Boy Scouts to allow gay youths to join

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No it’s not. Homosexuality is not a mental disorder.

It is not a coded diagnostic entity within the mental heath community. It does not exist.
Just because the DSM has nothing related to reality does not equate to it does not exist. The DSM does not dictate thinking, nor does any therapist that uses the DSM to say so. Reality is reality. The DSM is fantasy.
 
Why is it that people keep approaching this as if gays are sex crazed maniacs lying in wait to molest their friends? It couldn’t be farther from the truth.
Maniacs? That is your word. You are the only one to use it. I approach this the way I do because of our current culture of sex. We do not allow murder of the innocent, except as back-up birth control for the purpose of unfettered sex. We do not allow abuse of children, except for divorce so sex partners can switch, except for allowing pornography in the name of freedom and the explosion of gender definitions to make adults feel better about sexual deviancy. The time was we believed in seven deadly sin. Now if we use the term “immorality” it is almost always used in connotation with sexual immorality. I do not think anyone is a “maniac,” but I do believe that the Enemy has used our week point and we have become a sex-obsessed nation.
 
I was responding to a thread in comments related to the existence of homosexuality as a mental disorder.
My post did not relate to Catholic moral teaching. The mental health community is not an arm of the Church and is not related to questions of Catholic morality. For a licensed psychiatrist, psychologist, social worker, marriage and family counselor, licensed counselor to practice using Catholic moral teaching as a guide would be grossly unethical and abusive to clients.
It is not a mental disorder.
only if you swallow the poppycock propaganda of the DSM, a former president of the American Psychological Association suggests, and I agree, it is a Personality Disorder and that is in the DSM.
 
In Catholicism, any desire for sex that is not in accord with God’s design for marriage is considered disordered. It is concupiscence that is a disorder of our fallen nature. It is not satanic in that sense, but it sure has the potential to be exacerbated by satanic forces if we act on those impulses even a little.
I was once a victim of masturbation, which I attribute to Satan. My experiences while masturbating were well beyond what was considered ‘normal.’ It’s hard to put into words, but something sinister had grabbed a hold of me and controlled my sexual behavior. Same was true for my attraction to porn… after awhile I could feel myself drawn to homosexuality. It was then that I forced myself to abandon masturbation and porn, and my sexuality quickly subsided. (I started taking Paxil during this time which also greatly reduced my libido.) Again, my original attraction to masturbation and porn were far beyond what could be considered ‘normal!’
 
Would the risk of ‘flirting’ diminish if gays had to lie about their sexual orientation?
Yes. Absolutely. When homosexuality was not accepted as just some alternative lifestyle, kids were not attracted to this sort of behavior. I never encountered it once growing up. Now, I see the behavior even in teens.
 
Why do you avoid facing reality that the Church has done some horrible things to people thinking that it was God’s will?
You have generalized “the Church” has done horrible things…things have been done, not by the entire Church, but by those in the Church and one of the most horrible things done in history was done by an Augustinian Monk…just look at what it has produced.
 
If this is the case, then it furthers the truism that extreme cases make for bad policy. Instead of dealing with the one situation and rectifying that, a policy is now in place that will create more difficult situations.
I agree and it is one of the reasons I’m against the new policy. To me, the problem boiled down to … kids are being drummed out by our leadership because we have followed the letter of the law instead of the spirit of the law … so let’s remove the law instead of clarifying the spirit of the law. Kids have a lapse of judgement compounded by leadership that has a lapse of judgement. In a way, the new policy is intended to correct this … objectively, giving no weight to ulterior motives … but it opens a whole gay pride pandora’s box that seeks to legitimize gay lifestyles in the public square through an organization that is an American icon. If mom and apple pie say it ok, it ok.
 
“The National Catholic Committee on Scouting responded cautiously, saying it would assess the possible impact of the change on Catholic-sponsored Scout units”

abc15.com/dpp/news/region_phoenix_metro/central_phoenix/vote-on-gay-boy-scouts-could-be-revealed-thursday
It is odd that some posters even oppose their own church authority since the Roman Catholic and Mormon church hierarchy urged the Boy Scouts to include gay youngsters.
What is odd, is that you stated that Roman Catholic & Mormon church hierarchy urged…urged the Boy Scouts to include gay youngsters…

Who cares what Mormons do. They are not Christians and are not to be considered as providing any evidence for morality. They have a less than stellar stance on Abortion and speak for no one but Mormons.

Perhaps we should consider the likes of Mormons/Lutherans as a body…will that do for you.

You said the Church urged and then you waffle and say …as the news article properly stated…“assess”…a far cry from urge…

This is odd…:eek:
 
Bishop Robert Guglielmone, the USCCB episcopal liaison for the National Catholic Committee on Scouting (NCCS), attended the meeting and wasn’t surprised by the result of the vote.

“I kind of expected that this is the way the vote would go,” Bishop Guglielmone told the Register. “I’m not particularly encouraged by it, but I knew it would happen eventually. As the policy change is right now promoted, we can live with it. Unfortunately, there are many people who are interpreting this policy to go much further than it actually does, particularly in the secular press.”



Bishop Guglielmone believes that the revision is acceptable to Catholics because, in accord with Church teaching, it makes a distinction between same-sex attraction and same-sex actions.

“Church teaching is very clear that the homosexual inclination is not sinful and that same-sex attraction is not immoral,” he says, “but that what we’re dealing with here is the distinction between the inclination and the conduct. The standards remain the same as they always have for scouts. Homosexual activity will not be condoned.”



Bishop Guglielmone, who served as the Holy See’s world chaplain to Catholic scouting for two four-year terms (2000-2008), believes Catholic flight would be a mistake.
“My concern is that we have well over half a million young people in the program,” he said, “and most of those kids are going to stay no matter what happens. We have a real obligation to stay in dialogue and to stay connected to the program.”

Added the bishop, “The leadership of the BSA has made it very clear that they intend to hold the line on adult leaders, but they also said they would hold the line on this issue, so where this could go, I don’t know. That’s why I feel it’s imperative for the Church to continue to be involved. And if it gets to the point where some of our basic issues our threatened — such as being able to pick leaders for Catholic chartered groups or in diminishing the role of religion and God — then we will have to re-evaluate our participation in the program at that time.”

Read more: http://www.ncregister.com/daily-new...lifts-ban-on-homosexual-scouts/#ixzz2UKDMLBjV
 
I don’t think I would normally have a problem with this so long as they are not allowed to promote the immoral lifestyle that some homosexuals live. However, I did read that openly homosexual boys will be allowed to join. Doesn’t that mean that they will be allowed to promote the immoral homosexual lifestyle? This issue is so confusing.
 
On the contrary, there is a connection between Roman Catholic bishops and Mormon bishops. During the Prop 8 campaign in California, Catholics funneled $ to the Mormon Church to pay for anti-gay efforts. It is interesting who Catholics will associate with when it comes to bigotry. Very sad. 😦
Well don’t that beat all…

Are you for same sex marriage?

Do you believe that Homosexuals are born that way?

Do you believe that the only counseling that should be available for homosexuals should be acceptance?

Take your time in answering.
 
On the contrary, there is a connection between Roman Catholic bishops and Mormon bishops. During the Prop 8 campaign in California, Catholics funneled $ to the Mormon Church to pay for anti-gay efforts. It is interesting who Catholics will associate with when it comes to bigotry. Very sad. 😦
Why do you call yourself “EvangelCatholic” when you list your religion as Lutheran? 🤷:confused:
 
Many Lutherans and Anglican synods worldwide view each individual as God’s creation

ELCA on sexuality:

The complexity of human sexuality

**God created human beings to be in relationship with each other and continually blesses us with diverse powers, which we use in living out those relationships. These include powers for action, reasoning, imagination, and creativity.

Sexuality especially involves the powers or capacities to form deep and lasting bonds, to give and receive pleasure, and to conceive and bear children. Sexuality can be integral to the desire to commit oneself to life with another, to touch and be touched, and to love and be loved. Such powers are complex and ambiguous. They can be used well or badly. They can bring astonishing joy and delight. Such powers can serve God and serve the neighbor. They also can hurt self or hurt the neighbor. Sexuality finds expression at the extreme ends of human experience: in love, care, and security, or lust, cold indifference, and exploitation.

Sexuality consists of a rich and diverse combination of relational, emotional, and physical interactions and possibilities. It surely does not consist solely of erotic desire. Erotic desire, in the narrow sense, is only one component of the relational bonds that humans crave as sexual beings. Although not all relationships are sexual, at some level most sexual relationships are about companionship. Although some people may remain single, either intentionally or unintentionally, all people need and delight in companionship, and all are vulnerable to loneliness.

The need to share our lives with others is a profound good (Genesis 2:18). The counsel to love and care for the neighbor is not a command that is foreign to our created natures; rather, reaching out in love and care is part of who we are as relational and sexual beings. Even if we never have sexual intimacy, we all seek and respond to the bonds and needs of relationships.

Sexual love — the complex interplay of longing, erotic attraction, self-giving, and receiving defined by trust — is a wondrous gift. The longing for connection, however, also can render human beings susceptible to pain, isolation, and harm. The desire for sexual love, therefore, does not by itself constitute a moral justification for sexual behavior. Giving and receiving love always involves mixed motives and limited understanding of individual and communal consequences.

The sharing of love and sexual intimacy within the mutuality of a mature and trusting relationship can be a rich source of romance, delight, creativity, imagination, restraint, desire, pleasure, safety, and deep contentment that provides the context for individuals, family, and the community to thrive.

Though sexual love remains God’s good gift, sin permeates human sexuality as it does all of life. When expressed immaturely, irresponsibly, or with hurtful intent, then love — or its counterfeit, coercive power — can lead to harm and even death. Too often lust is mistaken for love, which in turn becomes the rationale for selfish behaviors. When infatuation, lust, and self-gratification take the place of the responsibilities of love, cascading consequences result that can be devastating for partners, children, families, and society.

In recognizing the many ways in which people misuse power and love, we need to be honest about sin and the finite limitations of human beings. We also recognize the complexity of the human and societal forces that drive the desire for companionship, for intimate relation with another, for belonging, and for worth. The deep interconnectedness of the body with the mind and spirit suggests the complexity of such situations. The biblical narratives both rejoice in the splendor of sexual attraction (Song of Songs 4) and are candid about the harm that can result from human sexuality (2 Samuel 11, 13; Matthew 5:27–30). **
Mormons, Jehovah Witness, and the ELCA do not establish or have authority to promote teachings that represent faith and morals to be believed by any Catholic and are interesting however not relevant to Catholic teaching unless they agree with revealed truths.
 
So how do you propose dealing with gay boys in school or on the play field? I guess they were born into “perversity”? What kind of Father would do that to their child?
My God does not make a person gay to be treated as perverse.
at last, the source of the dilema…you have swallowed the Essentialism pill…you believe God created people this way…there is not now or ever been proof of this…a fantasy and a fallacy…
 
So a boy who, for no fault of his own, kisses another boy makes him evil? Do you even know a gay person?
More of the same…we have no reason to take responsibility for our actions if “we are born that way”…wrong…no one is born that way.
 
What we have here are Christians struggling with the mystery of God’s creation. And rigidly denying science and human understand; both of which are gifts from God.
There is no science to prove that God created anyone “gay”…

Human understanding is that there are people with struggles…

You believe, wrongly, that God created people gay.
 
On the contrary, we have the realization that God is love rather than some antiquated distortion of so-called morality. Centuries ago, gays were hanged. Muslims still do that in places like Iran and praise Allah while murdering God’s creation. For some Christians to be in kinship with savagery is a grievous sin.
So what. Protestants and Catholics performed atrocities in the name of Christ. They killed people in Salem because they thought they were witches. What does this have to do with anything.
 
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