Calling all Americans Catholics! I have questions for you!

[demol]

Nobody said anything about equal treatment. I said going to a hospital does not equal recieving treatment. In other words, just because you go to a hospital does not mean that they are going to fix the problem. They are only required to stabalize your condition. And many times, that is all that the emergency physician can do. If you have more than a simple infection, you are told to go to your family doctor to recieve treatment for your problem. High blood pressure…stabalize it, and send to family physician. Heart pain…stabalize it and send to family physician. Only, poor people don’t have family physicians because they cannot afford to go to the doctor!

I have been refused medical attention many times!!! If I cannot get an appointment with a doctor…as advised to me by the emergency room doctor who could do nothing to treat my illness other than pain control for the MOMENT…without laying $75-$150 on his receptionists desk before he ever sees me, I am turned away. The doctor is not required to treat anyone. Just like the hospital is not required to do anything more than to stabalize.
And you are still required to pay for charity hospitals and clinics run by the state. They are not free.

You are correct. Hospital ER’s need only to stabilize a situation.
There are Hill-Burton clinics and hospitals in every state, though not in every area. They are required to provide services, even if the patient is unable to pay.

hrsa.gov/hillburton/hillburtonfacilities.htm

findahealthcenter.hrsa.gov/

 

[YADA]

Information of welfare fraud is mostly from data collected by each individual state and the effort these states place on fraud prevention, prosecution etc …

Welfare fraud is big bisness: and any and all of it take away srvices from those who should truly receive it …various links …

Chicago [and with a war on terror component] :
amren.com/mtnews/archives/2006/04/the_welfarefrau.php

MIchigan … $55 million per year …
blogpublic.lib.msu.edu/index.php?blog=5&title=welfare-fraud-iprimarily-involving-bridg&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

Los Angelas … $500 million per year:
articles.latimes.com/2006/jul/01/local/me-welfare1

Pennsyvania … $300 million per year:
pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/cityregion/s_517068.html

New York:
query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=990CE0DB1F3CF93BA3575BC0A963958260&sec=&spon=

South Florida Medicare Fraud:
miamiherald.com/428/story/627312.html

The list could go on and on …

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

In a perfect world everyone would have basic medical care, I would like to point out the fact that millions die every year from lack of basic medical care…you have no such problem.Lets say we re distribute all the money in the world to provide basic health care, fact is if we did their would be no money left over to treat patients with a poor prognosis, people who run up a million dollar bill and die anyway if we redistribute healthfunds choices like that would have to be made.Are you doing everthing you can to promote your wellness? I hope so, because that is in your best interest.What are the circumstances of of your childrens father not being able to support? that is very sad indeed.It is a cruel world full of greedy evil people who do not give a **** about other people, I truly in my heart think everyone deserves at least basic healthcare anything beyond that one has to think of the plight of others in this world and be thankful for what med treatment they receive:ehh: .We essentially have to much medical care here as compared to some poor soul in sub saharan africa ect.You really come across as having a sense of entitlement, how did you get into your situation…is it all someone elses fault? I know of so many that cannot grasp the concept of personal accountibility,when one makes a decision of their own free will they have to live with the results…no government to bail you out right? I am all for helping each other and I certainly do my part

The circumstances of no help from the father of my children are this. He was convicted of child molestation, and we can get no support from anyone in a jail cell.
The point I was trying to make with the medical system is that not everyone can afford medical attention, irregardless of what they try to do to improve their lot. Until my children are older, I am stuck in this situation. If health insurance and medical costs weren’t so phenomenally high, I would be able to afford to pay for my health care needs. I do NOT want to have the need for government intervention. I want to work. I want to pay my own bills. But with the way it is now, there is no feasable way. I detest having to go to the government. And when the medical care is available to me from a charitable organization, I would much rather take that. Then I would not have to suffer the condescension of the state.
I totally agree that even as bad as the entire healthcare system in America is today, there are so many millions of people world wide who have it so bad that I shouldn’t even open my mouth to complain.
Tell me something, though, if you are able to. Do you know or believe that the better medical help that goes out to the poorest nations in the world are more sufficient if they come from government organizations or charitable organizations? I know only what I have been told. But those charitable organizations seem to do so much more for the whole person when treating them than a government donation. Would you agree? I honestly don’t have an educated idea.

 

[estesbob]

f you think health care is expensive now wait until its free…

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

f you think health care is expensive now wait until its free…

you misunderstand me. I am not looking for government run healthcare. I think that would be totally detrimental to our entire society. Never accuse me of wanting government healthcare. I was arguing the point that the government does such a poor job with its healthcare programs that not every person who is in need is taken care of.

I am arguing that the healthcare costs all across the board right now are entirely too expensive, and poor people have no options or access to it. I think that this should change. And it has to begin with tort reform, unless someone has a better idea. I have yet to hear one though, from either rich, poor, liberal or conservative. But it isn’t expected to happen, because once again, too many hands are in the pot…to the detriment of the whole country.

I never said healthcare should be free. Except for truly extenuating circumstances, people should pay what they can for the things they get. But poor people now a days can’t even get doctors appointments.
Once upon a time, we could go to the doctor, and if the bill was high, we could pay on it every month. Now you can’t see a doctor in his office without having the whole payment given before you even see him.
The way of the world today is that people don’t see others with needs that we should take care of. It is an “every man for himself” society. Government run healthcare would only make that so much worse. People need to love and care for each other…with their time, effort, and when possible money. That would go a long way in todays society if it were more promoted, and people stopped thinking that the government had the answers to everything. I am in need at this moment for help from the government. I can tell you from experience that the government had VERY few answers.

I say “NO” to government run healthcare! Yes to “Tort” reform!!! Yes to lowering healthcare costs all the way across the board. Aspirin in a hospital doesn’t really cost more than if you buy it at a drug store. But they sure charge you more…just like a box of tissue.

 

[Lil_Cat]

You know, my husband was born in a third world country. We just wired $500 to this country to take care of his grandpa in the hospital for four months. In contrast, my husband was competing in a triathalon and got into an accident on his bike and had to go to the ER. We had a $50 co-pay and then the hospital billed us another $500 after that. All they did at the hospital was take a couple of x-rays and tell him that he needs to go to an orthopedic surgeon.

What’s wrong with this picture? We are blessed enough to be able to afford this, but I can’t imagine living paycheck to paycheck and have these bills to worry about, and in our situation, to spend 3 hours in the ER and not have anyone do anything.

I agree with the PP that government-run healthcare would be a terrible thing for this country. You should have to pay something for services, like on a sliding scale. So many poor peopple I have worked with when I was a social worker can pay for essential things but they just want to get their nails done, get their hair done, buy new cars, buy designer clothes for their kids, etc.

No, I don’t know what the answer is, but I do think there needs to be an overhaul of welfare and healthcare, but then again, I think everyone in this country can agree on that.

 

[MIZER]

Again Ribozyme, What on Earth are you talking about?

I suppose one can give them a sense of pride when they are employed. I do not think being a servant for wealthier people will be conducive to that.

I am not a wealthy person. And the person I hired to do yard work for me is not my “servant.” You have a strange world view. What century are you living in?

One should have a sense of pride when one is employed, especially whent that one worked hard and humbled himself to gain that employment. The young man who knocked on my door asking for work was very proud that he could make a darned good living doing what he was doing. I admired his character as I cannot for the life of me, understand why my friend’s son-in-law is not motivated as this young man is. The man at my door has no wife or child to support. The bum on the other hand does, and he chooses not to.

 

[stcalixtus]

I asked if you knew any specifically.

No health insurance and no health care are 2 different things.

she just does not understand.I am employed as a healthcare professional at a prominent hospital, WE TURN NO ONE AWAY especially pediatric patients no matter if they are insured or not.I see Ribozyme that you offer plenty of criticism but no solutions what do you propose we do? A Christian would want at least basic health care for everyone in this fine world of ours, basic health care means you provide at least basic service and treatment for EVERYONE and no more than that, anything beyond that would depend on the budget alloted for healtcare…so in that type of society my wife gets no radiation treatrment for her metastatic breast cancer? problem with our healtcare system are greedy doctors, attorneys, health care executives! you see some greedy SOB living up on the hill in his huge mansion…it blows me away that they are so lacking in moral values, some poor kid in africa dies from lack of basic med care…only a small amount of money could save him…it is a tradgedy and many of us should be ashamed of our lack of compassion. Fact is everyone in the USA has acces to basic med care…FLAT FACT! I see the ER full of people using this service as walkin clinic…please get real RIBOZYME present the facts and be objective.Our CEO made 750k last year…disgusting.

 

[ribozyme]

she just does not understand.I am employed as a healthcare professional at a prominent hospital, WE TURN NO ONE AWAY especially pediatric patients no matter if they are insured or not.I see Ribozyme that you offer plenty of criticism but no solutions what do you propose we do? A Christian would want at least basic health care for everyone in this fine world of ours, basic health care means you provide at least basic service and treatment for EVERYONE and no more than that, anything beyond that would depend on the budget alloted for healtcare…so in that type of society my wife gets no radiation treatrment for her metastatic breast cancer? problem with our healtcare system are greedy doctors, attorneys, health care executives! you see some greedy SOB living up on the hill in his huge mansion…it blows me away that they are so lacking in moral values, some poor kid in africa dies from lack of basic med care…only a small amount of money could save him…it is a tradgedy and many of us should be ashamed of our lack of compassion. Fact is everyone in the USA has acces to basic med care…FLAT FACT! I see the ER full of people using this service as walkin clinic…please get real RIBOZYME present the facts and be objective.Our CEO made 750k last year…disgusting.

One way to provide the resources to take care of them is to redistribute income. The United States has a gini coefficient in the mid 40s while the Northern European countries have one that is the the mid 20s.

 

[seekerz]

Nobody said they got equal treatment. The question was are people in America denied medical treatment. The answer is no.

Again, I’d say speak for yourself. People are denied medical treatment everyday in America.

Equal treatment for the same health condition regardless of ability to pay is theoretically a basic tenet of the code of health care professionals (at least those who take oaths).

Of course that was not the point Jesus N Cherie was making at all. Treatment in the emergency room is in many cases just a stop-gap measure, not definitive treatment.

I have seen enough of the more developed third world countries to know that even there, they recognize the economic value of providing free or low cost preventive health care through government clinics. You may not want to have cancer or AIDS in those countries, but attention for common medical conditions, child immunizations and and basic dental care do not cost an arm and a leg and are accessible to the majority of the population.

If poorer countries than us can do it without economic collapse, why do some think that going down that road would cause us economic disaster? The kind of care I’m referring to doesn’t have to be absolutely free, just accessible to the average low income family. It also should be comprehensive, sensible (no CAT scans for indigestion) and include as an integral component, basic health education.

 

[RobHom]

1. Yes - the fundamental difference is that even the poor who don’t earn enough to pay any tax get the same treatment as those who have money. For them it is of course free. The more well off pay for them through tax - yes. This seems fair no?

This is true and thats how the system is supposed to work.

Again, I don’t doubt the generosity of the individual in the US, or of the good work done by charities. But surely if you live in a democracy which is described by many Americans to be “the greatest in the world” then your government should be marginally representative of the people no? Or am I missing something?

No, you aren’t missing anything. Frankly…many Americans are truly sick of our government…not the form or system, but the corruptness of politicians… Elected officials in Washington for the most part only care about the “Voter” when they are “sucking up” and “baby kissing” for votes. The day after they are elected, forget you…unless you are standing there with a nice big check, or even better…untraceable cash.

Its a sad state of affairs we’re in now…

 

[stcalixtus]

The circumstances of no help from the father of my children are this. He was convicted of child molestation, and we can get no support from anyone in a jail cell.
The point I was trying to make with the medical system is that not everyone can afford medical attention, irregardless of what they try to do to improve their lot. Until my children are older, I am stuck in this situation. If health insurance and medical costs weren’t so phenomenally high, I would be able to afford to pay for my health care needs. I do NOT want to have the need for government intervention. I want to work. I want to pay my own bills. But with the way it is now, there is no feasable way. I detest having to go to the government. And when the medical care is available to me from a charitable organization, I would much rather take that. Then I would not have to suffer the condescension of the state.
I totally agree that even as bad as the entire healthcare system in America is today, there are so many millions of people world wide who have it so bad that I shouldn’t even open my mouth to complain.
Tell me something, though, if you are able to. Do you know or believe that the better medical help that goes out to the poorest nations in the world are more sufficient if they come from government organizations or charitable organizations? I know only what I have been told. But those charitable organizations seem to do so much more for the whole person when treating them than a government donation. Would you agree? I honestly don’t have an educated idea.

I truly am sorry about your situation, I do give to charity and hope I am of some help to others. My info is private donations are larger than gov donations.I work in health care and hope to volunteer someday to help out with med care. I am under the impression that government funds are difficult to get to the people in need because corrupt governments divert the funds and confiscate food ect, Doctors with out borders are more efficient as they are able to monitor supplies ect.The healthcare system in America is dysfunctional due to the usual suspects…greed and pride, all docs want to be specialist so they can ring up big bucks, hardly any med students want to be general practicioners and the ones that do are at their wits end…overwhelmed with patients Our hospital CEO make 750 last year how can this man sleep at night? I know he does not turn around give most his money to help others so many others to blame, attorneys that rack up big bucks with frivolous lawsuits and jack up malpractice insurance fees, alot of politicians are attorneys…I smell a rat lobbyist give lots of cash to pols to twist and turn legislation to the advantage of those at fault for our healtcare woes. What a web of deceit and lies…OKAY I am depressed now …bye bye.

 

[stcalixtus]

One way to provide the resources to take care of them is to redistribute income. The United States has a gini coefficient in the mid 40s while the Northern European countries have one that is the the mid 20s.

I totally agree…how many other people do you think will? anyone who would deny med treatment to some poor soul in a impoverished country is no Christian.

 

[RobHom]

One way to provide the resources to take care of them is to redistribute income. The United States has a gini coefficient in the mid 40s while the Northern European countries have one that is the the mid 20s.

“Redistribution of wealth or income” as a solution is a complete and total fallacy.

All it does is create a greater number of poor people. It serves to benefit no-one…

Count the number of Millionaires +, then count the total number of people in the US or the world… divide the income and net worth of all the rich people by the number of people receiving the redistribution… all you will do is give everyone but the Millionaires an extra $10 or $20 dollars, and created a bunch more poor people. You cannot redistribute the wealth or incomes of the top 2% and expect the welfare and comfort of the entire balance of the 98% to improve…it just doesn’t work that way.

 

[Lief_Erikson]

America donates more to worldwide relief efforts when there are catastrophes than any other nation, yet we are always scrutinized for not ‘doing enough.’ The U.S. is definitely a nation that is obsessed with money, and material things, totally agree. But, it’s also a generous nation. Where was Europe on 9/11? Where were they in support of our troops in Iraq? Where are they in helping us with our gasoline crisis?

It’s definitely easy for another country to sit back and poke at the U.S., but at the end of the day, America still soars above them all in generosity. Could we do better? Yes! But, we are not as bad as other countries would claim we are.

I love your sentiment. I have a question about the data, though.

How much do Americans tend to give as a percentage of their income, as compared with the people of other nations?

It’s easy for us to give more than any other nation, because we’re the richest nation, and one of the biggest. Jesus taught in the Scripture, though, that the poor widow who put gave two pennies to the Temple treasury had given more than all the rich men who poured out gifts from their wealth.

So I’d like to know how we’re doing in terms of giving percentage-wise. That’s the real measuring stick.

 

[RobHom]

Gee… you seem to take delectation when “inferior” people do menial tasks for the “superior” people who are economically well off.

What he stated had nothing to do with that… you missed the point altogether. What he was talking about was the fact that some people aren’t willing to get off their “duffs” and earn their keep while leaching off of others, whereas others…regardless of post or prior affluence or lack thereof place the welfare of their families above their pride and will do anything to keep home and family sound and fed. I agree with the poster… Laziness is not obsolete.

 

[RobHom]

Rebuilding New Orleans is more sane than you will ever be. I am proud to call New Orleans my home. No matter what you say New Orleans is irreplaceable. It is a city of great culture and life. It is home to the first Catholic Cathedral in the Americas, it is home to many great people. It has left it’s mark so big on history it is ranked up there with Rome. (although not as old) It has a great ethnic blend being that it was home to Africans, Mexicans, French, and Acadians. It is the birthplace of Jazz and creol food. Besides the small towns of Acadiana it is the sole source of culture for a state far more rich in culture than others. Louisiana is a great state and it cannot be replaced. If New Orleans should go down, I shall go down with it. I hope that I have made my point clear as day. Oh, and as for Katrina it is just another trial that was sent to us to test our faith and culture.

I hope you plan on being a “Jesuit”…with a short fuse like that. My comments about NO were fair. Regardless of its history, etc. I have nothing against NO. Granted, there are good restaurants, history, music, good people, and culture there… but it also has its problems… Like corrupt and stupid politicians, that along with the boneheads at the Corps of Engineers did not make sure the levees and all the pumps were working and in great shape. When will the people of NO and LA clean that mess up? (referring to crooked politicians and inept ones as well)

Were I you, I would be praying daily that NO be spared from another Katrina…especially considering the complete destruction of many of the lower barrier islands at the mouth of the Mississippi River that blocked water movement…and other physical features that reduced storm surge. Current reports of terrain changes in the lower Mississippi River Delta give a forecast of bad news if even a Hurricane of 3 or 4 shows up.

I truly hope that you do not get hit again. We got hit by Charley as I live right where he came ashore as a 4. Not pretty, not good, and some of our people are still trying to recover from it, though not on the scale of NO…

 

[Sheeniac]

So what could one person accomplish with charity if their last name isn’t Soros, Gates, or Buffett? Charity will only make me feel inadequate to deal with the enormous scale of the world’s problems.

Well, any individual could go to modestneeds.org/ and make a HUGE difference in another person’s life!

I just joined up after reading about it in Forbes.

No single person can change the world, but you can make a difference in several lives.

 

[RedSoxFan]

One thing that has always seemed strange to me is how dog-eat-dog life seems to be in the US, compared to the rest of the developed world.

From an outsider’s perspective, it seems to be that USA doesn’t have the same attitudes as the rest of the developed Christian world when it comes to looking after its own citizens. Something which I thought would have been a fairly Christian thing to do.

There was absolute shock in Europe as to how badly things went after hurricane Katrina. That sheer poverty in which people lived, and the fact that it was majority poor blacks that were left homeless was also widely reported. “Why don’t they look after their own people?”…is what many in Europe were saying.

• Things like public health care (completely free), and an essentially free university education as standard in pretty much all of Europe. It’s not seen as something “given to us”, but more as “a right”. And yet in the US this is unlikely to happen.

People seem obsessed with paying too much tax, and how much it is all going to cost, how it may affect the economy.

And I often read posts here on the Catholic answers forum where people seem petrified that somebody else may get something for nothing, without “working for it”.

I have two questions:

1. Why is America like this?
2. How do Catholic Americans feel about how the average American citizen is looked after when things don’t go so well (those who are broke, sick, unemployed etc).

1. Americans are among the most giving people on earth. The thing that most foreigners don’t realize is that we have no trust in the government to do anything right. For instance I could get taxed $1 and maybe $.10 might get to the charity, or I could just give the charity $1 and not contribute to government corruption and waste. Bottom line it’s our money and we want to decide how to spend it and not let the government rule our lives.
2. There are plenty of chances for the down and out to turn around, because they’re are plenty of good people in America as there is in the rest of the world to help them out. I feel that we take care of our own well enough. We teach them self reliance.

RSF

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

Well, any individual could go to modestneeds.org/ and make a HUGE difference in another person’s life!

I just joined up after reading about it in Forbes.

No single person can change the world, but you can make a difference in several lives.

thank you for the website. As soon as I am able to go to work after my operation on August 20th, I plan to contribute to an honest charity. This website may help me to do that. Thanks again.