Can a marriage survive this?

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. Having just come back from my prayer group I strongly believe the Holy Spirit guided me here.
To Rascal:
Three years ago I found myself in your shoes. I found out my husband had cheated ( still hurts even today to say those words) I understand completely what you are going through and God Bless you for honoring your marriage vows and remaining commited to your wife and family. The best advice I can give you is to PRAY PRAY PRAY and enlist your closest friends who share your faith to pray for you and for the conversion of your wife -when you are too tired, too weak, or too angry to pray for yourself. Its only with the grace of God that I was able to forgive my husband and move forward towards healing our marriage. Our marriage was in serious trouble before he cheated (we have a mentally ill son who was going thru a very difficult time.) There are always underlying problems related to affairs. Affairs dont involve love - despite what the involved perceive - they are usually band-aids people use to cover up deep wounds. Dont focus on the other man- think of him as a dirty bandaid. Focus on your prayer life go to mass. Make it clear to your wife that you r trying to forgive her but that trust is earned. there should be NO secrets btw a husband and wife and the highest levels of intimacy are btw the two of you alone. That being said - let her know that for your peace of mind you will continue to check phone records, voicemails, emails, etc. with the continued hope that she will live up to her promise to remain faithful to you in every sense of the word- it will take years to accomplish trust - she will have to bear with you- it is a natural consequence for what she has done. Its her character and integrity that also needs rebuilding and strengthening - this doesnt happen over night and she may not realize or be ready to deal with how deeply she has hurt you and herself on so many levels. Be patient!! You are both in need of spiritual and emotional healing. My husband and I attended the Retrouvaille weekend and program (my husband was reluctant to go - but I would not allow him back into my life unless he agreed to go) It is not a miracle cure but you and your wife will discover hope and healing in your marriage. God Bless you - my prayers are with you.
 
Rascal, you haven’t posted in a while. Are you okay? Even if there are no changes…how are you doing?
 
I wanted to add
On your list of things to do to move forward:😉
  1. each of you should recieve counseling separately and together.
  2. attend retrouvaille weekend and follow-ups
  3. continue to pray, go to mass, read your bible, receive sacraments
    4.be patient - there are no quick fixes or overnight healings…its a few steps forward sometimes a couple steps backwards …pray and move forward
  4. have fun time - just the two of you ( be careful of drinking too much alcohol- i have found that drinking while still very hurt, vulnerable and angry leads to explosive arguing and setbacks
  5. insist on absolutely NO communication with the other party.
  6. tell your wife you love her - she needs to hear it.
  7. Pray for her conversion to God
  8. Don’t beat yourself up
  9. when the devil puts thoughts in your head and reminds you of all the hurtful things your wife did and said - tell the devil to go to hell and pray that your healed marriage does honor to God
 
HopeintheSpirit said:
I wanted to add
On your list of things to do to move forward:😉
  1. each of you should recieve counseling separately and together.
  2. attend retrouvaille weekend and follow-ups
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Very unlikely to happen. Even though I think it would be good for us in the long run even outside of what happened.
HopeintheSpirit said:
  1. continue to pray, go to mass, read your bible, receive sacraments
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I do. I wish she would join me.
HopeintheSpirit said:
4.be patient - there are no quick fixes or overnight healings…its a few steps forward sometimes a couple steps backwards …pray and move forward
5. have fun time - just the two of you ( be careful of drinking too much alcohol- i have found that drinking while still very hurt, vulnerable and angry leads to explosive arguing and setbacks
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This is where we are right now. I’m trying to be patient. Trying to spend time together having fun. Getting the “us” back.
HopeintheSpirit said:
  1. insist on absolutely NO communication with the other party.
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I’ve told her this a thousand times. She says she won’t talk to him any more, but she’s promised that a thousand times too. She’ll still see him at work…probably even tonight.
HopeintheSpirit said:
  1. tell your wife you love her - she needs to hear it.
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Every day, a thousand times a day.
HopeintheSpirit said:
  1. Pray for her conversion to God
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Every chance I get.
HopeintheSpirit said:
  1. Don’t beat yourself up
  2. when the devil puts thoughts in your head and reminds you of all the hurtful things your wife did and said - tell the devil to go to hell and pray that your healed marriage does honor to God
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I don’t beat myself up. But I DO get very angry when I think about it. I still have questions that I have no answers to, and I want them. I don’t know if I’ll ever get them.

I haven’t been posting anything in awhile, because I’m just trying to see what happens next. We had the big discussion and everything just over 2 weeks ago. To the best of my knowlege, she hasn’t called him again. (I KNOW she hasn’t emailed him. That’s one of the EASY things to track.) I’m waiting on the phone bills to see if she’s called him. I suppose I’ll check those forever. I know she still has secrets from me. I don’t know what those are. (That’s why they’re called secrets.) I need to ask more questions. I wish she didn’t work with him anymore, she knows this, but is unwilling to change jobs. From what I’ve been told, at work they work in different departments and only really are in contact with each other in passing. But, I can’t say that I completely believe that. The hard thing about this is, that things between US have been better than they’ve been in a long time…unless she’s lying to me, or hiding what’s really going on inside. I’ll never know that, it seems. She never lets anyone inside. Ever. I still wish she’d go to confession. She tells me she “talks to God every day”. But, she doesn’t want me to confront her with things. She doesn’t want to feel like I’m forcing faith and beliefs on her. She says she “knows what she needs to do, but it’s hard”.

I did say a silent prayer thanking God for the blizzard this weekend. She was unable to go in to work on Saturday, the time when they work together for the longest period of time.

I’m kind of in limbo. A “wait-and-see” mode right now. Things are good between us, I’m just waiting to see what happens next. Whether it’s a good thing or a bad thing. I can’t change her, I can only change me. I’m just plain sick and tired of being angry all the time.

Thanks for all your concern and prayers, it means a lot to me.
 
I don’t have time to read this entire thread but I got a few pages in and it seems the OP believes this is merely an “emotional affair”. I highly doubt that if she is saying she loves him, it has gotten physical and you should accept that. If you both get counseling it will all come out there anyway.
  1. It is impossible for your wife to continue working with a man she sys she loves other than you. She quits and finds new employment or the marriage will not last.
  2. A marriage can survive anything.
  3. Your wife is toying and playing games with you, you don’t want to lose her but unfortunately you don’t get to make that decision. You should seperate and see what your wife does, not divorce but let her get hit with the reality of you gone it may snap her out of it or she may breath a huge sigh of relief you’re gone either way a decision is made. She can go either way but in the end it’s her decision and nothing you can do is going to change that while she is in the throws of an affair and in love with another man. If you stay the status quo she will keep lying and meeting this guy especially if she works with him it won’t stop.
 
Rascal:

Please be aware of the “false recovery.” This happens when you think you are making progress but the wayward spouse is NOT COMMITTED to no contact. Basically, they can have their cake and eat it too.

However, real recovery cannot take place in this fantasy world.

It could be that the relationship just went “underground.”

I am not trying to discourage you, because there is still hope, but you have to have your hope grounded in reality. I strongly recommend a pro-marriage counselor, one who is familiar with “marriage builder” principles.

Best wishes,

Scott
 
Hi Rascal,

Have been praying for you. Tough love has its purpose in these cases. You can still love your wife and be commited to your marriage while instituting some ground rules for her to follow if she wants to remain married to you. While she is making some effort her heart still isnt 100% committed to saving your marriage. I experienced this as well with my husband initially - (You can lead a horse to the well but you cant make him drink) But also keep in mind that when you personally become stronger in your prayer life you receive graces that get you thru the difficult times.

Your wife commited a grave offense against your marriage and you have the absolute right to insist on several things for your own peace of mind and for the sake of your marriage.

INSIST that she EITHER transfer to a new job site or get a new job. I believe you stated in an earlier post that she has this option. If she’s seeing him at work they r communicating.

INSIST that you both go talk to a priest you are comfortable talking to.

CONTACT your local catholic social agency for a catholic counselor.

INSIST on a retrouvaille weekend. This will be a turning point for both of you! I cant stress this enough! even if there is yelling screaming etc. on the drive down to the weekend get there and work the program - you will hear from other couples who’ve walked in your shoes and whose marriages have been healed and thriving!!! You will also have lots of alone time to dedicate to each other!

If your wife doesnt agree to the above then you are within your rights to ask for a separation until she is ready to sincerely DEMONSTRATE her committment to your marriage. While you are apart continue to pray, get counseling for yourself, talk to a priest and put your wife in God’s hand. Dont give up hope God can work miracles!!! My husband and I are living proof but you have to be strong and you are stronger than you think!!!

God bless you!
 
So sorry to hear this. I will pray that your wife will choose her marriage, husband and children over the boyfriend and job.
 
Rascal, I left my husband who was abusive and an alcoholic. I spent literally my whole adult life trying to help him change, praying for a miracle. Finally I opened up about this in confession and my priest told me that I needed to set a deadline, where I would stop waiting for things to change. He gave me 6 month. I never would have had the determination to make this scary change if I didn’t have that deadline, and if I hadn’t promised God that I would act to enforce it.

Right now you want your wife to choose you, to choose her marriage, to choose her family. Your wife is saying that she doesn’t have to though. She can keep on seeing him, at least at work, and keep on avoiding the real issue which she has admitted to you exists. The real issue is the one that keeps her from being open and makes her unwilling to go to any sort of counseling.

So, you need to decide how long you are willing to stay out there in the desert, in the no man’s land where every one loses. As the leader in your family, maybe you need to hold your wife accountable for the vows that she made to you and to God. Do you think a deadline might be a good idea? You don’t have to even necessarily tell her that you have one. Just keep trying to convince her to get to counseling and quit her job, knowing that at some point inaction on her part will lead to action on your part.
 
Hi Rascal,

You and your wife are still in my prayers.

Right now, understandably, you’re unable to trust her. You can’t trust that she isn’t communicating with Mr. Other. She hasn’t given you a reason to trust her on that.

I would think about a “deadline” as dulcissima suggested…a deadline for her to transfer or find another job away from Mr. Other. The reason is not (only) that you think she might be seeing him there. The real reason is that, every time she goes to work now, you are eating your heart out with fear, suspicion, and jealousy. All well founded, btw.

How can love and reconciliation thrive in such conditions? Wethere she sees that guy at work or not, you suspect she does, as any reasonable person would! And those negative feelings are blocking the good stuff and really hurting your chances at fixing this.

Sure, maybe it’s not FAIR that she quit her job. But it’s what needs to happen if she’s serious about her marriage.
 
All of what you all said is true, which is why she says she doesn’t want to talk to anyone in counseling. She says she “knows that they’re just going to blame her, it’s all her fault”. That they’re “not going to tell her anything she doesn’t already know”.
 
RascalJones said:
All of what you all said is true, which is why she says she doesn’t want to talk to anyone in counseling. She says she “knows that they’re just going to blame her, it’s all her fault”. That they’re “not going to tell her anything she doesn’t already know”.
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The reason my ex told me he wouldn’t go to counseling was because he didn’t want “everything to be his fault”, which my priest pointed out that indicated that he knew that was the case. Even though for me the counseling wasn’t about blaming someone, I guess the thought of having to be accountable for his own failures was too scary to him. For some people they will focus all of their life energy into blaming others, because they can’t bear to face what is inside of them. That’s the real reason that my marriage was impossible from day one and never had a chance, because I was married to someone who was incapable of actually working on problem areas, who wanted nothing more than to stay in a broken pattern that harmed our whole family. There really was no chance to even make it work.
 
RascalJones said:
All of what you all said is true, which is why she says she doesn’t want to talk to anyone in counseling. She says she “knows that they’re just going to blame her, it’s all her fault”. That they’re “not going to tell her anything she doesn’t already know”.
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Maybe at the first meeting there will be some “fault” talk, but probably not much if you see a good counselor. The counselor’s job is to get your two moving on a plan to fix stuff, not spend hour after hour throwing blame.

She’s afraid of facing her own guilt and facing the stuff in her past that she really doesn’t want to have to think about. COnseling is NOT fun, it is work, but I’d say you get 10x back what you put into it.

“not going to tell her anything she doesn’t already know”…I’m sorry, and don’t say these words to her, but that’s a cop out. If she knew everything, she wouldn’t have gotten involved in the EA to begin with.

We ALL have issues that a counselor could help us with! Shoot, I’ve seen a counselor for the last 18 months. It has done nothing but good in my life. It can be scary, but the good things usually are at first.

A good counselor is not judgemental. Maybe you could make a deal with her…to check out a counselor, and if the counselor gets judgemental (beyond, say, asking her to admit something that is true, but taking the next step into “that was bad! you are wrong!!!”), then the two of you will have agreed beforehand to find another counselor. 🤷

I’ve seen three different counselors and none of them made me feel “blamed” for anything. They WILL help you admit your weaknesses. But they’re not making money by going around blaming people for everyday failures. That would be counter-productive.
 
Rascal:

No wayward spouse wants to attend counseling while still in the wayward spouse mentality because they are going to be held accountable, which they don’t want to do.

In order to get her to go, you may want to try focusing on a way to move the relationship forward and rebuild a team, rather than the focus on one person’s failures.

The bottom line is that we all fail, sometimes bigger than others. Part of being a responsible adult is to recognize when you need outside help to make things right.

The fact that one of the partners wants to see a counselor and the other one doesn’t is enough to indicate a problem. If both parties were on board with doing whatever it takes to work, no one would deny something so simple as seeing a counselor.
 
dulcissima said:
The reason my ex told me he wouldn’t go to counseling was because he didn’t want “everything to be his fault”, which my priest pointed out that indicated that he knew that was the case. Even though for me the counseling wasn’t about blaming someone, I guess the thought of having to be accountable for his own failures was too scary to him. For some people they will focus all of their life energy into blaming others, because they can’t bear to face what is inside of them. That’s the real reason that my marriage was impossible from day one and never had a chance, because I was married to someone who was incapable of actually working on problem areas, who wanted nothing more than to stay in a broken pattern that harmed our whole family. There really was no chance to even make it work.
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Dulcissima, you must be my long lost twin. 😛

THe fault and blame thing, you’re absolutely right. Your ex and Rascal’s wife are revealing the same thing…I know I’ve done something “wrong” and if we go talk to a nuetral third party, I will have to listen to them say I did it, and they might even “make” me admit I was wrong!

The very few things my ex admitted to, he eventually claimed I or the counselor “made” him admit. Did someone hold a gun to his head when I wasn’t looking?

It’s a sign of not wanting to deal with your past, I think. You know things are not right but you just “soldier on” because intropection is too painful. And so you end up blaming others for all your problems instead of the real source…yourself.

I dealt with a person this week with the same problems. Who knows what the real source of it is, but she gets abusively angry with almost everyone. Then goes around blaming the victims of her anger for angering her. Hmmmmm.

Lots of prayers, Rascal. And maybe get a referral for a good counselor from a trusted friend and try to talk your wife into just 2 or 3 meetings?
 
ACCEPT NO EXCUSES - Counseling isnt about blaming its about learning how to fix whats broken. Otherwise, we keep making the same mistakes over and over without knowing or understanding why or how to fix the messes we get ourselves into. Right now - its not important that she doesnt want to go - she just has to go on a regular basis as a good faith effort to save her marriage and family.

Respectfully, You may need to file for legal separation while she is contemplating whether or not she wants to 100% commit to your marriage and make arrangements for how you want to handle the care of the kids - they are going to need counseling. This might help her take off her rose colored glasses and face reality.

Focus on God, your kids, and yourself, continue to pray for her but let her go… until she is willing to committ fully to the healing of your marriage.
 
You all make great points. And I AM listening. And, I know you’re right. It would just mean SO MUCH TO ME, if SHE would make a move without me poking a stick at her to get her to move.

The bottom line is the kids. I don’t want to hurt them.

I hate this point in my life. All I want to do is honor my marriage vows, love my wife and raise my kids. I don’t have time for this chaos.
 
RascalJones said:
All of what you all said is true, which is why she says she doesn’t want to talk to anyone in counseling. She says she “knows that they’re just going to blame her, it’s all her fault”. That they’re “not going to tell her anything she doesn’t already know”.
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Try telling her this:

An affair destroys the health of a marriage in the same way that cancer destroys the health of a person. Chemotherapy is usually the initial treatment for people with cancer - no one wants to go thru chemotherapy its painful but necessary for survival or the patient dies-- Same is true for counseling its painful at times but a necessary beginning for the survival of a marriage that is unhealthy and in danger of dying.

God Bless
 
RascalJones said:
You all make great points. And I AM listening. And, I know you’re right. It would just mean SO MUCH TO ME, if SHE would make a move without me poking a stick at her to get her to move.

The bottom line is the kids. I don’t want to hurt them.

I hate this point in my life. All I want to do is honor my marriage vows, love my wife and raise my kids. I don’t have time for this chaos.
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You are doing all of the above but you dont have to be subjected to this kind of emotional abuse. I totally understand what u r going thru, but right now she doesnt appear to be afraid of losing you -despite putting you and your kids thru so much pain and chaos. Separating DOES NOT MEAN that you are giving up - you are giving her the opportunity to understand what it will be like without you and your family intact. You havent broken your vows and shouldnt during the separation. Legal Separation with the hope of reconciliation. (If you r the one to leave -Check with a lawyer about not leaving your home without filing for legal separation and a custody agreement - to protect your relationship with your kids as seen by the courts.) Get counseliing for you and the kids.
Pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet. My prayers are with you.
 
RascalJones said:
I hate this point in my life. All I want to do is honor my marriage vows, love my wife and raise my kids. I don’t have time for this chaos.
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My heart goes out to you, Rascal, and I don’t mean this to be harsh, but: You MUST make time for this chaos if you want to be married. This chaos is life, like it or not. Just as she must suck it up and seek help, so must you make time for the icky stuff you didn’t plan for.

You have every right to say the things you’re saying, and every right to throw a tantrum or punch things or scream. But action is the only way to create change.

Also, I really understand when you say you’d like her to take action without prompting. I do…I was there once. But, not to lessen her responsibility in this, but I’m not sure she is CAPABLE of that right now. It sounds like she might really have some childhood issues that are paralizing her. I’m NOT saying she’s mentally ill, but if you can think of any issues she might have as a virus…they have a hold of her. Would you expect a sick person to be able to self-diagnose and cure themselves? No. Any issues she has do not want to come into the light of God’s grace on their own…they want to fester and stay in the dark so they can continue to live. Her past has a hold on her, clearly, or she would not have done a self-destructive thing like an EA. She’s not a bad person…she is being manipulated by feelings she does not understand.

This might just be the time when she is helpless and needs you to do what’s best for her.
 
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