Can atheists do "good?"

[_AnnoDomini]

ahh, I just meant that that’s the traditional Catholic belief from what I understand!

 

[meltzerboy2]

I’m not even so sure that it is Catholic teaching.

 

[Zaccheus]

Fair enough.

 

[Freddy]

Why is the word good in scare quotes?

 

[_AnnoDomini]

It’s just because I was trying to emphasize that I was asking about “good” as a more tangible/objective idea, rather than a hazy feeling

 

[sealabeag]

Short answer: Yes.

Longer answer from the Catechism that may help as it touches in these issues:

"Outside the Church there is no salvation"

[846] How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336

847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:

Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.337

[848] "Although in ways known to himself God can lead those who, through no fault of their own, are ignorant of the Gospel, to that faith without which it is impossible to please him, the Church still has the obligation and also the sacred right to evangelize all men."338

 

[TominAdelaide]

Fr Ludwig Ott in his work “Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma” also discusses this question. He holds the same position as Fr Hardon that only good works performed by a person in the state of grace will merit a supernatural reward:

“The meriting person must be … in the state of grace (in statu gratiae), as far as merit properly so-called (meritum de condigno) is concerned. The teaching of the Council of Trent on merit refers exclusively to the just. (DH 1576, 1582)” (page 286).

However, he also notes that morally good acts performed by a person not in the state of grace are not sins (although they are without a supernatural reward) (pg 251):

a) Even in the fallen state, man can, by his natural intellectual power, know religious and moral truths. [De fide.]

b) For the performance of a morally good action sanctifying grace is not required. [De fide.]

Although the sinner does not possess the grace of justification, he can still perform morally good actions and, with the help of actual grace, even supernaturally good (though not meritorious) works, and through them prepare himself for justification. Thus all works of the person in mortal sin are not sins. The Council of Trent declared: “If anyone says that all works performed before justification, no matter how they were performed, are truly sins or deserve God’s hatred … let him be anathema.” (DH 1557; cf. 1935, 1940, 2449)

c) the grace of faith is not necessary for the performance of a morally good action. [Sent. certa.]

Even infidels can do morally good works. Thus not all works of infidels are sins.

d) actual grace is not necessary for the performance of a morally good action. [Sent. certa.]

Fallen man can perform good works without the help of divine grace, by his natural powers alone. Therefore not all works which are achieved without actual grace are sin. Pope St. Pius V condemned the following proposition of Baius: “Without the help of God’s grace, free will can do nothing but sin.” (DH 1927; cf 1937, 2439)

(His work has the nihil obstat and imprimatur.)

 

[TominAdelaide]

Fr Callan and Fr McHugh in their work “Moral Theology” state that God will reward morally good acts performed by a person not in the state of grace with temporal blessings (but not with supernatural blessings) (their work has the nihil obstat and imprimatur):

According to the difference of the object of the reward, there are two kinds of merit: (a) natural merit, which makes one worthy of a reward that does not exceed the native powers or exigencies of a created being, such as success, prosperity, or other goods that do not constitute the Last End of man (see 20). Thus, we read in scripture of pagans or sinners who were blest with temporal happiness on account of their natural virtues; (b) supernatural merit, which makes one worthy of the beatitude surpassing mere created power that God has prepared for those who serve Him (see 20). It is only this kind of merit that is being considered here; for, since the Last End of man is a supernatural reward (viz, the Beatific Vision of God), it follows that the acts by which he tends to that End must be not only human and moral, but supernaturally meritorious.

Their work is available for free here:

Moral Theology by Charles J. Callan and John A. McHugh | Project Gutenberg

 

[Genesis315]

How do you know that “doing good by itself won’t save a person’s soul” without faith? How can ANYONE know that?

Because it is revealed by God, so we can have the certainty of faith that it is true. The Scripture’s say “without faith it is impossible to please God” and this was confirmed by the whole Church–to whom Christ promised the unfailing help of the Holy Spirit to lead her into all truth–at the Councils of Trent, and Vatican I, among other places:

CCC 161 (referencing these Councils)

“Since “without faith it is impossible to please [God]” and to attain to the fellowship of his sons, therefore without faith no one has ever attained justification, nor will anyone obtain eternal life ‘But he who endures to the end.’”

That being said, doing good can precede and lead to that necessary faith (the idea that faith must be the first grace or that faith is necessary to do good are errors of Protestants and Jansenists that have been definitively condemned by the Church). Against Protestants who said the existence of non-believers meant the means of salvation was not offered to all, St. Robert Bellarmine replied:

De Gratis et Libero Arbitrio, lib. 2, cap. 8

This argument only proves that not all people receive the help they need to believe and be converted immediately. It does not, however, prove that some people are deprived, absolutely speaking, of sufficient help for salvation. For the pagans to whom the Gospel has not yet been preached, can know from His creatures that God exists; then they can be stimulated by God, through His prevenient grace, to believe in God, that He exists and that He is the rewarder of those who seek Him: and from such faith, they can be inspired, under the guidance and help of God, to pray and give alms and in this way obtain from God a still greater light of faith, which God will communicate to them, either by Himself or through angels or through men.

Pope Francis put it this way:

Lumen Fidei

Because faith is a way, it also has to do with the lives of those men and women who, though not believers, nonetheless desire to believe and continue to seek. To the extent that they are sincerely open to love and set out with whatever light they can find, they are already, even without knowing it, on the path leading to faith…Anyone who sets off on the path of doing good to others is already drawing near to God, is already sustained by his help, for it is characteristic of the divine light to brighten our eyes whenever we walk towards the fullness of love.

 

[Erundil]

have more pure motives than believers.

But expectation of getting into heaven by doing deeds of love is good. Even LORD Himself says this: “But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven” [Matthew 6:20]

Looks like soon there will be narrative that those who want to enter Heavenly Kingdom are selfish, smh.

 

[CelticWarlord]

it’s certainly very possible for atheists to be good people

Father Mitch Pacwa has said that some of the finest biblical scholars he knows are atheists. An advantage to this is they are far less likely to allow dogma to enter or influence the study of ancient manuscripts.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I don’t think God cares about these long theological treatises. He only cares what’s in a person’s heart. If the theologian is genuinely trying to use his gifts for God’s glory, fine, it may enrich our knowledge and understanding and show that theologian is a good servant. But God doesn’t use the theology book as his manual for saving people or not.

Jesus said we should become like little children. It is not necessary to plow through heavy duty theology that a child might well not understand, in order to know that he wants us to do good deeds, regardless of what belief or doubt we may have regarding the existence of God.

 

[meltzerboy2]

Very Jewish in your thinking here.

 

[sonofbarry]

The atheists of my acquaintance are fine people, no different from any others. They have firm moral values and do good whenever they can. . . .

 

[Tis_Bearself]

They may not assess their actions as a moral issue at all, neither good or bad.

I think most normal people in society, whether they believe in God or not, have some internal barometer of “good” and “evil” rooted in instinct and natural law.

 

[NoelFitz]

Atheists can be saved through the Baptism of Desire.

Strictly speaking only a person in the state of grace can merit, as defined by the Church (Denzinger 1576, 1582).

I learned that without grace one cannot do anything meritorious. One also cannot gain grace if one is not baptized.
Atheists who do good acts may have baptism of desire and hence be in the state of grace and can do, with God’s grace, meritorious acts.

Is this what the Church teaches?

 

[Dan_Defender]

To the OP: yes they can. Whether they are saved or not, I do not know and leave it up to God. St Augustine had a pessimistic view on their salvation.

 

[FiveLinden]

A believer might do a good work with at least a partial self-interested motive of benefiting himself/ earning merit or salvation from doing it. An atheist might do the same good work with no expectation of getting any benefit except maybe the good feeling that comes from helping another. Therefore, the atheist might actually be the more selfless here.

A charitable thought about us. But I think many atheists (well me, anyway) tend to think of ourselves as part of a society or collective and identify our personal interests with the group. Because we don’t have an idea of individual salvation we stress the ‘common good’ as we see it. I am not sure we are being ‘selfless’ but rather recognising the social nature of human beings. I know many religious people act in this way also and many of us are happy to work with religious people on joint projects.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

That’s a charitable way of being inclusive.
Because the “common good” is for everyone including, often, future generations, I don’t see preserving it as a particularly self-centered act. But that’s just me.

 

[TominAdelaide]

Atheists who do good acts may have baptism of desire and hence be in the state of grace and can do, with God’s grace, meritorious acts.

Is this what the Church teaches?

You raise an interesting question, the same question could be asked whether the good works performed by catechumens enrolled in the RCIA prior to their baptism at the Easter Vigil are meritorious too? I’m not 100% sure of the answer, although Jimmy Akin in his essay on the “baptism of desire” (Baptism of Desire | Catholic Answers) says that “the state of grace, can be effected through the desire for baptism” and that the “desire for baptism brings justification and justification makes one an heir of life everlasting. If one dies in a state of justification, one will inherit eternal life. Those who die with baptism of desire are saved. Period.”

The Catechism of the Catholic Church also discusses the theological implications of the “baptism of desire” (although it doesn’t specifically refer to the question of whether the good works performed by a person with a desire for baptism prior to their baptism are meritorious):

1259 For catechumens who die before their Baptism, their explicit desire to receive it, together with repentance for their sins, and charity, assures them the salvation that they were not able to receive through the sacrament.

1260 "Since Christ died for all, and since all men are in fact called to one and the same destiny, which is divine, we must hold that the Holy Spirit offers to all the possibility of being made partakers, in a way known to God, of the Paschal mystery."63 Every man who is ignorant of the Gospel of Christ and of his Church, but seeks the truth and does the will of God in accordance with his understanding of it, can be saved. It may be supposed that such persons would have desired Baptism explicitly if they had known its necessity.

Note
63. GS 22 § 5; cf. LG 16; AG 7.

Fr Hardon also refers to the “baptism of desire” and the related theological implications in his “Catholic Dictionary” (the work has the nihil obstat and imprimatur):

BAPTISM OF DESIRE. The equivalent of sacramental baptism of water, which in God’s Providence is sufficient to enable a person to obtain the state of grace and to save his or her soul. According to the Church’s teaching, “Those who through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or His Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do His will as they know it through the dictate of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation” (Second Vatical Council, Constitution on the Church, I, 16).

continued….