Bruce Jenner's Début as "Caitlyn"

[Jeanne_S]

S

Exactamundo.

I second that.

 

[Sy_Noe]

BUT if you have a ‘faith understanding’ that says X is Y, and someone has a’different faith understanding’ that X is not Y, those are two completely opposite things. One must be true, and the other not true.

If my faith understanding says that same sex marriage is disordered, and yours says, 'no it isn’t", well, ONE of us must be right, and the other MUST be wrong. There are no two ways about it. You cannot have a truth that “SSM is wrong for me because I’m a Catholic Christian, but it’s OK for somebody who is a Protestant, or a secular humanist, because they’re fine with it. Hey, it’s even all right if I’m a Catholic who is CONVINCED the Church is wrong, because of my 'well formed conscience”. Truth doesn’t work that way.

A person might be perfectly sincere and perfectly convinced of truth–and still be wrong. What are we to do, sit back and say nothing and let them carry on deluding themselves and others?

Bottom line is, if you argue that ‘nobody can really know truth for sure’, you’ve fallen victim to relativism and indifferentism. There is never a real answer, and people can just splash about in whatever pool of ‘personal truth’ or ‘conscience’ they choose. Everybody is his or her own pope with a direct line to the Holy Spirit to guide them to whatever they want to make their personal truth.

Of course one may be right and the other not or neither. No one has fallen victim or made themselves Pope. Because the bottom line is differing views and beliefs are just a fact of faith. That’s why the world has so many different ones. But you missed the point. No one said sit back. People of differing views or beliefs can voice their views and beliefs. But it can be done with some humility and charity.

 

[retire_early]

Astrology is not useful for anything, be they excuses or explanations.

Ya mean they don’t still use “What’s your sign, baby?” as a pick-up line at the singles bar?

 

[meltzerboy]

I don’t get how this is brave? Brave is opposing this. If you are gay or a man who thinks he is a woman you are celebrated by our culture.

Things are changing quickly. Our culture is completely unhinged. The frightening thing is I can’t imagine what they’ll be pushing ten years from now.

I don’t think transgender people are celebrated by our culture…not yet, anyway. There is still a lot of shame attached to gender identity issues (gender dysphoria) by both the person who has them, as well as their family and friends. Even some members of the gay community, who should know better, are not very comfortable with the idea. But the times they are a-changing.

Perhaps ten years from now, trans-species will be fashionable. (Sorry for the levity to those who think it inappropriate. I realize this is a serious issue, especially for those who suffer from the disorder.)

 

[meltzerboy]

He also said,he is still attracted to women,not men…

Apparently, gender identity and sexual orientation are not the same thing. It’s hard even for mental health professionals to fully understand the connections as well as the differences between the two.

 

[DeniseNY]

So childless unmarried woman aren’t really women either than because we haven’t earned it. Got it.

Unfortunately, we’re looked at as “lesser than” in some circles.

 

[a_priori]

“Sex change” is biologically impossible. People who undergo sex-reassignment surgery do not change from men to women or vice versa. Rather, they become feminized men or masculinized women." --Dr. Paul McHugh, former Chief Psychiatrist, Johns Hopkins

 

[qui_est_ce]

I’m liking Matt Walsh more and more lately. He’s right, of course. No amount of physical mutilation can make a man into a woman. It makes me sick that people are expected to feed into the delusion of a crazy man. Those that don’t fall in line are called bigots It’s sad the way that the media has started to refer to Bruce as a she.

He’s spot on and gives sound logic for his views. The only vitriol I’ve ever seen is in people who disagree with him.

 

[pepipop]

The latest photos of ‘glamorous’ Caitlin Jenner.

Funny how at 65, a transgender male to female never favour the blue rinse and frumpy clothes look (not insinuating older women should be this way ) - but it’s always to appear as much younger ‘females’, plastered in make-up, in sexual clothes i.e. a corset at 65?

Maybe someone should tell him/her, he’s fewer years left than he has already lived - before he/she will be a long time staring at the coffin lid!

*‘I’m the new normal’: Caitlyn Jenner lets the cameras in on beauty regime as she transforms from Bruce and reveals how Vanity Fair shoot was ‘best day of my life’

‘Maybe this is my greatest calling in my life,’ she says. ‘Be honest with myself, be honest with my family - maybe end up helping other people.’
She adds: ‘So many people go through life and they never deal with their own issues. How many people go through life and waste their entire life because they never deal with themselves, who they are?’ *

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3109187/I-m-new-normal-Glamorous-Caitlyn-Jenner-applies-make-scenes-upcoming-documentary.html

 

[exnihilo]

Here’s the problem and this applies to what Christine said earlier about it as well in reply to DaddyGirl. Others may reason and have a different faith and understanding as to what Jesus meant. You hope that you speak the truth. You speak what you believe to know the truth is. And others with a different understanding do as well.

Yes, I I believe I know the truth. I also believe I can be reasoned with and shown errors in my thinking. If I’m wrong people can show me how I’m wrong. Radical skepticism and relativism seem to only apply to orthodoxy.

 

[gracepoole]

He’s spot on and gives sound logic for his views. The only vitriol I’ve ever seen is in people who disagree with him.

Sorry – that answer’s an overly simplified over-generalization.

My son is 2 and has for several months self-identified as a tyrannosaurus rex. Should I rewatch “Jurassic Park” to get ideas on how to raise an extinct reptile? Or should I assume he’s a small child and small children have active imaginations and a very tenuous grasp on reality? I think I prefer the second option, although the moment he sprouts into a five ton lizard and tries to eat my car, I’ll certainly reconsider.

Bruce Jenner has a male anatomy, male chromosomes, male DNA, male hormones, a male bone structure, and male reproductive organs. He is a male. He can never be anything but a male. He is not a woman “for all intents and purposes,” for the same reason that I am not an antelope or a pine cone for all intents and purposes. Indeed, it is specifically my “intents and purposes” that make me neither a pine cone nor an antelope and Jenner neither a woman nor “transgendered.”

theblaze.com/contributions/bruce-jenner-is-not-a-woman-he-is-a-sick-and-delusional-man/

As I said earlier, this rhetoric isn’t helping. I’m part of a Catholic moms group and one of our members is a loyal, faithful Catholic whose stepdaughter has identified as transgender in the last year. This family is in agony as it attempts to thoughtfully, lovingly navigate this child’s condition and turmoil. She was devastated to read the above piece by Walsh – not because she disagrees with its general premise that surgery isn’t the answer but instead because she felt her stepchild was being mocked by him. I so wish people could understand this. It’s one thing to raise genuine questions about transgenderism, what happens pre or post-surgery, whether surgery is a good idea, etc. It’s another to make snide comments that only serve to make the speaker feel better, hurt the afflicted, and end genuine dialogue.

 

[qui_est_ce]

The latest photos of ‘glamorous’ Caitlin Jenner.

Funny how at 65, a transgender male to female never favour the blue rinse and frumpy clothes look (not insinuating older women should be this way ) - but it’s always to appear as much younger ‘females’, plastered in make-up, in sexual clothes i.e. a corset at 65?

Maybe someone should tell him/her, he’s fewer years left than he has already lived - before he/she will be a long time staring at the coffin lid!

*‘I’m the new normal’: Caitlyn Jenner lets the cameras in on beauty regime as she transforms from Bruce and reveals how Vanity Fair shoot was ‘best day of my life’

‘Maybe this is my greatest calling in my life,’ she says. ‘Be honest with myself, be honest with my family - maybe end up helping other people.’
She adds: ‘So many people go through life and they never deal with their own issues. How many people go through life and waste their entire life *because they never deal with themselves, who they are?’

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3109187/I-m-new-normal-Glamorous-Caitlyn-Jenner-applies-make-scenes-upcoming-documentary.html

From the article:

‘You start learning the kind of the pressure that women are under all the time about their appearance,’ she says as she applies makeup. ‘A couple of weeks ago, actually a professional came in and did my makeup. What a difference!’

We plus 60’s women should get face-lifts, dye our hair, and get professionals to do our make-up. NOT.

Talk about a mixed message.

 

[Jeanne_S]

I just watched a brief video,ofBruce Jenner 's photo shoot.He did a voice over explaining how awesome all of this is…
It actually creeped me out.As many have stated,here is a 65 year old grandpa,being dressed up and dolled up to look like a thirty something glam girl.
If he really feels the need to release his inner woman,why not do it in an age appropriate manner? This look he is sporting only adds to the sensational aspect of this whole sad drama.
I do agree also with the comments,that he is being exploited by the media,et al.

 

[Burt_Macklin]

From the article:
We plus 60’s women should get face-lifts, dye our hair, and get professionals to do our make-up. NOT.

Talk about a mixed message.

Have any of you girls ever had an experience like this?

Something isn’t right when you have a 65 year old man talking about the shared experience of being a woman. I laughed more than I should have.

 

[Havard]

Sorry – that answer’s an overly simplified over-generalization.

theblaze.com/contributions/bruce-jenner-is-not-a-woman-he-is-a-sick-and-delusional-man/

As I said earlier, this rhetoric isn’t helping. I’m part of a Catholic moms group and one of our members is a loyal, faithful Catholic whose stepdaughter has identified as transgender in the last year. This family is in agony as it attempts to thoughtfully, lovingly navigate this child’s condition and turmoil. She was devastated to read the above piece by Walsh – not because she disagrees with its general premise that surgery isn’t the answer but instead because she felt her stepchild was being mocked by him. I so wish people could understand this. It’s one thing to raise genuine questions about transgenderism, what happens pre or post-surgery, whether surgery is a good idea, etc. It’s another to make snide comments that only serve to make the speaker feel better, hurt the afflicted, and end genuine dialogue.

The rhetoric doesn’t just hurt transgender people, it hurts the speakers.

The surest way to advance the cultural shift against religion (esp. Christianity) and traditional beliefs is to play into the already growing narrative that we’re actually a bunch of hateful bigots.

 

[Jeanne_S]

The rhetoric doesn’t just hurt transgender people, it hurts the speakers.

The surest way to advance the cultural shift against religion (esp. Christianity) and traditional beliefs is to play into the already growing narrative that we’re actually a bunch of hateful bigots.

There is a fine line between sounding hateful and actually speaking up for the truth. The danger is that in our PC culture,far too many are afraid to speak the truth.Any criticism of the cultural cause of the day will result in intolerance from the very ones screaming for tolerance.

 

[ucfengr]

The rhetoric doesn’t just hurt transgender people, it hurts the speakers.

The surest way to advance the cultural shift against religion (esp. Christianity) and traditional beliefs is to play into the already growing narrative that we’re actually a bunch of hateful bigots.

The problem is that the cultural revolutionaries label anything they disagree with as “hateful”, giving people inclined to be reasonable nowhere to go.

 

[OraLabora]

There is a fine line between sounding hateful and actually speaking up for the truth. The danger is that in our PC culture,far too many are afraid to speak the truth.Any criticism of the cultural cause of the day will result in intolerance from the very ones screaming for tolerance.

The problem is that speaking the “Truth” as we know it falls on deaf ears; we are Catholics and, non-Catholics, even different Christian sects, have a different view of what is Truth than we do.

So we are sort of putting the cart before the horse.

The best way to expose someone to Truth is to evangelize them, that is win them over to Christ. And this is not alway done with words, but with our own actions not being contrary to what we say and contrary to the Gospels, especially Matthew 25 where “prisoner” can allegorically be interpreted to mean someone imprisoned by his or her passions and demons.

When we use harsh rhetoric to expose the Truth as we know it, we can have the opposite effect, that is, drive people away. We then have the loss of souls on our own conscience, and for that WE will have to atone, not the misguided person we purport to want to help.

To reach out to the lost, we must first start by meeting them where they are and upholding their dignity through kindness and non-judgmental interaction with them. We must reach them by making our faith attractive.

Eventually someone like this, a transgendered person, may realize the dead end their quest has brought them to. When that happens, we need to be there to listen with empathy. It will not be the time to say “I told you so”.

 

[Faith1960]

‘Mental’ is a broad label. There’s evidence that it’s neurological (i.e.,physical), and not just psychiatric. But there’s so much we don’t know about it.

Psychriatric problems are brain disorders, too, aka physical.

 

[gracepoole]

The rhetoric doesn’t just hurt transgender people, it hurts the speakers.

The surest way to advance the cultural shift against religion (esp. Christianity) and traditional beliefs is to play into the already growing narrative that we’re actually a bunch of hateful bigots.

I could not agree more.

There is a fine line between sounding hateful and actually speaking up for the truth. The danger is that in our PC culture,far too many are afraid to speak the truth.Any criticism of the cultural cause of the day will result in intolerance from the very ones screaming for tolerance.

The problem is that the cultural revolutionaries label anything they disagree with as “hateful”, giving people inclined to be reasonable nowhere to go.

I actually don’t think it’s that difficult. Noting the suicide rates of those post-surgery is reasonable and charitable. Likening those who go through with the surgery to antelopes, pine cones, and dinosaurs is not reasonable or charitable. I can remember the earlier comment in this thread about putting lipstick on a pig. How is that helpful? It might make people here feel better to commiserate with one another. But it does nothing to help those who are in genuine pain. And as Havard noted above, it only serves to depict Christians as bigots. I understand and appreciate the feeling that whatever one says against current trends, he or she might be painted as an ugly Christian. But God forbid this means we should actually become ugly Christians.