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edwest2
Guest
Being gay does not mean what? Are you joking?
bleedingcool.com/2013/05/20/archie-comics-first-gay-kiss-as-a-result-of-one-million-moms/
Wake up, people.
Peace,
Ed
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bleedingcool.com/2013/05/20/archie-comics-first-gay-kiss-as-a-result-of-one-million-moms/
Wake up, people.
Peace,
Ed
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Bookcat
Guest
Some thoughts.
There are certainly problems with the decision (I was not in favor of the change in membership policy).
It is for example problematic and unfair that those with same sex attractions etc will be due to the nature of the activities - at times in circumstances which will not assist their virtue but can prove contrary to such.
But there is also good aspects.
It is good that they uphold the policy regarding leaders.
"The applicant must possess the moral, educational, and emotional qualities that the Boy Scouts of America deems necessary to afford positive leadership to youth. The applicant must also be the correct age, subscribe to the precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle (duty to God), and abide by the Scout Oath and the Scout Law.
… we do not grant membership to individuals who are open or avowed homosexuals or who engage in behavior that would become a distraction to the mission of the BSA."
It is good that they affirm:
“Scouting is a youth program, and any sexual conduct, whether homosexual or heterosexual, by youth of Scouting age is contrary to the virtues of Scouting”
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StJudeprayforme
Guest
I like Cardinal Ratzinger was under the impression that homosexual persons are not animals and thus have the ability to control their sexual urges.Being gay does not mean what? Are you joking?
bleedingcool.com/2013/05/20/archie-comics-first-gay-kiss-as-a-result-of-one-million-moms/
Wake up, people.
Peace,
Ed
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wynnejj
Guest
The BSA is non-sectarian but “insists” that religious faiths instil moral values on its youth per the 1911 edition of the Boy Scout Handbook under the section “A Boy Scout’s Religion”.But that isn’t the root problem. By officially endorsing gay members, the BSA is also officially endorsing gay actions. It sets precedent.
Faith-based organizations are re-visiting homosexual mores, rightly or wrongly.
The Scout Law includes “Reverence” which includes respect for other religions & customs.
Taking a neutral position on gay rights is consistent with their idea of “reverence”.
However, if taking a neutral position requires enforcing a neutral position on its chartered organization, and meets a faith-based organization that is obliged not to be neutral, then there is a potential conflict.
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StJudeprayforme
Guest
Probably not.I was never a scout. would they kick you [meaning, the editorial “you”] out for smoking a reefer at a time or place when you’re not being a scout? having a beer? or just saying you liked reefers or beer?
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Bookcat
Guest
But that isn’t the root problem. By officially endorsing gay members, the BSA is also officially endorsing gay actions. It sets precedent.
Some thoughts.
There are certainly problems with the decision (I was not in favor of the change in membership policy).
It is for example problematic and unfair that those with same sex attractions etc will be due to the nature of the activities - at times in circumstances which will not assist their virtue but can prove contrary to such.
But there is also good aspects.
It is good that they uphold the policy regarding leaders.
"The applicant must possess the moral, educational, and emotional qualities that the Boy Scouts of America deems necessary to afford positive leadership to youth. The applicant must also be the correct age, subscribe to the precepts of the Declaration of Religious Principle (duty to God), and abide by the Scout Oath and the Scout Law.
… we do not grant membership to individuals who are open or avowed homosexuals or who engage in behavior that would become a distraction to the mission of the BSA."
It is good that they affirm:
"Scouting is a youth program, and any sexual conduct, whether homosexual or heterosexual, by youth of Scouting age is contrary to the virtues of Scouting"
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Ridgerunner
Guest
Where in the BSA application process is there a question about sexual orientation? Never having been a scout, I wouldn’t know, but I suspect the question is not on it.Political motivation can sometimes lead to good ends. The unjust discrimination is preventing someone from being part of an organization based solely on his sexual orientation. If the adult leaders know anything about the teen’s sex life, that is an issue. I have no idea why everyone here is assuming that the “gay scouts” are all having sex.
If not, it was always possible for a “gay” young person to be a scout. So what has changed here? It can only be that it is now policy that one can be overtly homosexual and still be in the scouts.
If so, I truly think the scouts are done for.
Like some others, I have lived in the Bible Belt all my life. When I was a child, nobody knew anybody who was openly homosexual, though we undoubtedly knew somebody who was homosexual and didn’t make an issue of it any more than we knew anyone who went around telling people what he enjoyed doing with his wife, sexually.
In high school there were some who were believed to be homosexual. Nobody harassed them, but neither did they talk about being homosexual any more than some kid thought it appropriate to explain to others what, perhaps, he might do in his bedroom with a Playboy magazine.
If I understand the scout policy change, the scouts have officially endorsed the “right” of some scout to openly declare himself inclined to sodomy. Perhaps the scouts will also officially endorse the right of some scout to declare himself a wanker or a lover of pornography. And just maybe nobody will be turned off by either thing and not join the sc outs, and maybe parents will think it’s great that their sons will be exposed to either or both.
But I have my doubts. I think the scouts will join the dustbin of history fairly soon.
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edwest2
Guest
Would you like a list of all the gay marriage organizations? Do you believe none of those getting ‘married’ aren’t going to have sex?I like Cardinal Ratzinger was under the impression that homosexual persons are not animals and thus have the ability to control their sexual urges.
“not animals”? Please don’t put words in my mouth.
The whole point of gay marriage is legalizing gay sex as being 100% the same as heterosexual sex. Biology tells us otherwise.
Peace,
Ed
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EvangelCatholic
Guest
How do homosexual urges happen?Would you like a list of all the gay marriage organizations? Do you believe none of those getting ‘married’ aren’t going to have sex?
“not animals”? Please don’t put words in my mouth.
The whole point of gay marriage is legalizing gay sex as being 100% the same as heterosexual sex. Biology tells us otherwise.
Peace,
Ed
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BroomWagon
Guest
Dishonorable Homosexualized Boy Scouts of America Leadership smacks down super-majority of BSA- Holy Souls Hermitage
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StJudeprayforme
Guest
Who is talking about gay marriage here? Of course people are going to have sex in a “gay marriage”. Right now we are talking about the scouts!Would you like a list of all the gay marriage organizations? Do you believe none of those getting ‘married’ aren’t going to have sex?
“not animals”? Please don’t put words in my mouth.
The whole point of gay marriage is legalizing gay sex as being 100% the same as heterosexual sex. Biology tells us otherwise.
Peace,
Ed
I know plenty of chaste gay people who don’t have sex and have no intent of getting a “gay marriage”. Being gay ≠ to having sex or support for gay marriage.
I was not putting words in your mouth. Sorry if it came off this way. I was alluding to Card. Ratzinger’s assertion that the liberty that characterizes a human person means that a homosexual person has the liberty to make choices too. If a person does not have this liberty, they are essentially animals responding to instinct.
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rlg94086
Guest
A chaste boy is just that…a boy…not a “gay.” Announcing you are a gay is like announcing you are a masturbater.so what if he just announces he’s gay and that’s all the “evidence” there’s gonna be. maybe he’s not practicing. maybe he’s a chaste gay. maybe he’s a full fledged gay. maybe he’s pushing buttons because he can, or maybe because he takes an ethical position that people shouldn’t be punished for what they are, only for what they do.
kick him out?
What is a “full fledged gay?” Don’t tell me they are going to have badges for it…
Jumping in late here, away from the computer:
“Well, Johnny, I understand you have SSA, and, as a Catholic, I believe that it’s not a sin.”
“But, you see, because [parents are afraid you’ll make the other boys “turn gay”? or we don’t like these other people with their wicked evil “gay agenda”? or some other reason?], you’ll have to leave the Scouts.”
Doesn’t make sense to me either.
This is about boys. Whatever you might think about “these people” and their “agenda,” I can’t see punishing a boy for something he didn’t cause.
Practice what you preach, my friend. Can you look a 10 yr old boy in the eyes and tell him he is “evil” because he has homosexual tendencies? If you can then God have mercy on your soul.
I sure can’t.No. 403 asks a good question.
Can you look a 10 yr old boy in the eyes and tell him he is “evil” because he has homosexual tendencies? If you can then God have mercy on your soul.
“Well, Johnny, I understand you have SSA, and, as a Catholic, I believe that it’s not a sin.”
“But, you see, because [parents are afraid you’ll make the other boys “turn gay”? or we don’t like these other people with their wicked evil “gay agenda”? or some other reason?], you’ll have to leave the Scouts.”
Doesn’t make sense to me either.
This is about boys. Whatever you might think about “these people” and their “agenda,” I can’t see punishing a boy for something he didn’t cause.
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Fairwinds
Guest
from that site:[citing Dishonorable Homosexualized Boy Scouts of America Leadership smacks down super-majority of BSA- Holy Souls Hermitage in no: 420]
(emphasis added)You know, the BSA is now like the Rainbow Sash crowd.** If any** Rainbow Sash crowd or any** Boy Scouts showed up for Holy Communion, I would not administer Holy Communion to them, for they are swearing to uphold the homosexualized Boy Scout Law**, which is now about celebrating how great homosexuality is, against the natural law, the teaching of Scripture and the Church. The BSA has made itself enemies of the Church.
someone’s choo-choo just rolled off the tracks.
meltzerboy
New member
Why does the fact that gay boys are admitted to the boy scouts now make it a gay group? OTOH, it will indeed become a gay group only if parents of straight boys prevent them from joining the troop just because gay boys are permitted to be members.Hard to know just how this will affect the scouts in the longer term.
Having once been a young boy and a young man, having raised a son and now having several grandsons, my guess is that this is the end of the scouts.
No boy or young man wants to identify with a group that other boys or young men will consider a “gay group”, unless they, too, are homosexual.
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wynnejj
Guest
This is what I consider the insidious side of the new change proposal. Two self-professed gay boy scouts meet after the scouting event and publicly kiss out of uniform. You look at the picture and, many look at it like at it like Lady & the Tramp sharing a spaghetti noodle. Can a Catholic troop allow this type of moral relativism about homosexual behaviour?Being gay does not mean what? Are you joking?
bleedingcool.com/2013/05/20/archie-comics-first-gay-kiss-as-a-result-of-one-million-moms/
Wake up, people.
Peace,
Ed
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Ridgerunner
Guest
It is remarkable to me how people who wish to think of themselves as tolerant, and to be seen as tolerant, so readily paste pejorative terms on others without having the slightest idea what those people think in detail.Seriously, either way the BSA was screwed with the anti gay crowd.
“Homophibic” is one of those terms. It is meant as an insult, equivalent to “bigot”. It is used as indiscriminately as the “N word” was once commonly used. If one is not on all fours with everything the speaker believes, one is simply pasted with the term.
“Anti-gay” is little different. What does that mean? If a person is entirely tolerant of homosexuals in the workplace and society but does not want his children to be in a group that openly declares homosexuality to be equivalent to heterosexuality, even virtuous, is that person still “anti-gay”? What if the person says homosexuality is “gravely disordered”. Is that person “homophobic” or “anti-gay”? That would, of course, include the Popes and the Church as a whole.
Unless the Church is to be condemned (and a lot of this society does so) then over-broad application of such names is rightly to be avoided.
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StJudeprayforme
Guest
From: scouting.org/sitecore/content/MembershipStandards/Resolution/FAQ.aspxThis is what I consider the insidious side of the new change proposal. Two self-professed gay boy scouts meet after the scouting event and publicly kiss out of uniform. You look at the picture and, many look at it like at it like Lady & the Tramp sharing a spaghetti noodle. Can a Catholic troop allow this type of moral relativism about homosexual behaviour?
Membership Resolution Points of Clarification:
- This proposal is in line with the beliefs of most of Scouting’s major religious chartered organizations.
Some have asserted that the proposed change for youth runs counter to values of and raises concerns among Scouting’s religious chartered organizations. We are unaware of any major religious chartered organization that believes a youth member simply stating he or she is attracted to the same sex, but not engaging in sexual activity, should make him or her unwelcome in their congregation.
This proposal reinforces Scouting’s belief that sexual conduct by any Scout, heterosexual or homosexual, is contrary to the virtues of Scouting and is reflective of the beliefs of most of our major religious chartered organizations.
While, if this resolution is passed, no youth may be denied membership in the Boy Scouts of America on the basis of stating their sexual orientation alone, Scouting expects appropriate behavior from all members, which includes sexual conduct, regardless of sexual orientation.
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Ridgerunner
Guest
If the scouts become an organization in which it is considered acceptable for scouts to openly declare themselves homosexual, then in time the whole organization will become limited to homosexuals.Why does the fact that gay boys are admitted to the boy scouts now make it a gay group? OTOH, it will indeed become a gay group only if parents of straight boys prevent them from joining the troop just because gay boys are permitted to be members.
And it won’t just be parents “preventing them” from joining the scouts. There are not many young men who want to be associated with a group that is considered “gay”. I do realize those who want society (and oftentimes, the Church) to consider homosexuality a variant of normal will think differently.
But human nature is still human nature, and the perverse is recognized as perverse whatever official secular mores may declare it to be.
As a Catholic I wouldn’t think that’s right.Two self-professed gay boy scouts meet after the scouting event and publicly kiss out of uniform. You look at the picture and, many look at it like at it like Lady & the Tramp sharing a spaghetti noodle. Can a Catholic troop allow this type of moral relativism about homosexual behaviour?
But two boys could meet after the CYO event, after school, after studying in the library, after football practice. The fair solution wouldn’t be to do away with all those things.
Just because something like that could happen doesn’t seem to justify kicking out any and all of them, whatever the circumstances.
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