecedented rates. They took 2nd mortgages for home improvements. When the housing market stalled and then sank, they were left with mortgages that totalled more than the value of the house. But it made sense at the time - use the value of your house to make improvements to increase the value of your house.

We actually needed some home improvements (not to add value but to keep the roof from leaking, etc. šŸ™‚ ), but waited until we had the cash to pay for them. I just didn’t want to pay another mortgage. It wasn’t smart planning, really, just aversion to monthly bills.

If I knew then… I would have sold my house at the high, taken a small apartment, and I would have bought a really nice house last Spring.
 
Hi Rinnie,
I’m in full agreement with you, too. Greed instead of trust in the Lord and a good dose of common sense made the whole issue implode. The entitlement mentality is a killer. I know there were ā€œpredatory lendersā€ as they called them, but honestly it was the deregulation and the entitlement mentality that made ā€œpredatoryā€ lending available. And the lenders by and large were not predators. The buyers have to have been living under a rock or be, as my dad says, ā€œdumb as a postā€ to not understand what an adjustable mortgage is!? I’ve sat down with many lenders over the years and my wife used to be a realtor, and not once have I heard a lender NOT explain the difference to buyers. You’d have to be a real dipstick to not see the writing on the wall.
Communism is a sickening philosophy and so is out of control capitalism. This was the marriage of both. On one hand you have liberals (socialists) trying to force our culture to lend to people who have no business whatsoever being loaned money! On the other end are the insanely out of control capitalists ready to exploit and jump on the $$$ and milk/fleece the system. Double whammy!

I better quit while I’m ahead. I brought up my thoughts about daycare (opposed lol) a while back and had the fight of the century lol…
I agree with alot of what you are saying, and I think you see alot of my point. Pure greed was the big thing. While I must say to alot of People who never had a chance to have a home were inocent also. They believed what the people told them, especially realtors, why rent buy, of course, they got a sale. And some of these people were good people, and saw it as their last hope of the dream of owning a home. I feel sorry for them.

But its the people who knew, deep iniside and really didn’t care. The loan officer got credit to make that loan, a bonus for him, the realtor got commission. etc. They knew all along these people were going to fail, and could care less. They felt hey, no big deal we sell the same house in 2 years, more commission. Not all of them, there are good ones too, who tried to tell people, don;t get me wrong. But the greedy ones are who I am talking about.

But what they forgot to tell them is what our parents told us, THis is what your payment will be in 5 years, and what if the ecomomy does not pick up. what about taxes, car insurance, gas, elec. cable. There were alot of sitting ducks out there too, who were good people, that just were not real smart. Or beat up so bad in life that really saw a chance to succeed.

While I took a fixed mortgage, because I was used to the bottom to fall out. And look how long var. stayed low. I would have been better off for a number of years to do it.

But my point was and still is we quit caring about eachother, all we thought of was number one, and now we are all paying the price. And will for a long time.

But it us who maybe did not prey on the inocent feel for them, and pray for them have our faith to suffer with them, because we are all paying the price rather we made money or not.

But again my point, we will make it, we have our faith and a clear conscience. But the greed of others made us all suffer.

And I agree with your Kalt many many are inocent. But it goes back to the ones who wanted that money, and got it. Like the Pope said it just isn’t going to work.

Its because we put the Almighty Dollar above the Almighty lord. It wll come back and bite you every time.
 
Well, the whole Shy Di vs pope thing is ridiculous, but I do have to point out one obvious flaw in your share of the argument.

Pope after pope. Princess after princess. 😃
I would make the same argument about Mother Theresa. She was truly a unique individual who rose to prominence because of her own personality. The thing there isn’t a situation where we have princess after princess. OK we do, but its hard to name any of the others. That is my point, however unartfully stated.

blah blah blah
 
Has he ever shown you the keys?😃

Princess Diana was an amazing person who used her position to do immense good in the world. She drew the world’s attention to the AIDS crisis, to the plight of the poor, to the scourge of landmines. Her personal life was not perfect, but how many of us could stand the level of scrutiny she had? She was an excellent mother.

There will be pope after pope. A Princess Diana comes along only once.
See, the problem with that last line is you single out Princess Di, but not each Pope. Of course there will be a succession of Popes, from St. Peter until the end of time. But there will only be one Benedict XVI. There was certainly only one John Paul II. You mash them together as if each Pope is some bland, faceless politician. Most of the non-Catholic public is aware of the greatness of JPII. But what about Our Holy Father, Benedict? Are you aware of the brilliant theology this man wrote as a Cardinal? Jesus of Nazareth was a phenomenal defense of the true Jesus of Christianity, a beautiful contrast to the modern ā€œscholarsā€ who doubt that Jesus existed, performed miracles, was indeed divine, etc. He also debated (with unbelievable success) many liberal and atheistic philosophers of Italy, and his logic is untouchable. John Paul was the great philosopher, Benedict is a theological genius.

Yes, not every Pope has been as wonderful as the last couple, but it’s not as if they are appointed as a figurehead to mindlessly say ā€œI’m the Pope, I’m infallible, blah blah blahā€. Each one is an individual who has done much to enrich and protect our Holy Faith. I’m with the original poster, I’ll take JPII or Benedict XVI over Princess Diana any day. (Not to say anything against her, but this is just an illogical comparison, IMHO)

Pax et caritas,
Frank
 
Old Testament lineage;
God>>Adam>>Abe>>Isaac… >>Solomon>>>David>>…>>God! (The Son)

New Testament lineage;
God>>Pete>>Linus>>>Clement…>>Gregory>>Pius>>…>>Ben16>>…>>God!(Son)

All else in between are efforts to ensure the roof doesn’t leak and the rain hits your face while you sleep!

To be financially responsible is one thing. To hoard money to retire in luxury or financial security is to presume that you will live that long!..and to imagine that that will actually provide you ā€˜security’ in some kind of logevity in comfort!

I agree with the OP.

Put money away for your kids and build ā€˜trusts’ for your family’s future! Not for yourselves! But ALWAYS know that He has the final say and remain in constant ā€˜contact’ with Him. Keep an eye on that lineage above.

The cemetries are full of the wealthy alongiside the poor. Only the worms can tell the difference!

:cool:
 
[SIGN][/SIGN]
See, the problem with that last line is you single out Princess Di, but not each Pope. Of course there will be a succession of Popes, from St. Peter until the end of time. But there will only be one Benedict XVI. There was certainly only one John Paul II. You mash them together as if each Pope is some bland, faceless politician. Most of the non-Catholic public is aware of the greatness of JPII. But what about Our Holy Father, Benedict? Are you aware of the brilliant theology this man wrote as a Cardinal? [SIGN]Jesus of Nazareth[/SIGN] was a phenomenal defense of the true Jesus of Christianity, a beautiful contrast to the modern ā€œscholarsā€ who doubt that Jesus existed, performed miracles, was indeed divine, etc. He also debated (with unbelievable success) many liberal and atheistic philosophers of Italy, and his logic is untouchable. John Paul was the great philosopher, Benedict is a theological genius.

Yes, not every Pope has been as wonderful as the last couple, but it’s not as if they are appointed as a figurehead to mindlessly say ā€œI’m the Pope, I’m infallible, blah blah blahā€. Each one is an individual who has done much to enrich and protect our Holy Faith. I’m with the original poster, I’ll take JPII or Benedict XVI over Princess Diana any day. (Not to say anything against her, but this is just an illogical comparison, IMHO)

Pax et caritas,
Frank
That is my very favorite book in the world. That was awesome. The man is so smart, and yet so touchable. He is someone you feel you could welcome into your home and really enjoy.

Now Pope JPll, now believe it or not he looked EXACTLY like my Dad. He is always going to be my favorite not only because of the great love I had for my Dad and for him, but because he was so kind, and loving to all the world,

But Benedict is running a real close second.
 
See, the problem with that last line is you single out Princess Di, but not each Pope. Of course there will be a succession of Popes, from St. Peter until the end of time. But there will only be one Benedict XVI. There was certainly only one John Paul II. You mash them together as if each Pope is some bland, faceless politician. Most of the non-Catholic public is aware of the greatness of JPII. But what about Our Holy Father, Benedict? Are you aware of the brilliant theology this man wrote as a Cardinal? Jesus of Nazareth was a phenomenal defense of the true Jesus of Christianity, a beautiful contrast to the modern ā€œscholarsā€ who doubt that Jesus existed, performed miracles, was indeed divine, etc. He also debated (with unbelievable success) many liberal and atheistic philosophers of Italy, and his logic is untouchable. John Paul was the great philosopher, Benedict is a theological genius.

Yes, not every Pope has been as wonderful as the last couple, but it’s not as if they are appointed as a figurehead to mindlessly say ā€œI’m the Pope, I’m infallible, blah blah blahā€. Each one is an individual who has done much to enrich and protect our Holy Faith. I’m with the original poster, I’ll take JPII or Benedict XVI over Princess Diana any day. (Not to say anything against her, but this is just an illogical comparison, IMHO)

Pax et caritas,
Frank
Can I be Frank with you Frank?

Your pope may impress you, and that is wonderful. Your preferences are wonderful for you. Don’t force them down anyone else’s throat.
 
Can I be Frank with you Frank?

Your pope may impress you, and that is wonderful. Your preferences are wonderful for you. Don’t force them down anyone else’s throat.
Don’t think anyone is trying to do that here. I could be wrong, but I haven’t read one thing that forces a pope upon another in this thread. I think the OP is right, the pope called it. Does it really make a difference that it was a Pope? I could have said the same thing about the world a few years back, and it would have been cool for my friends to now say ā€œWow, Matt called that oneā€. It’s just a statement, but in this case, it happens to be true. The Pope called it. Course, didn’t take a genius to figure it out. We Americans are ****** about our lifestyle, and it finally caught up with us. It’s going to take a long time before our world is okay again…God help us all.
 
Can I be Frank with you Frank?

Your pope may impress you, and that is wonderful. Your preferences are wonderful for you. Don’t force them down anyone else’s throat.
SJ speak for yourself huh. Frank talk all you want. I am enjoying hearing how much you show your love for our Great Pope. And I agree.

tell me SJ why does Franks talking about how he admires the last 2 Popes bother you so much?
 
f

OK. And since I’m sure you know that Christians are to be examples to others and that you wouldn’t expect others to do somethign that you aren’t willing to do yourself, you start. Refuse to accept any interest on your savings. šŸ˜‰
I’m not muslim. Nor do I prescribe to Shari’a law.
 
Can I be Frank with you Frank?

Your pope may impress you, and that is wonderful. Your preferences are wonderful for you. Don’t force them down anyone else’s throat.
Sure, you may be frank, but it would be nice if you wouldn’t put words in my mouth and misinterpret what I said. Believe me, the fact that Benedict XVI is the successor of Peter is more than enough to impress me, and I did not post my comment to show how impressed I am, let alone shove an opinion down anyone’s throat. Where in the world did you get that?

My post was in response to Princess Diana being called a wonderful individual, and ā€œpope after popeā€ being used as a generalization, as if the line of popes have been inhuman figureheads. The point of my post was to establish that popes can be great or not, but they are certainly not monotonous, and they should not be addressed as such. If I were to say ā€œpresidents of the United States will always come and go, but there’s only one Michael Jacksonā€, well that’s ridiculous, and is similar to what was said. The two are completely unrelated, and this comment makes it seem as if Abraham Lincoln and Andrew Johnson, Thomas Jefferson and Herbert Hoover, were all just random names that happened to be president.

My point was that popes are individuals who are picked for their talents and merits, not at random to lead the Church. That’s all, I don’t know where I came off as pushy in my views. No offense meant.

Pax et caritas,
Frank
 
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